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Speakers & Surround Sound A place to learn more about speakers, their functionality and how they can complement your entertainment experience.

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Does surround sound actually work?

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Old 07-22-2014, 02:24 PM   #46  
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Originally Posted by ImRizzo View Post
Your wasting your time .......anything and everything already expressed has fallen on Deaf Ears .
C'mon now, don't get your panties in a twist because you don't understand how sound works...
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Old 07-22-2014, 02:24 PM   #47  
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It's not about where the sound is actually coming from, its about re-creating the illusion that the sound is coming from around us as if we were at the film set. This is what we call a sound stage.
With surround sound IT IS ABOUT WHERE THE SOUNDS ARE ACTUALL COMING FROM as no stereo signal can re-create that. Even surround sound isn't 100% accurate but more accurate than stereo and greater than the localization specificity of our auditory system
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Old 07-22-2014, 02:28 PM   #48  
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Yes but HOW they vibrate the eardrums is dependent upon the strength and direction of the sound waves as they strike the ear. There is no way for a speaker located in front of you to produce a sound located behind you. Different waves (sounds) striking the ear from different directions causes different stimulation. Also Doppler effect will allow the brain to determine if the sounds are getting closer or farther away.

Your ears are just the collection point but sounds eminate in a 360 radius and by placing speakers or speaker arrays all around you , one is better able to simulate or recreate these different sound fields.

You keep getting caught up with 2 ears and stereo - that doesn't matter. Somebody who is totally deaf in one ear would still benefit from surround sound as each ear individually determines WHERE a sound is coming from. By using two ears we get the expanded spatial simulation.
I do agree with some of what you have said though, speakers places all around you may be able to simulate the environment better because its more 'similar' to a real world environment. Maybe we have some special bone behind our ears that vibrate in a way that lets us know sound is behind us that you cannot simulate with headphones, maybe we dont, thats why i'm here, i want somebody to confirm any statement with some actual science. Yes a deaf person would still be able to localise souns with one ear, but only through room reverb, put them in an anechoic and they would be screwed.
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Old 07-22-2014, 02:33 PM   #49  
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With surround sound IT IS ABOUT WHERE THE SOUNDS ARE ACTUALL COMING FROM as no stereo signal can re-create that. Even surround sound isn't 100% accurate but more accurate than stereo and greater than the localization specificity of our auditory system
Think of it this way, all the sounds that come from all the directions in SS eventually get down-mixed at the ears, it has to be this way, there is no other way for the sound to get inside of us for the brain to hear. For example, a sound is created behind the left ear, it has to travel through the skin so gets attenuated, and some frequencies will be lost, this is one way we know the sound is behind us. But if you were to place a microphone at the position of that ear, and record the same sound, so the mic would hear it as our ears do. This could then be played back through headphones and it would sound like the sound is coming from behind you.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IUDTlvagjJA
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Old 07-22-2014, 02:35 PM   #50  
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Yawn.
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Old 07-22-2014, 02:36 PM   #51  
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With surround sound IT IS ABOUT WHERE THE SOUNDS ARE ACTUALL COMING FROM as no stereo signal can re-create that. Even surround sound isn't 100% accurate but more accurate than stereo and greater than the localization specificity of our auditory system
Tell me scientifically why it matters where the sounds are coming from? The ear couldn't give a flying fcuk where the sounds originated from, all they care about is...all they know about is what the sounds sound like when they hit the ear drum. Which can be re-created with headphones
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Old 07-22-2014, 02:40 PM   #52  
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Just stumbled on this, you guys should take a look, you might learn something.

http://www.dansdata.com/spkvshead.htm

Finally, someone with some sense.
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Old 07-22-2014, 03:02 PM   #53  
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I have come to the conclusion, and i'm sure you will all agree, that the purpose of surround sound, is to provide a sound stage to numerous people at once. Although it may not be as good as stereo headphones, we can't expect the theaters to go giving everybody a set of headphones. Surround sound is a way to save money. It was intended for theater use, where theater means a place where lots of people will be listening to the same soundstage. Therefore, home theater entertainment systems such as surround sound, are only useful if you have an actual home theater, again, theater meaning lots of people listening to the same soundstage. If your just watching the movie by yourself, may aswell just wear some good heaphones. If you find headphones are too uncomfortable, then buy better ones.
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Old 07-22-2014, 04:10 PM   #54  
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Funny how you didn't mention the few words before your above quote, let me write them for you:

"into two encoded channels that deliver the spatial properties of the original audio."
Wow. I wrote:
"...encoding 5.1 into stereo channels that deliver the spatial properties of the original audio."
Sorry for saying stereo instead of two channel. How misleading of me!

At any rate, I give up. The OP clearly loves his stereo headphones and has no interest in discussing how the brain processes sound and why multiple speakers may provide a different experience from his headphones.
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Old 07-22-2014, 05:10 PM   #55  
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Wow. I wrote:
"...encoding 5.1 into stereo channels that deliver the spatial properties of the original audio."
Sorry for saying stereo instead of two channel. How misleading of me!

At any rate, I give up. The OP clearly loves his stereo headphones and has no interest in discussing how the brain processes sound and why multiple speakers may provide a different experience from his headphones.
As I stated any and all responses are falling on DEAF ears, so responding to OP's posting are senseless.
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Old 07-22-2014, 06:26 PM   #56  
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Wow. I wrote:
"...encoding 5.1 into stereo channels that deliver the spatial properties of the original audio."
Sorry for saying stereo instead of two channel. How misleading of me!

At any rate, I give up. The OP clearly loves his stereo headphones and has no interest in discussing how the brain processes sound and why multiple speakers may provide a different experience from his headphones.
My bad, I misread your post, I do agree with everything you said, but I still feel like my question is being avoided. In your post, it seems as though you agreed with the fact that stereo headphones can indeed provide the spatial properties of SS. Although stereo speakers at the front cannot, which I also agree with, but my concerns really are geared toward headphones.
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Old 07-22-2014, 06:28 PM   #57  
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Originally Posted by ImRizzo View Post
As I stated any and all responses are falling on DEAF ears, so responding to OP's posting are senseless.
Hey man, just because you don't understand something it doesnt mean have to post silly things like that. I think you are the one with deaf ears, have you taken anything in at all? Did you read up on anything, can you back any of your statements up with fact?
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Old 07-22-2014, 06:37 PM   #58  
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...you seem to be fixated on the fact that we have two ears.
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Originally Posted by jkkyler View Post
You keep getting caught up with 2 ears and stereo - that doesn't matter.
It does matter, for example we have two eyes, when watching a 3D movie they show us two images, one for the right eye and one for the left. If those images were to get mixed up a little, the image wouldn't be as good. Headphones are designed to feed one audio stream to one ear, and the other to the other ear, by using SS you are mixing the streams up, some left goes in the right and vice versa.
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Old 07-22-2014, 07:07 PM   #59  
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Originally Posted by shnabz View Post
My bad, I misread your post, I do agree with everything you said, but I still feel like my question is being avoided. In your post, it seems as though you agreed with the fact that stereo headphones can indeed provide the spatial properties of SS. Although stereo speakers at the front cannot, which I also agree with, but my concerns really are geared toward headphones.
Glad we cleared up stereo vs. 2 channel.

My post was in reference to Dolby Headphone, which tries to duplicate the same sort of of multidimensional audio cues that one gets with surround sound speakers. In other words, headphone designers are looking for ways to improve upon traditional stereo processing. It would appear they think there's more to this than two ears means two channels is sufficient.

At the end of the day, you acknowledged that surround sound speakers provide a different experience than stereo speakers, which raises two questions.

1. How can that be if the fact that we have two ears means two channels is as good as it gets?

2. If more speakers makes for different sound, then how can the same stereo mix match the surround experience just because it's played through headphones? Sounds like magic to me.

Last edited by BIslander; 07-22-2014 at 07:11 PM..
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Old 07-23-2014, 06:46 AM   #60  
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First of all, I am a big headphone guy - have multiple pairs of high end headphones (willing to bet on a whole different level than what the op is using) to include heavily modded orthodynamic/orthostatic as well as traditional.

Typically I use these

https://mrspeakers.com/mrspeakers-alpha-dog-headphones/
http://hometheaterreview.com/mrspeak...ar-headphones/
or these
http://north-america.beyerdynamic.co...t-990-pro.html
with a dedicated pre-amp and tube amp setup

so I am very familiar with headphones and they simply are not the same as traditional SS set-ups. First of all SPL vary greatly. By moving or adjusting headphones even a few millimeters on the ears you can radically change the sound. Properties such as soundstage, localization, Bass levels are dramatically affected as a result. Also the size of the drivers on headphones makes it very difficult to accurately reproduce low frequencies as they simply can not move enogh air.

Here is another (and the main reason) that surround sound systems differ from headphones. As distance from the origination of the sound to the listener's ears increases the properties of the sound waves change both in intensity and frequency (a small part of the doppler effect). Headphones have no way to account for this. Surround sounds set-ups have adjustable delays to account for the distances and positioning of speakers. Speakers 5 ft from a listening position have a different setting than ones 20 ft away etc. Headphones have no way to account for this as they have no way to determine the distance from a listener that a sound originated so they do the best they can to approximate what it would be like at the listening plane. If hearing strictly digital it would be different but sound waves are analog and overlap adding and subtracting to wave propagation based on distance from point source. Once again these are things headphones can't accurately reproduce or account for. As you go up in Headphone quality the approximation can get better but never exact. This is one of the reasons that when you wear headphones the sound often seems as if it is originating inside your head even with directional clues.
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