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Old 12-10-2009, 01:34 AM   #16  
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It seems like you can always get the cherry finish cheaper, which is kinda funny to me because I think they are much nicer looking.
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Old 12-10-2009, 04:49 AM   #17  
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Go with the 70's! Also, I believe the Denon 1910 do NOT have pre-outs. If this is true, you are robbing yourself of the opportunity to add more power to them without having to sell the unit. If you get an AVR with pre-outs, you can add an amp to power one, two, or all of your speakers. The monitor 70's come alive with a good amount of clean power, and I think you should consider looking at a different AVR IF it does not have pre-outs.
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Old 12-10-2009, 09:34 AM   #18  
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Quote:
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Go with the 70's! Also, I believe the Denon 1910 do NOT have pre-outs. If this is true, you are robbing yourself of the opportunity to add more power to them without having to sell the unit. If you get an AVR with pre-outs, you can add an amp to power one, two, or all of your speakers. The monitor 70's come alive with a good amount of clean power, and I think you should consider looking at a different AVR IF it does not have pre-outs.
I don't intend to add a amp.
What I'm trying to do is the bi-wiring ability that both the monitor 70's and the Denon 790 have.

Does anyone know if bi-wiring effects the resistance?


About the polk setup , I want the monitor 40's as the rear speakers , but I also want to wall mount them. Hoping I can find/make some kind of stronger wall mount , as I think the regular ones won't be able to support them. Might have to downgrade to the 30's.

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Old 12-10-2009, 10:18 AM   #19  
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I believe you are referring to "bi-amping" ....not bi wiring (which does absolutely nothing). If you use 12 or 14 gauge wire...there is no reason to bi-wire.

Some folks claim that bi-amping adds a little more dynamics to certain speakers by giving a steadier supply to each of the drivers (low and high freq.). It doesn't make complete use of the exta channels rated wattage, in other words you won't "double" the power to your mains. It doesn't make the amp/receiver any more effecient either. I've never seen any huge benefit to doing this, myself. A good set of loudspeakers should be well balanced either way...that's why some speaker companies like Focal/JM Lab don't even bother with the extra posts for bi-amping.

I'm not saying not to do it. If you have a 7.1 receiver with re-assignable rear channels and are only running a 5.1 configuration...by all means, go for it. You may hear some difference, just don't expect a huge improvement.
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:07 PM   #20  
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Here's what I think I am going to get

Denon AVR-790 or Onkyo SR607
Polk Audio Monitor 70's
Polk Audio CS2
Monitor 40's for the rears
PSW505
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Old 12-10-2009, 12:27 PM   #21  
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gamebred View Post
I believe you are referring to "bi-amping" ....not bi wiring (which does absolutely nothing). If you use 12 or 14 gauge wire...there is no reason to bi-wire.

Some folks claim that bi-amping adds a little more dynamics to certain speakers by giving a steadier supply to each of the drivers (low and high freq.). It doesn't make complete use of the exta channels rated wattage, in other words you won't "double" the power to your mains. It doesn't make the amp/receiver any more effecient either. I've never seen any huge benefit to doing this, myself. A good set of loudspeakers should be well balanced either way...that's why some speaker companies like Focal/JM Lab don't even bother with the extra posts for bi-amping.

I'm not saying not to do it. If you have a 7.1 receiver with re-assignable rear channels and are only running a 5.1 configuration...by all means, go for it. You may hear some difference, just don't expect a huge improvement.
I have found bi-wiring to be quite effective in certain circumstances, with certain equipment.
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Old 12-10-2009, 02:29 PM   #22  
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http://audiokarma.org/forums/showpos...9&postcount=83

"The late Peter Snell was an early bi-wire fan, and later recanted saying it was ‘baloney’. Many TOP speaker companies now either don’t offer the ‘dual’ terminals at all or do so only for bi-amping purposes. Many speak openly about its detrimental effects.

Bi-amping is not to be confused with bi-wiring - they are totally different animals. Bi-amping can lower IM distortion in the critical mid range frequencies and to which the ear is most sensitive, as Paul Klipsch and others have demonstrated over many years. You also get about 4dB more headroom, which can subjectively increase the perceived dynamic range.]

The law of superposition (the basis for why your speaker can reproduce a complex series of wavelengths simultaneously) states that any two voltages applied to a linear network (in this case, your crossover) will have the same voltage transfer as if they were applied separately. Simply stated, it says that any two currents applied simultaneously to a linear network result in the same current as when applied individually. If the crossover is poorly isolated (bass to Mid/treble) no manner of cable TWEAKING will correct it. Regarding the cable theorists (suppliers?) claim that running bass and treble frequencies protects the delicate trebles from the mean bass currents is sheer nonsense, and shows a complete lack of knowledge of the principles of electro-magnetism that govern signal transfer of audio frequencies over short distances. It is invented for you to buy- wire and not based in science / engineering.

As I have said repeatedly here previously there have been some situations where bi-wring may have compensated for a poorly designed crossover network, but that does not make the principle valid. Poor crossover design is quite common unfortunately."

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Old 12-10-2009, 02:39 PM   #23  
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I continue to bi-amp my speaker systems when the option is availlable as it truly has advantages that can be heard in subjective A/B comparisons.

I have been doing this for over 40 years.
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Old 12-10-2009, 02:47 PM   #24  
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1. Bi-amping does work; bi wiring does not
2. OP: check this out to step out of the box
http://www.orbaudio.com/
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Old 12-10-2009, 02:50 PM   #25  
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Quote:
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1. Bi-amping does work; bi wiring does not
]
According to you and who else. As I said when subjectively tested there can be a difference, in particular with bi-amping, bi-wiring, not so much. Whether you believe it or not is a entirely different thing.
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Old 12-10-2009, 02:51 PM   #26  
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Sure, it may work, but I'm not sure you would get much benefit being powered by the Onkyo 607 or Denon 1610.
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Old 12-10-2009, 02:58 PM   #27  
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According to you and who else. As I said when subjectively tested there can be a difference, in particular with bi-amping, bi-wiring, not so much. Whether you believe it or not is a entirely different thing.
In particular, as you put it, bi amping DOES work. As a retired audio engineer, I have, with others, conducted lots of tests with bi wiring. As another poster said, it MAY make up slightly for a cheap crossover, but at general consumer SPL, it does nothing. It was and still is a gimmick.
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Old 12-10-2009, 06:27 PM   #28  
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Quote:
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It was and still is a gimmick.
I'll have to agree here. I think people often confuse passive bi-wiring with bi-amping.

Of course the best way to do bi-amp is with external amps dedicated to both the high and low pass, each with thier own designated frequency ranges that can be dialed in with an external crossover. This is neither cheap or easy to set up but the results can be easily heard by anyone, making it non-subjective. You can even tri-wire some speakers. This is the ideal way to bi-amp.

Like I said earlier, it can make a difference using your rear channels on a mid to high grade receiver but it's not going to be a major difference as some may claim. This can be subjective because some have said they've heard a big difference whereas others, myself included, have only noticed a slight change.

This is one of the reasons I bought a receiver that had pre/pros for each channel. It already has a pretty decent D-class amplifier in it (ICE) but it can't do nearly what seperates can. Sure, I'll re-assign my rear channels until I get a multi-channel amp because those rear channels aren't being used anyway. It surely doesn't hurt anything. I wouldn't worry as much about buying a 7.1 receiver to use for bi-amping your mains as I would getting a receiver that has pre/pro outs. JMO.
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Old 12-10-2009, 06:47 PM   #29  
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A home amplifier is going to add too much cost to the system. I might consider it later , after I've had awhile to hear it without amplification.

What I am reading on now is wether to stick with the PSW505 Polk sub or get a PA120.
They are both in the same price range. Thoughts?
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Old 12-10-2009, 07:42 PM   #30  
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I am a polk lover but would never buy one of their subs. I dont know much about the other sub that you posted, but in this price range IMO there is only one way to go. http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/produc...Subwoofer.html

To me these infinity subs compete with other that cost twice as much. At a $250 price point you will not find a sub that has 300watts rms.
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