High Def Forum - Your High Definition Community & High Definition Resource

Go Back   High Def Forum - Your High Definition Community & High Definition Resource >
Rules HDTV Forum Gallery LINK TO US! RSS - High Def Forum AddThis Feed Button AddThis Social Bookmark Button Groups

Rear-Projection TVs CRT, DLP, LCD, LCOS

Whats the big deal about the HDMI no accepting 1080p naturally?

Reply
AddThis Social Bookmark Button
 
Thread Tools
Old 11-22-2005, 01:35 AM   #1  
How can anyone watch standard def?
Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 22
Talking Whats the big deal about the HDMI no accepting 1080p naturally?

After reading through all the different posts, everyone keeps mentioning that in the Sony, Mitsu, Sammy and Toshiba 1080p models that the HDMI ports don't accept 1080p w.out up-converting it. Is this a big deal? When the ps3 comes out and it sends the signal of 1080p, won't it still be the same picture at 1080p once it is upconverted? 1080p is 1080p right?
1080jeff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2005, 02:01 PM   #2  
High Definition is the definition of life.
 

Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Charlotte, NC
Age: 37
Posts: 211
Default No

1080P is not 1080P. A 1080i signal converted to 1080i will have the same amount of detail but will not be near as smooth as a direct 1080P source would be. The tv has to convert the 1080i signal with its internal processor and then show the picture as progressive which is where the lag effect or blockiness of fast moving sceens are shown. Though there seems to be no 1080P source in the future for quite a while, I wouldn't worry about holding out for a tv with a 1080P input.
CC TV GUY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2005, 07:23 PM   #3  
How can anyone watch standard def?
Thread Starter
 

Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 22
Default

Which 1080p models have the best upconversion?
1080jeff is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2005, 08:11 PM   #4  
How can anyone watch standard def?
 

Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 26
Default

Is it a fact that the Playstation 3 will have 1080P output? thats prolly still 6-8 months away (at best??)
mu5a5hi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2005, 10:37 PM   #5  
High Definition is the definition of life.
 

Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pensacola, Fl
Posts: 712
Default

sony bragged that it would have TWO 1080p outputs when they did the unveiling show or whatever that was. they would be able to run simultaneously, to be used in versus playing, as a heads up display, or to sit side by side and provide a 32:9 image.
My question is: will this require the displays to be the same resolution? scaling to two different resolutions would be pretty hard cpu wise, and also how many of us have two HDtvs with the same rez? Mine are 720p and 768p.

of course, this is all marketing hype and bragging until it actually ships.

I think they overreached by promising it would be blueraydisc, and it seems like it will be delayed for quite some time.

If it does ship being able to do 1080p, a tv that can accept that directly will be better.
rudyusmc1980 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-22-2005, 11:23 PM   #6  
High Definition is the definition of life.
 
bboncorr's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 4,467
Default

sony overhypes everything they put out. remember the psx fiasco. sony promised a 24x dvd writer just before the launch date. then it shipped with a 12x. sony promised 250 and 500gb hard drives installed in the 2 models for the psx. then they shipped with 160 and 250gbs. i hope the ps3 is 1080p but you just cant trust sony. remember they said the ps3 would be out this spring. well now all the developers are saying not likely. there isnt enough time for the games. plus remember japan get theres 3-6 months before us. if japan gets theres next spring well get ours next fall. sony already said they will not follow microsoft with there launch everywhere as soon as possiable strategy.
bboncorr is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2005, 01:16 PM   #7  
My plasma is High Def.
 

Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 6
Default HP has 1080P Input and will work with PS3

I'm in the market! HP has 1080P Input!!

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

For the past few months, I've been researching the new "1080P" sets. My basement will be finished in two to three weeks so I've been hitting the different shops to see how they compare. First of all,
I HAD been sold on the Pro Series JVC sets and still am to a degree.
I've only been able to see the 720p sets. What a picture! Although
the blacks may be a little soft, the depth of field on the picture and it's overall brightness is AWESOME. Best Buy has the sets currently on sale. Best Buy also had the new Sony 1080P sets in. I couldn't notice a difference. In all honesty, the JVC was better. Better brightness and the depth of field. However, I should preface by saying that the footage presented on both sets was the normal HD display footage. NO fast moving footage.

The Problem with both sets and also the SAMSUNG, MITSUBISHI and TOSHIBA sets are that none of them have 1080P input eventhough they are "1080P" sets. What's the big deal with that? Well HD DVD and/or Blu Ray DVD will output 1080p. You won't be able to hook these machines to these new 1080P sets be able to experience true 1080P resolution.

I did more research and have found that HP does make a TV that has 1080P input. Although it is a DLP set (I prefer the HD-ILA LCos by JVC overall), this HP set is very nice. Much nicer than the more expensive Samsung. The cable hook up is in the front of the set inside an ingenius fold down access door. I also like the screen better. Both Mitsubishi and Samsung use a glossy "anti glare" screen which absolutely sucks. There is glare everywhere. Coming from
HP, there is a PC input and a USB input also on the TV. At Crutchfield, where I saw the 65" version, they had it hooked up to a harddrive that was broadcasting in 1080P and it was stunning. No rainbow effect. I had them take it off the Hard Drive and go to Direct TV's HD format and the screen was much nicer than the Toshiba or Samsung. Now of course that could be the actual settings on the tv, but the HP was in a light filled room versus the simulated living room setting they had the Samsung in and the HP blew it away. I've got 3 weeks and am hoping to see the JVC....BUT if you're going to buy a "1080P" set, it would be downright stupid not to buy a set that has the ability to have 1080P input and I have no idea why manufacturers are building these sets without this input...It's almost false advertising as far as I am concerned.
jeffsstv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2005, 01:28 PM   #8  
High Definition is the definition of life.
 

Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Pensacola, Fl
Posts: 712
Default

it's not false advertising, it's preying on the ill-informed.

just be aware, you didn't see the rainbow, but someone else in your family/friends might. it is something that you get used to though. two of my friends initially saw the rainbow, but now they don't.

the current dlp 1080p tvs use a 'wobulation' technique to achieve 1080p cheaper. it is suspected to increase eyestrain. you should read up on it and make sure you are comfortable with it. each mirror has to do TWO pixels, and there is still a color wheel.
current lcd and lcos designs are 1080p with three chips.

as for the jvc being brighter, and therefore better, you should read up on ISF calibration. just cuz it's bright doesn't mean it's the best picture. my set is 720p, but 1080p is definitely better, and most tv is 1080i. so a 1080p set does the conversion better.
rudyusmc1980 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2005, 01:45 PM   #9  
My plasma is High Def.
 

Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 6
Default Good info but still you need 1080P INPUT

Quote:
Originally Posted by rudyusmc1980
as for the jvc being brighter, and therefore better, you should read up on ISF calibration. just cuz it's bright doesn't mean it's the best picture. my set is 720p, but 1080p is definitely better, and most tv is 1080i. so a 1080p set does the conversion better.

I took it for granted that they would be able to hook up to a HD DVD and/or Blu Ray next year...the truth is, they won't...That's why the HP has caught my eye.
jeffsstv is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-23-2005, 06:20 PM   #10  
Administrator
 
rbinck's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 16,974
Default New Television Size?

Quote:
Originally Posted by PM from jeffsstv
Hello,
I've noticed your input on the High Def Forum and you have a straight forward approach.

I am in the market for a new High Def TV. I currently have a early Toshiba Cinema Series
43AX60. I think it is an earlier version of DLP without HD. So, naturally I am excited to get a HD set. I've seen the 720P sets and now some of the 1080P sets. I love the 720P version of the JVC HD ILA LCos. Beautiful picture. I am excited to see the 1080P Pro series. For some reason, they don't seem to be out yet.

I've asked salesman questions and seem to get a different answer everytime. I am concerned with quite a few things:

1. Does size matter? By this I mean, in my basement I will be able to sit back between 10 and 12 feet from the set. I am concerned about Pixel Particles when viewing non HD programming. Sure, I'll have DireTV Sat HD, but does that mean CNN, Fox News, Nick, Disney, etc are broadcast in HD? If not, then won't I have to watch this programming in SD and then if so, the bigger the picture the worse the picture? If I go JVC or with HP's DLP what size TV would you suggest?

2. I love the JVC picture, but it does not have 1080P input. So next year, when BluRay and/or HD DVD comes to market I won't be able to take advantage of this new technology.
HP does offer input now but I prefer JVC. What is your take on this tech dilemma?

Those are my two biggest concerns.
Thanks for your help.
1. Yes size will matter, but only you can determine this. There are rules of thumb of 2x the width and such, but you want to be far enough away so you don't see the individual pixels. Obviously for any given size TV, the pixel size will be smaller on a set that is 1920x1080 vs. a set that is 1280x720.

2. I was under the impression that the 1080p JVC sets would input a 1080p/60fps signal. That really would not matter a lot as even with the new players that might output 1080p/60fps signal, the movies on the DVD will still only be 1080p/24fps. Even if you input to the TV 1080i/30fps the set will deinterlace the signal to 1080p/30fps which is still better temporal resolution than the movie. Only computers and gameboxes will matter for the 1080p/60fps input.
rbinck is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-24-2005, 11:43 AM   #11  
Sammy DLP
 

Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: North Arlington, New Jersey
Age: 61
Posts: 306
Default

The HP sets are nice but I would give a word of caution.
If you check out The AVS forum as people are now starting to "own" them , their seems to be the same themes of complaints {I would guess the percentage is small and similar to the other manufacturers } of issues , smudges on the screen, loud fan noise etc. etc. The problem is I do not believe HP has the service support available that a Samung, Sony, Mits etc, have, nor do they have the stock of replacement parts the other manufacturers have. So if you are one of the unlucky ones to have a problem with your set, the waiting time for repair could be long. Just something elese to consider.
Darrylhifi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2005, 09:47 AM   #12  
Administrator
 
rbinck's Avatar
 

Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: Katy, Texas
Posts: 16,974
Default PM from jeffsstv RE: Message 10 this thread

Quote:
Thanks for the answers but I still have one MAJOR Concern:

I agree that I can go supersize with my TV (perhaps up to 70"). However, I am concerned about something that I don't really understand:

I assume that the larger screen tv will be fine at 10 to 12 feet in HD. I will be subscribing to DirecTV HD programming. It lists perhaps 10 channels that are broadcast in HD. What about the other 140 channels? I imagine the side bars will come up to put the image in its native aspect ratio BUT will the image be worse than my current non HD 42" screen? Will it appear
all pixelated or will look similar (or better) than what I have now. For instance, if you take a photograph and blow it up to 8x10 it is not as clear as it's original output.
Does this make sense?
Thanks,
Jeff
You can expect the SD image to be worse than your 42" screen for the reasons you talked about, but also due to the magnification of compression artifacts on the larger screen. For essays on artifacts that show up on HDTV big screens, take a look at these:
Poor SD On HDTVs
HDTV Pictures
HDTV Artifacts

Also I'll say this. The SD image quality varies greatly between different Directv receivers. The Sony and Zenith receivers are the best I have seen. HD TiVo is not as good on SD and the SD TiVo is pretty bad, although the newest SD TiVo is much better than the older versions.

Last edited by rbinck; 11-30-2005 at 05:31 PM..
rbinck is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Go Back   High Def Forum - Your High Definition Community & High Definition Resource >
AddThis Social Bookmark Button
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:35 PM.



Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2004 - 2018, MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands