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Can A Antenna Be Too Strong?

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Old 07-27-2018, 06:00 AM   #1
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Default Can A Antenna Be Too Strong?

I live 16-20 miles from most of my stations. I replaced a old yagi VHF/UHF antenna with a CM4228HD antenna. The CM4228HD picks up the channels but the closest station keeps getting signal drop-outs. I then replaced the CM4228HD with a Antennas Direct 91XG and more stations are getting signal drop-outs. Should I get a antenna that is not as directional? If I turn the antenna a different direction to stations 50 miles away I can pick them up with no drop-outs.
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Old 07-27-2018, 06:32 AM   #2
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It would great if you could provide a report and which channels are problematic. Thanks.

Use this:
http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opti...pper&Itemid=29
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Old 07-27-2018, 07:00 AM   #3
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Originally Posted by InYourEyes2 View Post
It would great if you could provide a report and which channels are problematic. Thanks.

Use this:
http://www.tvfool.com/index.php?opti...pper&Itemid=29
http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...90380dc2a5686e
WLNS 36 & WKAR 40 - Both strong signals with drop-outs
WXYZ 41 & WTVS 43 - Both distant with very few drop-outs
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Old 07-27-2018, 07:16 AM   #4
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You should look into a rotor.
Try to attenuate the signal to determine if the signal is too strong.

Where is your antenna located (roof, attic)?
Anything blocking line of sight to towers?
Preamps, splitters in line?
RG6 from antenna to tuner?
How long of a cable run?
Why did you replace the old VHF/UHF yagi?
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Old 07-27-2018, 07:53 AM   #5
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Hello there

Last edited by Hdb91xg; 07-30-2018 at 08:15 AM..
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Old 07-27-2018, 08:14 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redmed View Post
I live 16-20 miles from most of my stations. I replaced a old yagi VHF/UHF antenna with a CM4228HD antenna. The CM4228HD picks up the channels but the closest station keeps getting signal drop-outs. I then replaced the CM4228HD with a Antennas Direct 91XG and more stations are getting signal drop-outs. Should I get a antenna that is not as directional? If I turn the antenna a different direction to stations 50 miles away I can pick them up with no drop-outs.
Sounds like overload to me. Are you using a preamp?
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Old 07-27-2018, 10:14 AM   #7
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Sounds like signal bounce, if the stations are real close in they could be bouncing off something, the bounced signal will be out of phase from the main signal, this will cause a drop in signal or a complete loss of signal.

Take a look on Google Earth and see whats out in front or to the side of you, a large hill, lake, large building or open field could cause the signal to bounce, what ever it is could be off to one side and cause the bounce.

Also the antennas your using have some very high gain, this can cause them to pick up the bounced signals along with the main signals, I would go with a smaller antenna as you don't need that much gain in the system.

One test to see if it is a bounce problem is to point the antenna skyward, this would eliminate a ground bounce, or even point it away from the main signals.

In all I would go with a smaller antenna with less gain to it.
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Old 07-27-2018, 11:08 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by InYourEyes2 View Post
Try to attenuate the signal to determine if the signal is too strong.
What do yo mean attenuate the signal? Turn the antenna to get the signal more off the side rather than pointed right at the station? I have tried going off the main signal some but may try to use the side more.
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Old 07-27-2018, 11:17 AM   #9
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https://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?p=att-1
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Old 07-27-2018, 12:16 PM   #10
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I have a antenna mounted about 8 foot above the roof on each end of the house. Each antenna has a rotor. I have been using these two antennas to feed 4 signals to a dedicated laptop running Windows Media Center. Each antenna is connected to a HdHomerun (HDHR4-2us) tuner, providing two signals (tuners) to the laptop. This provides me with 4 tuners. Each antenna is connected to a HDHR4-2us providing two tuners from that antenna. That allows me to point one antenna to the SE and pickup two signals from the Detroit TV stations. The other antenna is pointed to the West picking up two signals from Lansing stations. Iím also picking up side signals from the North (Saginaw) and SSE.

For the last 8-12 years the Antennas Direct 91XG antenna has been pointed to the SE picking up Detroit stations. I have been very impressed by this antenna.

The other HdHomerun (HDHR4-2us) tuner was originally fed by a Yagi UHF/VHF antenna in the attic pointed to the west picking up Lansing stations. I later upgraded the attic Yagi UHF/VHF antenna with a CM4228HD antenna. Later I moved the CM4228HD to a outside rotor mount. This worked pretty well for 3 years until last year when I started having a few drop-outs problems. This caused me to replace the CM4228HD with (a clone of the Antennas Direct 91XG) a Xtreme Signal HDB91X thinking it would pull the Lansing signals as good or better than the Antennas Direct 91XG pulls the Detroit signals. The Xtreme Signal HDB91X right off the bat got more drop-outs from the Lansing signals than the CM4228HD. Thinking I got a bad antenna I pointed the Xtreme Signal HDB91X to the SE and it picked up the Detroit stations just as well as the Antennas Direct 91XG antenna! I then turned the Antennas Direct 91XG antenna to the west and it is getting drop-outs from Lansing stations just like the Xtreme Signal HDB91X.

Signal bounce? Now that I think of it about the time the drop-outs started to get bad a new cell tower was built one mile to the west of me. Could a cell tower one mile away cause these drop-outs? If so should I get a weaker antenna? Which one?
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Old 07-27-2018, 12:20 PM   #11
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Thanks, I'm going to stop at Solid Signal tomorrow and pick up one of these.
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Old 07-27-2018, 12:24 PM   #12
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Another thought. I might try putting the CM4228HD back in the attic and see if it works better than being outside.
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Old 07-27-2018, 12:53 PM   #13
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Good luck.
I've looked at your threads/posts from ~3 years ago.

IMHO, you're trying to get the best of all worlds with a Rube Goldberg setup.

Use the K.I.S.S principle.

I'm outta this one.
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Old 07-27-2018, 02:09 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Terryl3 View Post
Sounds like signal bounce, if the stations are real close in they could be bouncing off something, the bounced signal will be out of phase from the main signal, this will cause a drop in signal or a complete loss of signal.

Take a look on Google Earth and see whats out in front or to the side of you, a large hill, lake, large building or open field could cause the signal to bounce, what ever it is could be off to one side and cause the bounce.

Also the antennas your using have some very high gain, this can cause them to pick up the bounced signals along with the main signals, I would go with a smaller antenna as you don't need that much gain in the system.

One test to see if it is a bounce problem is to point the antenna skyward, this would eliminate a ground bounce, or even point it away from the main signals.

In all I would go with a smaller antenna with less gain to it.
Since Solid Signal is closed Saturday (I'm close enough to drive there)
I'm going to turn the Lansing antenna 180 degrees and see how stable the signal is this weekend off the back end. If not I'll try to turn the signal down with a antenuator I will get Monday.
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Old 07-27-2018, 02:13 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Redmed View Post
What do yo mean attenuate the signal? Turn the antenna to get the signal more off the side rather than pointed right at the station? I have tried going off the main signal some but may try to use the side more.
No, don't turn the antenna away from WLNS to make it weaker. For the best quality signal, keep the antenna aimed at WLNS and insert the attenuator in the coax before the tuner to make it less strong but maintain the signal quality. Turning the antenna away from WLNS introduces multipath reflections, AKA "signals bouncing around."



Quote:
Originally Posted by Redmed View Post
Another thought. I might try putting the CM4228HD back in the attic and see if it works better than being outside.
Putting the 4228HD in the attic improved the reception because the attic attenuated the signal. HDHR tuners tend to overload easily. Using two HDHRs for two antennas aimed in different directions is a good solution, but you must give the HDHRs signals that they can tolerate.

WLNS has a Noise Margin of 64.9 dB. If you add the antenna gain of say at least 12 dB, that gives you 76.9 dB, which is clearly overload territory.



Interpreting Noise Margin in the TV Fool Report

http://www.aa6g.org/DTV/Reception/tvfool_nm.html
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Last edited by rabbit73; 07-27-2018 at 02:30 PM..
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