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Old 05-31-2012, 04:55 PM   #3061  
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If Adam's account is correct that Warner finally decided to go Blu-ray exclusive the night before the announcement, I seriously doubt anybody was scheming the timing of it, on such short notice, to make Toshiba look bad. Why would Warner want to do that anyway?
My gut tells me if Warner was going to finally pick a side they wanted the war to end quickly. They wanted HDDVD to go away as quickly as possible. I think that's why it was done that way.

All this is why I laugh at some of the fools who think there was never a chance for HDDVD. I think the chance went back and forth several times during the war for both sides. Warner was the deciding factor and they twisted Fox into making their decision. Haha these BR fanboys come off so foolish acting like they were so right with their decision. It's embarrassing.
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Old 05-31-2012, 05:44 PM   #3062  
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My gut tells me if Warner was going to finally pick a side they wanted the war to end quickly. They wanted HDDVD to go away as quickly as possible. I think that's why it was done that way.

All this is why I laugh at some of the fools who think there was never a chance for HDDVD. I think the chance went back and forth several times during the war for both sides. Warner was the deciding factor and they twisted Fox into making their decision. Haha these BR fanboys come off so foolish acting like they were so right with their decision. It's embarrassing.
You're probably right, if they're gonna stick you with the knife, they may as well twist it just to make sure. At least Warner had the class though to continue to release on the format for several more months after they made the decision. That's why I thought they wouldn't do Toshiba that way at CES on purpose...
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Old 05-31-2012, 06:36 PM   #3063  
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My gut tells me if Warner was going to finally pick a side they wanted the war to end quickly. They wanted HDDVD to go away as quickly as possible. I think that's why it was done that way.

All this is why I laugh at some of the fools who think there was never a chance for HDDVD. I think the chance went back and forth several times during the war for both sides. Warner was the deciding factor and they twisted Fox into making their decision. Haha these BR fanboys come off so foolish acting like they were so right with their decision. It's embarrassing.
There was never a chance Warner would pick HDDVD. They just had to look at the HMM pie charts
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Old 05-31-2012, 06:48 PM   #3064  
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You're probably right, if they're gonna stick you with the knife, they may as well twist it just to make sure. At least Warner had the class though to continue to release on the format for several more months after they made the decision. That's why I thought they wouldn't do Toshiba that way at CES on purpose...
They were contractually obligated to do so.

I thought in retrospect Warner made the right decision although it sure was a punch in the gut and hurt like hell at the time.

I also thought all the former HD DVD studios and even Toshiba and their retail partners did the right thing to help ease the pain for HD DVD owners and help ease the transition to Blu-ray for HD DVD supporters including trade ins and HD DVD to Blu-ray upgrade programs.

Last edited by Kosty; 05-31-2012 at 07:06 PM..
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Old 05-31-2012, 06:54 PM   #3065  
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My gut tells me if Warner was going to finally pick a side they wanted the war to end quickly. They wanted HDDVD to go away as quickly as possible. I think that's why it was done that way.

All this is why I laugh at some of the fools who think there was never a chance for HDDVD. I think the chance went back and forth several times during the war for both sides. Warner was the deciding factor and they twisted Fox into making their decision. Haha these BR fanboys come off so foolish acting like they were so right with their decision. It's embarrassing.
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You're probably right, if they're gonna stick you with the knife, they may as well twist it just to make sure. ...
There is no doubt in my mind that the Warner decision and the timing of it being announced before CES was intended to kill off HD DVD as a viable format and to end the format war as soon as possible before 4Q 2008 and the first major holiday season for Blu-ray.

Jodi Sally from Toshiba was burning up the phones all week with Circuit City and Best Buy and Walmart to avoid getting product returns and authorizing price reductions as a last ditch effort to keep HD DVD alive but the Netflix and Walmart support decisions a little bit later was the killing blow for HD DVD.

Pretty much when Circuit City switched its point of sale shelf tags for HD DVD players to call them upconverting DVD players that also played HD DVD it was all over.

I also thought Toshiba pulling the plug when it did was pretty noble and classy as well as it allowed the industry to consolidate and have a coordinated message in time for 4Q 2008. They could have let HD DVD linger on as they had some legal rights to force support from the studios for HD DVD for a while longer but they let them go after it became clear it was a lost cause. Plus they supported with firmware HD DVD players for a long time even releasing final versions when they did not have too IIRC.

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Old 05-31-2012, 07:05 PM   #3066  
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There was never a chance Warner would pick HDDVD. They just had to look at the HMM pie charts
Those pie charts were showing percentages but Warner knew both HD DVD and Blu-ray actual unit volumes and actual revenues were pitifully small compared to DVD in 2006 and 2007.

Units sold per title advantage actually was going to HD DVD but Blu-ray had more studios and more titles released.

The joint Warner Blu-ray and HD DVD titles for the most part were essentially even with both having from their perspective small numbers.

HD DVD still was getting IIRC 35-40% unit marketshare even up to the end of 2007.

I think that if HD DVD had took off a bit more in 4Q 2007 with more retail support of if the BD50 replication yield and cost issues were not solved that fall by Sony DADC it could have went the other way with Warner's support.

But that would have still left a messy outcome with Sony at least and probably Fox and Disney still supporting Blu-ray and would have left a dual format movie world and cheaper dual format players coming along that would play both red and blue case movies.

But once Warner was convinced Blu-ray BD50 replication was solved then supporting Blu-ray was a way to end the format war altogether. Once they were told that was the case from Sony DADC Cinram and Singulus then HD DVD was doomed.
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Old 05-31-2012, 07:31 PM   #3067  
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They were contractually obligated to do so.

I thought in retrospect Warner made the right decision although it sure was a punch in the gut and hurt like hell at the time.I also thought all the former HD DVD studios and even Toshiba and their retail partners did the right thing to help ease the pain for HD DVD owners and help ease the transition to Blu-ray for HD DVD supporters including trade ins and HD DVD to Blu-ray upgrade programs.
What a revelation. One of the biggest Blu-ray fans on the internet saying that.
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:15 PM   #3068  
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What a revelation. One of the biggest Blu-ray fans on the internet saying that.
50gb has shown to be inadequate nowadays. 30gb would have been even more disastrous.
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:17 PM   #3069  
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But once Warner was convinced Blu-ray BD50 replication was solved then supporting Blu-ray was a way to end the format war altogether. Once they were told that was the case from Sony DADC Cinram and Singulus then HD DVD was doomed.
I supppose they were told this at the 11th hour when WB made the decision to go Blu (according to Adam Gregorich).
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:26 PM   #3070  
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I supppose they were told this at the 11th hour when WB made the decision to go Blu (according to Adam Gregorich).
No, I think that they got the data in November from multiple sources including a study from Singulus with additional data from Sony DADC and Cinram. It was part of the decision making process Cinram used when it committed to buy more Blu-ray Blueline II replication lines from Singulus.
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:32 PM   #3071  
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What a revelation. One of the biggest Blu-ray fans on the internet saying that.
I'm only being honest.

At the time during CES 2008 I felt the same way as you did. I got over it as time went on though.

In 2007 I would have been less skeptical about Blu-ray if I had that information as well as the primary reason I supported HD DVD more than Blu-ray was my fear that most catalog titles would not be released on Blu-ray if BD50 replication was rare and expensive because of poor yields.

Why the snarky comment there from you when I also shared that I felt the news was a punch in the gut that hurt like hell at the time?

Do you feel that HD DVD could have done better than Blu-ray in a dual format world and are still upset that HD DVD lost the format war?
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:34 PM   #3072  
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50gb has shown to be inadequate nowadays. 30gb would have been even more disastrous.
30GB in 2008. You seem to forget HD DVD is frozen in time. They were working on 51GB Discs and if they came out, what would be the problem? No lossless? Again, 2008.

What next? What else can you put on a format that died 4.5 years ago.
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:35 PM   #3073  
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Do you feel that HD DVD could have done better than Blu-ray in a dual format world and are still upset that HD DVD lost the format war?
HD DVD was clearly ahead of its time.

It had DVD on the other side of the disc. Blu-ray is now doing that and more! Blu-rays can't even be sold without a precious SD being packed in to appease retailers.
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:48 PM   #3074  
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Why the snarky comment there from you when I also shared that I felt the news was a punch in the gut that hurt like hell at the time?
Oh boo hoo. You've said it like a thousand times already. What do you expect?
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Old 05-31-2012, 08:51 PM   #3075  
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No, I think that they got the data in November from multiple sources including a study from Singulus with additional data from Sony DADC and Cinram. It was part of the decision making process Cinram used when it committed to buy more Blu-ray Blueline II replication lines from Singulus.
So obviously you're not buying what Adam said about Warner not deciding until the 11th hour, right? I mean, if Warner knew HD DVD was "doomed" since November.
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