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Nobody Wants Blu-ray -- Study

eHDMI
08-05-2008, 05:52 AM
Consumers do not want Blu-ray, says a research firm. A consumer survey done by ABI Research revealed that over half of the 1000 respondents had 'other priorities,' to buying a Blu-ray player, saying that they had no plans to purchase one; a further 23% are likely to buy, but not until sometime in 2009.

Story (http://www.techtree.com/India/News/Nobody_Wants_Blu-ray_--_Study/551-91814-581.html)

Rich_Guy
08-05-2008, 08:18 AM
And most of those people surveyed probably did not own an HD TV. If you own a good HD TV Blu-ray is the DVD player to have. Current prices still keep Blu-ray as an enthusiast item, as prices drop Blu-ray will become more accepted by the main stream buyer. Most people still don't own a TV that would benefit from a Blu-ray player, many homes that own HD sets don't even know they need an HD source to get an HD picture. HD is still at it's infancy but it will grow.

rbinck
08-05-2008, 08:29 AM
Obviously the author chose his title to be as controversial as possible to try to spike viewership. People should shy away from making such dogmatic statements though and saying nobody wants Blu-ray is pretty dogmatic. Heck I have some Blu-ray discs, so he just called me nobody.

I think these surveys are largely useless and the surveys that matters are the ones taken at the cash register.

Bigloww
08-05-2008, 08:38 AM
Heck I have some Blu-ray discs, so he just called me nobody.



Just because you have it, doesn't always mean you wanted it..;)

HD Goofnut
08-05-2008, 08:38 AM
Obviously the author chose his title to be as controversial as possible to try to spike viewership. People should shy away from making such dogmatic statements though and saying nobody wants Blu-ray is pretty dogmatic. Heck I have some Blu-ray discs, so he just called me nobody.

I think these surveys are largely useless and the surveys that matters are the ones taken at the cash register.

You got that right. This survey stinks of wrong test group. Now if it had been 1000 HDTV owners, that would have been much more accurate.

CoachZ
08-07-2008, 01:16 PM
Story (http://www.techtree.com/India/News/Nobody_Wants_Blu-ray_--_Study/551-91814-581.html)
Spend some money on a dictionary.....NOBODY

BobY
08-07-2008, 01:43 PM
Wow, what a garbage article!

And I say that even as someone who has no interest in Blu-Ray and doesn't expect it to become more than a niche format.

So they can extrapolate from 1000 responses, only half of which said they weren't interested, that nobody is interested? Despite 23% who indicated they are interested? The logic is boggling.

The actual ABI survey is a bit more scientifically based, but even so, the conclusions are suspect:

http://www.abiresearch.com/products/research_brief/Consumer_Video_Technologies_Market_Update/115/Blu-ray:+Consumer+Survey+Results

I do have to point out that their statement "While you might think gamers purchase fewer movie discs than others, we didn't see any significant evidence of that in our results" is also garbage--all you need to do is look at the number of BD discs sold compared to the number of PS3's sold to obviously see there is a very large group of PS3 owners who are not buying any discs.

The PDF article linked to which "showed that Blu-ray adoption had outpaced DVD adoption" is also garbage. Firstly, it's only for Europe and secondly it only counts player sales, counting every PS3 as a BD player. Actual disc unit sales put Blu-Ray far, far behind DVD at this point in it's life, even though BD has more players in the field (as a result of PS3) than DVD did at the same point in it's life.

crysisworm
08-07-2008, 01:51 PM
Spin......spin.....Spin they probably surveyed 1000 peeps that live in a mobile home park and draw social security......the numbers can be made to show virtually anything... I bet if someone tried just a bit you could target a group that would show that 65% own Blu and 90% plan to in the near future........:lol:

Bravestime
08-07-2008, 02:10 PM
This article is too funny. The writer should be careful in future articles to prevent being sued by false titles or statements.

Chris Gerhard
08-07-2008, 02:32 PM
The concept of relying on some silly survey of the population in general to make conclusions about Blu-ray is dumb to begin with. Blu-ray is at about 10% of the DVD volume now in the US based on what I have been reading. That is a significant increase that has been shown the last few weeks and as more people purchase an HDTV and see neighbors, friends, family or coworkers that have Blu-ray, more and more are going to be interested. Asking somebody that doesn't own an HDTV and doesn't have close ties to people that own Blu-ray, whether or not they plan to purchase Blu-ray is caca. Ask owners of HDTV whether or not they are interested in Blu-ray, nobody without HDTV is going to buy Blu-ray, that much I agree with. I believe HDTV is in about 40% of US homes now and if 23% responded to this survey indicating they are planning on purchasing Blu-ray, I see that as about 50% of HDTV owners are planning on purchasing a Blu-ray player. People just planning on purchasing an HDTV haven't yet decided on all sources that will be acquired. As Blockbuster stocks bigger inventories and more neighbors have players, Blu-ray is going to grow. Growth this year has been really good and it is expected to pick up this holiday season. I am sure DVD was faced with similar reluctance from people happy with VHS. Once DVD was seen, the reluctance quickly disappeared and the rest is history.

Chris

Chris Gerhard
08-07-2008, 02:39 PM
Wow, what a garbage article!

And I say that even as someone who has no interest in Blu-Ray and doesn't expect it to become more than a niche format.

Which is why I am puzzled that you attempt to be part of the conversation so often about something you don't want and know so little about. You apparently didn't want HD DVD either since I don't think you purchased it but you championed that format as having a chance at mass market success, a really bizarre opinion based on nothing I could ever grasp.

Chris

BobY
08-07-2008, 09:31 PM
Which is why I am puzzled that you attempt to be part of the conversation so often about something you don't want and know so little about. You apparently didn't want HD DVD either since I don't think you purchased it but you championed that format as having a chance at mass market success, a really bizarre opinion based on nothing I could ever grasp.

Chris

Are you ever going to stop talking about HD DVD? It's dead and gone. Has been for months. I only mention it any more in response to people like you who continually bring it up.

I didn't buy into HD DVD for the Same reason I see no point buying into Blu-Ray--there is simply not enough content to make it a worthwhile investment and Blu-Ray, of course, commands a premium price, making it an even worse value than HD DVD.

To be perfectly honest, Chris, I'm glad you think my opinions are bizarre. It gives me confirmation that I'm still on the right track. :D

Jim Bob Jones
08-08-2008, 06:18 AM
Since this is essentially a rank speculation thread, I'll add my 2 cents to the din. Until Blu-ray players hit the two hundred dollar or less range, consumer acceptance will be slow and it will remain essentially a niche market. HD DVD had a clear advantage.

gosmosis
08-08-2008, 06:31 AM
Since this is essentially a rank speculation thread, I'll add my 2 cents to the din. Until Blu-ray players hit the two hundred dollar or less range, consumer acceptance will be slow and it will remain essentially a niche market. HD DVD had a clear advantage.

Now my 2 cents. I thought HD was priced lower only because they were in a cat fight with BD. Was that the case - or was it cheaper from day 1? (apples vs apples)

tcarcio
08-08-2008, 06:36 AM
Since this is essentially a rank speculation thread, I'll add my 2 cents to the din. Until Blu-ray players hit the two hundred dollar or less range, consumer acceptance will be slow and it will remain essentially a niche market. HD DVD had a clear advantage.

I agree, if nothing HD dvd showed people that it is not prudent to buy into a format unless it is has a strong marketshare. I am not saying that BD won't do that in time but people want to feel good about spending their money and until prices are at that point where they can make people feel that way it remains a wait and see scenario. IMO.

Nikopol
08-08-2008, 07:19 AM
Probably just a feeble attempt at some sensationalist journalism. :bs:

Nikopol
08-08-2008, 08:24 AM
btw here is a funny different interpretation of the (probably) same survey

75% of Survey Respondents Say They'll Go Blu by 2009

A consumer survey from ABI Research on consumer adoption of Blu-ray Disc players found an overwhelming majority plan on buying a Blu-ray player this year or next.

Half of the 1,000 respondents said they plan on buying a Blu-ray player this year, and another quarter said they would hold off until 2009.

Half of the respondents to the survey also said they consider the quality of Blu-ray players to be much better than DVD, while 40% said it is “somewhat better.”
http://www.homemediamagazine.com/news/html/breaking_article.cfm?article_id=13272

:lol:

Jim Bob Jones
08-08-2008, 12:31 PM
Now my 2 cents. I thought HD was priced lower only because they were in a cat fight with BD. Was that the case - or was it cheaper from day 1? (apples vs apples)
Not sure about "day 1". But as best I can recall, a basic first generation HD DVD player was always less expensive than a basic first generation Blu-ray player. Chris or PFC5 might correct me on this. They were in on it early on. That gap continued to widen until HD DVD went under.

zip2play
08-11-2008, 10:06 AM
Why would someone BUY a 1080 capable TV and NOT buy a Blue Ray player? Certainly not anyone who rents DVD's for his movie watching. The TV is overspecified for ANY other use.


The near future is 1080p coupled to a Blu-Ray player...now down to $249 bucks. Anything else is outmoded technology.

Scottnot
08-11-2008, 06:51 PM
Why would someone BUY a 1080 capable TV and NOT buy a Blue Ray player? Certainly not anyone who rents DVD's for his movie watching. The TV is overspecified for ANY other use.


The near future is 1080p coupled to a Blu-Ray player...now down to $249 bucks. Anything else is outmoded technology.

Why would anyone ask such an absurd question . . . .

which obviously presupposes that:

#1 All people must think alike . . .

and

#2 All people who do not think like the poster must be of lesser wisdom and intelligence.

Anyway, the answer is, I guess, because people have different needs for a TV; some folks just don't rent movies; and some people are more shallow than others.

gosmosis
08-11-2008, 08:53 PM
Why would anyone ask such an absurd question . . . .

which obviously presupposes that:

#1 All people must think alike . . .

and

#2 All people who do not think like the poster must be of lesser wisdom and intelligence.

Anyway, the answer is, I guess, because people have different needs for a TV; some folks just don't rent movies; and some people are more shallow than others.

I bought 1080P cause I needed a new TV. Price was right. I don't have a blu-ray player yet. I guess it's because right now I can't afford another hobby (blu-ray player AND blu-ray discs) No other reason really. But, soon, very soon...:lol:

soupnazi
08-11-2008, 10:23 PM
Why would someone BUY a 1080 capable TV and NOT buy a Blue Ray player? Certainly not anyone who rents DVD's for his movie watching. The TV is overspecified for ANY other use.



Because, Some people want a quality big screen TV that just happens to be 1080p.

Blu-ray is still finding it's market and these people are not in too much of a hurry to upgrade yet.

HD Goofnut
08-12-2008, 10:13 AM
Because, Some people want a quality big screen TV that just happens to be 1080p.

Blu-ray is still finding it's market and these people are not in too much of a hurry to upgrade yet.

Educate the masses and they will come.:D

electrictroy
08-12-2008, 04:52 PM
"Consumers were happy to embrace standard DVD when that format arrived because the improvement in quality over VHS videotapes was dramatic. Standard DVD didn't require the purchase of a new TV either." You don't need to buy a new tv to enjoy Bluray. The simple fact that it eliminates compression artifacts automatically makes it an improvement on the DVD, even on a standard 480i set.

Scottnot
08-12-2008, 05:46 PM
The simple fact that it eliminates compression artifacts automatically makes it an improvement on the DVD, even on a standard 480i set.
That's absurd!

Consider two DVDs of the same movie;

The first, a BD DVD which has been "well mastered" contains the movie at 1080p.

The second, a SD DVD which has been equally "well mastered" contains the movie at 480i.

Now, playing the SD DVD simply reproduces the entire content of the DVD, neither adding nor subtracting any information.

The content on the BD DVD, however, must be scaled from 1080p to 480i by the BD player in order to be displayed on the 1080i set.
It is unlikely that the scaler in the BD player will be as good as the mastering equipment that was used to manufacture the SD DVD, so it follows that the BD DVD on a "standard 480i set" may look worse; or it may look the same; but there is no reason why it can possibly look better than the "well mastered" SD DVD.

gosmosis
08-12-2008, 05:50 PM
The content on the BD DVD, however, must be scaled from 1080p to 480i by the BD player in order to be displayed on the 1080i set.
It is unlikely that the scaler in the BD player will be as good as the mastering equipment that was used to manufacture the SD DVD, so it follows that the BD DVD on a "standard 480i set" may look worse; or it may look the same; but there is no reason why it can possibly look better than the "well mastered" SD DVD.

That makes sense.

gosmosis
08-12-2008, 05:52 PM
Educate the masses and they will come.:D

Educate the people setting the prices. Lower the prices and the masses will come.

Blckman
08-12-2008, 08:56 PM
Okay people. I have to say that I don't agree with this article. However, it does has some merit in that the economy hasn't been the best right now. That being said, when I see headlines that say Circuit City and Wal-Mart had losses in the last quarter, you really have to look at the article. The numbers are horrible, however, if a barrel of oil fluctuates and gas doesn't go down under $4.00 per gallon, then all indication is that most consumers don't have the money to get a HDTV. I know people because I'm in the heart of California in Pasadena. I was in Circuit City, Best Buy, Wal-Mart, and Fry's Electronics this past Sunday and it was dead. In fact, I work so close to these retailers that I'm in these retailers about three times a week. Many of you don't live in California where gas is the highest in the country. Many of you also have to realize which one is more important: An HDTV or the pressures of facing foreclosure? I would want save my home. And you must realize that the Inland Empire is a dessert. The hell with an HDTV. I'm not a millionaire, but I've had an HDTV before HDMI was even brought to the forefront. Somebody said in the forum that those 1,000 surveyed probably don't have an HDTV. I would put myself in the group(just an example) and if they surveyed me I would go by what the consumer says when I talk to them along the isles. "I have to first get the TV to take advantage of Blu-Ray, then maybe I'll get the player when it comes down under $200.00." I have great deal of toys in an apartment you wouldn't imagine. That doesn't mean that the article is not valid. To each his own. I don't like the numbers that the article brought forth, but I sure do agree that Blu-Ray is a long way off from being the mainstream media for consumers when we have an economy that just can't seem to get it right. It's just my opinion and not to slander or hurt any of you guys. I respect you all and points well taken. God bless....

electrictroy
08-13-2008, 06:59 AM
The simple fact that [an HD Disc] eliminates compression artifacts automatically makes it an improvement on the DVD, even on a standard 480i set. That's absurd! No it's not absurd. My DVD of Matrix had compression artifacts (especially in the dark scenes) whereas the HD-DVD did not. Therefore I received a visible improvement by upgrading to HD-DVD, even while watching in 480i.

A few more examples where the same was true (the HD-DVD in 480i looked better than the DVD): Blade Runner, Apollo 13, Mission Impossible. This is the direct result of HD-DVD being encoded at an average 20-25 megabit/s versus DVD only being an average 3-4 megabit/s.

Chris Gerhard
08-13-2008, 07:21 AM
Educate the people setting the prices. Lower the prices and the masses will come.

The product has to sell for a profit or no company will make the product. The continual claim here that lowering prices will cause Blu-ray to succeed should be easily disproved with the HD DVD failure despite low priced hardware sold a huge loss resulting in only one manufacturer interested and that one pulled out after the losses were too great to continue with no hope for anything other than further losses.

The only possible way for Blu-ray to succeed is for efficiency improvements over time resulting in lower manufacturing costs and ultimately lower sales prices. If nobody buys the product while that process continues, the product dies before it can happen. I am personally delighted with the process as it stands now, prices have fallen faster than I had believed possible. People can whine and sit on the sidelines and wait for lower prices, that is fine with me, but trying to claim immediately lowering prices is the way for the companies involved to succeed is a bunch of hooey. Consumers need to get involved for the product to succeed and it appears to me that is what is happening, the whiners sitting on the sideline notwithstanding. I am impressed that Funai, Sony, Pioneer, Panasonic, Samsung, Sharp and the others have managed to make such high quality players at good prices.

Chris

Chris Gerhard
08-13-2008, 07:39 AM
That's absurd!

Consider two DVDs of the same movie;

The first, a BD DVD which has been "well mastered" contains the movie at 1080p.

The second, a SD DVD which has been equally "well mastered" contains the movie at 480i.

Now, playing the SD DVD simply reproduces the entire content of the DVD, neither adding nor subtracting any information.

The content on the BD DVD, however, must be scaled from 1080p to 480i by the BD player in order to be displayed on the 1080i set.
It is unlikely that the scaler in the BD player will be as good as the mastering equipment that was used to manufacture the SD DVD, so it follows that the BD DVD on a "standard 480i set" may look worse; or it may look the same; but there is no reason why it can possibly look better than the "well mastered" SD DVD.

I am sorry this is entirely wrong. A properly mastered DVD is limited by bitrates and other format specifications and won't look as good as a properly mastered Blu-ray disc even at 480i on a good NTSC 480i display. If your theory was correct, films wouldn't have been mastered at HD resolution before being encoded for DVD. Start with the highest possible source before downrezing to 480i is preferrable. Blu-ray players can do, although I won't disagree some don't, a great job with 1080p to 480i conversions. With any digital to analog conversion, you want to start with the best possible digital source and a 1080p Blu-ray source is a better starting point than a 480i DVD source, that is just the way it is. Will the differences be worth much? Not in my opinion, but that doesn't mean there are no differences or the lesser source is the better choice. Look to all factors for why the 1080p Blu-ray disc is the better choice, color accuracy, detail, resolution, and all other technical specifications. If you are talking about a 480i digital display and no digital to analog conversion, I don't know, I haven't ever seen one and would have to look at the specifics for that consideration. I am assuming you are making this claim regarding the typical analog display, some of which can be capable of better than DVD specs over analog connections to begin with.

Chris

electrictroy
08-13-2008, 07:46 AM
I am assuming you are making this claim regarding the typical analog display, some of which can be capable of better than DVD specs over analog connections to begin with. Yes we are talking about the typical "old" television using analog inputs like S-video. That was the exact point I was making: You don't need to dump your old analog set to enjoy an improvement with Bluray. Bluray will look better than a DVD, even in 480i.

rbinck
08-13-2008, 01:16 PM
No it's not absurd. My DVD of Matrix had compression artifacts (especially in the dark scenes) whereas the HD-DVD did not. Therefore I received a visible improvement by upgrading to HD-DVD, even while watching in 480i.

A few more examples where the same was true (the HD-DVD in 480i looked better than the DVD): Blade Runner, Apollo 13, Mission Impossible. This is the direct result of HD-DVD being encoded at an average 20-25 megabit/s versus DVD only being an average 3-4 megabit/s.
You got a HD DVD player?

electrictroy
08-13-2008, 03:47 PM
Yeah last year (used on ebay). I plan to get Bluray after it starts filling-up with television shows I want (like Stargate or Galactica) and/or after the PS3 to drop to $200.

I sold my two D-VHS recorders. $1000 in my pocket was too good a deal to pass-up. I netted about $600 in profit over what I originally paid.

jimbo41
09-04-2008, 08:22 PM
IMO I think it might be too late for people ( "the masses") to adopt blu ray. Only true enthusiast or people with disposable incomes will be the ones keeping the format going . I base this on our past history with the music industry and technology! Remember 8 track? Then cassette tapes? I (as were many people) was very reluctant to switch to CD's! Until I heard how good a 1000.00 sony CD player sounded remember? I quickly dumped my cassettes plus equipment,went digital before all my friends and family! The cost were more than 2x in some cases but for enthusiasts the convenience, durability,improved sound quality were all worth it. I know many people who took 5-7 years to switch over! I was perfectly happy with my 1000+ CD's then in the late 90's early 2000 Guess what? along comes apple with it's ipod and the rest is tech history! I still have all my cd's even though they have been duped on my laptop for years I refuse to part with them! I have hauled them around in boxes through 2 moves! They still sound better than alot of music files. My point is I see the same path for video content! Betamax, VHS, SVHS, DVD. blu-ray ??? But the timing may be too late for "the masses" to adopt blu-ray> it is only a matter of time for us to all have dedicated mass storage devices in home to purchase dowloads of our favorite video content In standard or HD! I would pay 5.00 or so for a digital movie. More household have computers and sat/cable tv right now without buying another player and more discs making it appealing to "the masses" I saw a 4 terabyte media storage device a couple of years ago in a home theatre mag. article it was 25000.00 how much are they now? So, I feel disc formats of all types will be obsolete in a few short years! We will be carrying most of our movies in our pockets to bring over to our friends' houses on movie night! That's my 2cents C-YA

JoeRoscoe
09-05-2008, 01:09 AM
Many consider BluRay (and HD-DVD) as nothing more than a niche-market item but with greater saturation than LaserDisc...mostly due to the game platforms (PS3 and XBox).
Taking away PS3 from BluRay and the heavy discounts HD-DVD (Toshiba) offered, I'm guessing that overall sales from BOTH formats would not be much more than LaserDisc sold at it's best (just a guess mind you)...DVD upped the ante and LaserDisc soon disappeared...just as I think BluRay will, when true high-speed HiDef downloads and streaming HiDef media appear and up the ante again.
Sure PS3 and XBox will survive (and their successors) but only as what they were intended to due, be a gaming platform first and foremost.

Razor05
09-08-2008, 03:45 PM
Many consider BluRay (and HD-DVD) as nothing more than a niche-market item but with greater saturation than LaserDisc...mostly due to the game platforms (PS3 and XBox).
Taking away PS3 from BluRay and the heavy discounts HD-DVD (Toshiba) offered, I'm guessing that overall sales from BOTH formats would not be much more than LaserDisc sold at it's best (just a guess mind you)...DVD upped the ante and LaserDisc soon disappeared...just as I think BluRay will, when true high-speed HiDef downloads and streaming HiDef media appear and up the ante again.
Sure PS3 and XBox will survive (and their successors) but only as what they were intended to due, be a gaming platform first and foremost.

Agreed. The PS3 was a good vehicle for Blu-Ray. It's too bad the consumer didn't have the final say.

coupcoup
09-13-2008, 06:59 PM
I agree. Sony products are way too expensive.

The_Omega_Man
09-18-2008, 12:31 AM
Many consider BluRay (and HD-DVD) as nothing more than a niche-market item but with greater saturation than LaserDisc...mostly due to the game platforms (PS3 and XBox).
Taking away PS3 from BluRay and the heavy discounts HD-DVD (Toshiba) offered, I'm guessing that overall sales from BOTH formats would not be much more than LaserDisc sold at it's best (just a guess mind you)...DVD upped the ante and LaserDisc soon disappeared...just as I think BluRay will, when true high-speed HiDef downloads and streaming HiDef media appear and up the ante again.
Sure PS3 and XBox will survive (and their successors) but only as what they were intended to due, be a gaming platform first and foremost.

This is certainly one possible outcome.

Another is that the entry price for basic BD movie playback will hit a price point that sits well with the general consumers. And BD gets resuscitated and lives a full and healthy (less profitable) life. :rolleyes:

zip2play
10-26-2008, 08:23 AM
I still have all my cd's even though they have been duped on my laptop for years I refuse to part with them! I have hauled them around in boxes through 2 moves

Heck,
I'm STILL hauling around 1,000 LP's I cannot bear to part with! :D


I will accept Blu-Ray when I it becomes more commonplace. I looked through all Netlix' offerering of around 800 titles and had a lot of trouble finding 5 that I might rent...many I've seen, and most I would NEVER watch. I would never consider actually BUYING a DVD disc of any kind; when a movie is watched I am through with the plastic and do not want another COLLECTION.

The 800 current titles is just not enough to be enticing $200 worth. Perhaps when it hits the 8,000 or 18,000 mark it will be THE technology and I'll dutifully buy the box.

HD Goofnut
10-26-2008, 02:09 PM
Heck,
I'm STILL hauling around 1,000 LP's I cannot bear to part with! :D


I will accept Blu-Ray when I it becomes more commonplace. I looked through all Netlix' offerering of around 800 titles and had a lot of trouble finding 5 that I might rent...many I've seen, and most I would NEVER watch. I would never consider actually BUYING a DVD disc of any kind; when a movie is watched I am through with the plastic and do not want another COLLECTION.

The 800 current titles is just not enough to be enticing $200 worth. Perhaps when it hits the 8,000 or 18,000 mark it will be THE technology and I'll dutifully buy the box.

I am not thoroughly sure on BD as a lasting format, but I can tell you that the 1920 by 1080 resolution will be the norm for at least the next 10 years and probably longer.

mytime
10-26-2008, 02:16 PM
It doesn't really matter. I bought HD-DVD and it died. I bought Blu-Ray and if it dies I will most likely buy whatever replaces it. I can't help it, I'm a sucker for new formats I guess.

Loves2Watch
10-26-2008, 03:00 PM
It doesn't really matter. I bought HD-DVD and it died. I bought Blu-Ray and if it dies I will most likely buy whatever replaces it. I can't help it, I'm a sucker for new formats I guess.

You ARE an Early Adopter as are many here including myself.

zip2play
10-27-2008, 07:20 AM
The problem isn't really the new FORMAT, yes I agree that 1080p is the future, it's the software available for the format.

As it stands now, there just isn't near enough quality product available in Blu-Ray unless one loves everything new that is released to the theaters. For me, I have no use for Star Wars XXIII, Matrix 6, Still Slightly Pretty Woman, or X-Men to the X power or to AGAIN watch the classics Ben-Hur, Virginia Woolf, Close Encounters , 2001, Citizen Kane just to see extra pixels.

I guess part of the problem is that the best movies today aren't being done as Hollywood blockbusters and thus are still coming out in Standard format only.

If I sprang for Blu-Ray, I'd be through the rentals that I want from Netflix in under 2 months.

There has to be a certain level of product to entice me to pile on another STB and it will take several years to amass this level.

HD Goofnut
10-27-2008, 07:48 AM
The problem isn't really the new FORMAT, yes I agree that 1080p is the future, it's the software available for the format.

As it stands now, there just isn't near enough quality product available in Blu-Ray unless one loves everything new that is released to the theaters. For me, I have no use for Star Wars XXIII, Matrix 6, Still Slightly Pretty Woman, or X-Men to the X power or to AGAIN watch the classics Ben-Hur, Virginia Woolf, Close Encounters , 2001, Citizen Kane just to see extra pixels.

I guess part of the problem is that the best movies today aren't being done as Hollywood blockbusters and thus are still coming out in Standard format only.

If I sprang for Blu-Ray, I'd be through the rentals that I want from Netflix in under 2 months.

There has to be a certain level of product to entice me to pile on another STB and it will take several years to amass this level.

I felt just like you did until I saw several titles on HD DVD and then HDM changed my mind forever and I chose not to revert back to SD DVD. So yes I have nearly 300 SD DVDs, but I had nearly 400 before eBay and I haven't bought a SD DVD in many months. The difference is not just pixels and audio, there is also vast improvements in color, contrast, and brightness. You ever watch a SD DVD or SD broadcast on an HDTV and notice how dark the picture is? You never have this issue with BD/HD DVD and to be honest only a small number of HD channels over CAB/SAT look even close to BD/HD DVD.

rcoleman11
10-27-2008, 10:05 PM
I felt just like you did until I saw several titles on HD DVD and then HDM changed my mind forever and I chose not to revert back to SD DVD. So yes I have nearly 300 SD DVDs, but I had nearly 400 before eBay and I haven't bought a SD DVD in many months. The difference is not just pixels and audio, there is also vast improvements in color, contrast, and brightness. You ever watch a SD DVD or SD broadcast on an HDTV and notice how dark the picture is? You never have this issue with BD/HD DVD and to be honest only a small number of HD channels over CAB/SAT look even close to BD/HD DVD.

I find it very hard to watch standard-def TV anymore. It has such a washed-out look compared to HD that it's almost unwatchable on a big-screen HDTV.

brant
10-29-2008, 10:15 PM
i just wanted to throw my opinion in:

i have an HDTV; i have HD satellite service. I do not have a blu-ray player, and don't plan on purchasing one any time soon. the price of DVD's has plummeted, so I'm just enjoying that right now.

Wal-mart has some blu-ray players for under $240 now; i'll consider buying one if they reach the $150 mark. The first DVD player I ever purchased (and still have) cost $550; DVD's were around $30 a piece. The last DVD player I purchased was $30. The first one I bought was probably 10 years ago and we're still on DVD's. I can wait another 5 years to purchase a blu-ray player. To be honest, I'm hoping netflix will start streaming HD video over the roku player. Even now, w/o HD, i'm thinking about buying one. If they ever start streaming HD video, i'll have no reason to purchase a blu-ray player.

Rugger
10-30-2008, 02:36 AM
Blu-ray will have its market open in the coming future!

Ruark
11-10-2008, 09:30 AM
many homes that own HD sets don't even know they need an HD source to get an HD picture. HD is still at it's infancy but it will grow.

This is true. There's still a LOT of naivete out there about HD. Lots of people get "wunna them flat-screen tay-vays," put their SD picture in "stretch" mode, and think that's it. In fact, I run into far more people calling them "flat-screen" TVs than "HD."

Ruark

rcoleman11
11-11-2008, 08:03 AM
Wal-mart has some blu-ray players for under $240 now; i'll consider buying one if they reach the $150 mark. The first DVD player I ever purchased (and still have) cost $550; DVD's were around $30 a piece. The last DVD player I purchased was $30. The first one I bought was probably 10 years ago and we're still on DVD's. I can wait another 5 years to purchase a blu-ray player. To be honest, I'm hoping netflix will start streaming HD video over the roku player. Even now, w/o HD, i'm thinking about buying one. If they ever start streaming HD video, i'll have no reason to purchase a blu-ray player.

Some Blu-ray players are already available for less than $200. It won't be long before they hit $150. When I bought my first DVD player, it cost $150, and that was several years after they first appeared. Blu-ray players are actually coming down in price a lot faster than DVD players did. And remember what happened a few months ago when Walmart was offering an HD DVD player for $98? People were lining up in the stores at 6:00am to buy them.

Netflix will be streaming HD very soon. The problem will be the same as what we're seeing now with SD streaming - limited content and virtually no new releases available for streaming. Check the list of new releases in SD each week and see how many of them are available for streaming. Answer: close to zero. That's because they have to negotiate rights, and it's going to be difficult to do that under a flat monthly pricing system.

aed55
11-11-2008, 12:36 PM
That's absurd!

Consider two DVDs of the same movie;

The first, a BD DVD which has been "well mastered" contains the movie at 1080p.

The second, a SD DVD which has been equally "well mastered" contains the movie at 480i.

Now, playing the SD DVD simply reproduces the entire content of the DVD, neither adding nor subtracting any information.

The content on the BD DVD, however, must be scaled from 1080p to 480i by the BD player in order to be displayed on the 1080i set.
It is unlikely that the scaler in the BD player will be as good as the mastering equipment that was used to manufacture the SD DVD, so it follows that the BD DVD on a "standard 480i set" may look worse; or it may look the same; but there is no reason why it can possibly look better than the "well mastered" SD DVD.

Just a question in the same vain. I have a 720p plasma, and a DVD player with up converter capability. Would I see a better picture when playing a Blue Ray DVD than I now receive with a standard DVD in up convert mode?

HD Goofnut
11-11-2008, 12:56 PM
Just a question in the same vain. I have a 720p plasma, and a DVD player with up converter capability. Would I see a better picture when playing a Blue Ray DVD than I now receive with a standard DVD in up convert mode?

Indeed you would and the difference would be night and day.

gossamer
11-11-2008, 01:03 PM
Indeed you would and the difference would be night and day.

Some differences are dusk and night. :D

Seriously, there are a lot of titles that are just a hair above SD DVD. But there are also plenty that are of reference quality. I would read reviews and not buy blindly.

Rich_Guy
11-11-2008, 01:06 PM
Just a question in the same vain. I have a 720p plasma, and a DVD player with up converter capability. Would I see a better picture when playing a Blue Ray DVD than I now receive with a standard DVD in up convert mode?

Yes, a nice improvement with blu-ray DVDs.

rcoleman11
11-11-2008, 06:37 PM
Here's another reality check for those who think downloads are going to take over the world - bandwidth caps by ISPs:

http://www.hackingnetflix.com/2008/11/att-testing-ban.html

Before long you'll get a limited amount of bandwidth for downloading and then you'll have to pay by the gigabyte for going over the limit.

HD Goofnut
11-11-2008, 08:18 PM
Here's another reality check for those who think downloads are going to take over the world - bandwidth caps by ISPs:

http://www.hackingnetflix.com/2008/11/att-testing-ban.html

Before long you'll get a limited amount of bandwidth for downloading and then you'll have to pay by the gigabyte for going over the limit.

Sounds awfully familiar doesn't it? Hint: Cellphones

hcour
11-14-2008, 01:40 AM
I have a 56" Samsung HDTV and I bought one of the HD-DVD players when they were on sale at WM and I just didn't think it was that big of a deal. I'm not saying the picture wasn't better, of course it was, but compared to upconverted SD dvd's, it just wasn't that much more impressive. In fact when HD-DVD's went down for the count I sold mine and bought an OPPO 980. SD DVD's look fantastic and I'm very pleased. It is nothing like the difference between SD and HD television, w/that there is indeed a vast difference in PQ. But between an HD dvd and an upconverted SD DVD, not so much. I can live w/the latter just fine for now, until I see where BD is going (I don't intend to get burned again).

Harold

bearzilla333
11-14-2008, 02:42 AM
uhhh I want blu-ray.and I am somebody :)

tvine2000
11-14-2008, 04:13 AM
Story (http://www.techtree.com/India/News/Nobody_Wants_Blu-ray_--_Study/551-91814-581.html)

no matter what they say,blu-ray is doing fine.
these are people with agendas,that get paid to doom a format.
screw them

MikeRox
11-14-2008, 06:12 AM
Now my 2 cents. I thought HD was priced lower only because they were in a cat fight with BD. Was that the case - or was it cheaper from day 1? (apples vs apples)

I'd agree. HD DVD had less studios (and initially just Universal and Weinstein exclusively), so wouldn't have stood a chance if it was priced equally to Blu-ray. If Toshiba could have charged the same for HD DVD as the BDA companies did for Blu-ray, they would have done.

Ruark
11-18-2008, 09:24 AM
Another thing that will really help Blu-Ray move into the market (besides lower prices) is functional stabilization. They have GOT to get past all this "firmware upgrade" nonsense. Blu-Ray has not yet reached the plug-and-play functionality that DVD and VHS players had, where you just stick it in the slot and hit "play."

I was in Best Buy just last night, and some Joe the Plumber type was bringing his Blu-Ray player up to the Customer Service counter jabbering about some weird stuff it was doing (freezing, skipping, etc.) and said it was broken and wanted his money back. The CS person said it probably just needed a firmware upgrade, and the customer just looked at him with that deer-in-the-headlights blank stare, having utterly no idea what he was talking about, and demanded and got a refund.

We didn't have this with DVD and VHS players; it needs to STOP. It's ridiculous to buy a $500 Blu-Ray player, stick a popular movie in it and it won't play.

Ruark

HD Goofnut
11-18-2008, 09:40 AM
Another thing that will really help Blu-Ray move into the market (besides lower prices) is functional stabilization. They have GOT to get past all this "firmware upgrade" nonsense. Blu-Ray has not yet reached the plug-and-play functionality that DVD and VHS players had, where you just stick it in the slot and hit "play."

I was in Best Buy just last night, and some Joe the Plumber type was bringing his Blu-Ray player up to the Customer Service counter jabbering about some weird stuff it was doing (freezing, skipping, etc.) and said it was broken and wanted his money back. The CS person said it probably just needed a firmware upgrade, and the customer just looked at him with that deer-in-the-headlights blank stare, having utterly no idea what he was talking about, and demanded and got a refund.

We didn't have this with DVD and VHS players; it needs to STOP. It's ridiculous to buy a $500 Blu-Ray player, stick a popular movie in it and it won't play.

Ruark

Again, it's all about the added and/or different DRM and/or internet features they throw in on new titles. You don't any of that stuff with DVD or VHS.

sigill
11-18-2008, 01:59 PM
I'd agree. HD DVD had less studios (and initially just Universal and Weinstein exclusively), so wouldn't have stood a chance if it was priced equally to Blu-ray. If Toshiba could have charged the same for HD DVD as the BDA companies did for Blu-ray, they would have done.
I too think that the lack of studio support was the main reason HD-DVD failed. It could never compete with just Univesal and Paramount as 2 exclusive studios. Thats why the Warner decision was so crucial, in the end i think it was the final nail in the coffin.

Loves2Watch
11-18-2008, 03:32 PM
Another thing that will really help Blu-Ray move into the market (besides lower prices) is functional stabilization. They have GOT to get past all this "firmware upgrade" nonsense. Blu-Ray has not yet reached the plug-and-play functionality that DVD and VHS players had, where you just stick it in the slot and hit "play."

I was in Best Buy just last night, and some Joe the Plumber type was bringing his Blu-Ray player up to the Customer Service counter jabbering about some weird stuff it was doing (freezing, skipping, etc.) and said it was broken and wanted his money back. The CS person said it probably just needed a firmware upgrade, and the customer just looked at him with that deer-in-the-headlights blank stare, having utterly no idea what he was talking about, and demanded and got a refund.

We didn't have this with DVD and VHS players; it needs to STOP. It's ridiculous to buy a $500 Blu-Ray player, stick a popular movie in it and it won't play.

Ruark

I agree. It doesn't matter if it's Hollywood or the manufacturer at fault, if this continues Blu ray will be destined to be a niche format and will never become the DVD replacement the BDA so much wants.

rcoleman11
11-18-2008, 11:18 PM
Again, it's all about the added and/or different DRM and/or internet features they throw in on new titles. You don't any of that stuff with DVD or VHS.

Sony and the other media companies are killing themselves with this nonsense and they are too stupid to even realize it. They've made enormous sums of money from DVDs without anyone having to do firmware updates in order to play current titles.

I have a network-connected PS3 and I can update firmware as often as I need to, but there are lots of people out there who will simply return these players as defective if discs won't play on them. They not only lose money on returns, it gives the format a reputation for compatibility problems. I don't get what these geniuses think they're accomplishing with these DRM schemes. Anyone who really wants to pirate Blu-ray discs can easily do so - just read some of the other threads (there was a Wall Street Journal story on this topic yesterday). If they price the product properly ($20 or less), people will buy them.