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using RCA 210 without directv

bsatter
04-07-2005, 07:05 PM
If I use the receiver as a ota receiver only without directv service (dish setup I will specify 'No Dish'), will it pull in the on-line programming guide? If so, how?

borromini
04-07-2005, 08:22 PM
Usually you run a channel scan for OTA channels and specify a zipcode and it shows the markets available and you select the one in your area that you desire to receive. It then adds those channels to the guide.

RSawdey
04-07-2005, 08:48 PM
Digital stations include info in their stream, part of PSIP.

oldguy1
04-09-2005, 09:12 AM
Digital stations include info in their stream, part of PSIP.
Does the PSIP info include Electronic Program Guides, r is that still to come for OTA?

oldguy1
04-09-2005, 09:24 AM
Usually you run a channel scan for OTA channels and specify a zipcode and it shows the markets available and you select the one in your area that you desire to receive. It then adds those channels to the guide.
You seem pretty knowledgeable on DTV/HD. See if you can shed some light on this:

On my RCA DTC 210, if I specify a zip cope for the local network setup with Directv enabled, then after the setup scan I lose the audio on one of my local DTV stations. If I recan with either no zip code (all zero's) or with no dish specified, the I get audio on all local DTV stations.

My conclusion, of course, is that Directv is sending something that overlays something the locals send in the setup.

Directv, of course, claims they send nothing but the program guide for the locals specified in the zip code.

I am griped because Diretv will not even send the prblem up the food chain. They said they would back in January but I never heard anything. They didn't even offer an equipment swap nor to send a local service person out even though I am still under warranty.

Any ideas?

RSawdey
04-09-2005, 02:08 PM
Does the PSIP info include Electronic Program Guides, r is that still to come for OTA?

It's required for OTA, don't think FCC regulates cable in that area, but the Digital Cable Compatibility Agreement must include something similar. It's on a 'per channel' basis... a guide is then a collection of all the channel info... each channel has an digital info stream that says, this channel has this title on from x to y plus a short description... and for the next several hours... in a digital stream, it's just a few hundred bytes per hour in a 1 GB/hr stream.

borromini
04-09-2005, 03:17 PM
...On my RCA DTC 210, if I specify a zip cope for the local network setup with Directv enabled, then after the setup scan I lose the audio on one of my local DTV stations. If I recan with either no zip code (all zero's) or with no dish specified, the I get audio on all local DTV stations...
I'm not sure what would cause that. Sounds like you're doing the OTA setup but with DTV's dish selected. On my Samsung HD receiver, the setting up of locals is with the OTA option selected. The DTV locals don't require any setup since they're automatically in the program guide.

oldguy1
04-09-2005, 04:47 PM
RSawday:

Please see the reply to Barromini's post about the RCA DTC 210 audio. I meant it for you.

oldguy1
04-09-2005, 04:55 PM
It's required for OTA, don't think FCC regulates cable in that area, but the Digital Cable Compatibility Agreement must include something similar. It's on a 'per channel' basis... a guide is then a collection of all the channel info... each channel has an digital info stream that says, this channel has this title on from x to y plus a short description... and for the next several hours... in a digital stream, it's just a few hundred bytes per hour in a 1 GB/hr stream.
If you use the RCA DTC 210 as just an OTA receiver, can Directv prevent you from getting the guide?

When mine is set up for just OTA or with no zip code specified, I get the "short" menu ad program title but "no info" in the program description area.

See the message I sent to Borromini by mistake.

oldguy1
04-09-2005, 04:59 PM
If you use the RCA DTC 210 as just an OTA receiver, can Directv prevent you from getting the guide?


For RSawdey

When mine is set up for just OTA or with no zip code specified, I get the "short" menu ad program title but "no info" in the program description area.

See the message I sent to Borromini by mistake.
Oh, I think I see now. I may have to wait for quite a while to get the full OTA guide when set up for standalone OTA?

bsatter
04-11-2005, 08:21 PM
Thanks for the responses on this. The thing I'm still confused about is I have a couple of OTA channels that I can never lock in. It always says 'searching for signal'. BUT, the guide still shows what's on that channel. So... I guess I am getting some data (the program guide), but not the picture and sound??

oldguy1
04-14-2005, 10:00 AM
If I use the receiver as a ota receiver only without directv service (dish setup I will specify 'No Dish'), will it pull in the on-line programming guide? If so, how?

If you don't have the the directv service, your receiver will only "pull in" the PSIP information sent out by the local OTA DTV broadcasters. Like here in Columbus, it may or (more likely) may not contain program descriptions and will only be for the next 12 hour period.

oldguy1
04-14-2005, 10:06 AM
Regarding my problem with losing audio on one channel on the RCA DTC 210 receiver when Directv downloads their EPG: I found it is a known problem with, at least, some Samsung receivers. The problem has been known about for some time now by both Samsung and Directv.

Directv told me they had never heard of the problem.


They better get thier support act together or people will start dumping them.

oldguy1
05-10-2005, 04:44 PM
First, for the benefit of those new to HDTV, D*, and DTV here is a clarification of some of the fuzzy acronyms floating around:

D* is Directv
DTV is Digital Television
HDTV is High Definition TV which is the picture resolution broadcast over Digital Television (Be it D* or local DTV).
DMA is Direct Marketing Area, or your local stations
OTA is Off-the-air (local DTV broadcasts)
OTO or O&O(haven't figured this one out yet, I think it is a way of saying OTA)
LIL is another reference to OTA. I thinks it means Local in local. Don't ask me why.

It would be nice if members would use correspondence ettiquete and spell out a term at least once at the beginning of their article instead of letting the masses of uninitiated scratch their heads trying to figure out the gobbly-gook shorthand that is used in these forums. Would you like to see a message that read, "I got my D* in and LIL's instead of OTA or O&O for my DMA". LOL!

OK, I digressed: thanks to a FOX engineer, I think I understand what's going on with D* EPG's, local DTV EPG's and other local DTV problems. Thanks to Andrew Hornfeck, mjones73, and others for their interest and help:

If you have a D* (H)DTV receiver and you have it activated, all PSIP and EPG data (even for local DTV) comes from D*.

If you have a D* (H)DTV receiver that is deactivated BUT you have a dish type specified in the setup and you have told it what zip code to load the EPG for, the receiver uses the D* PSIP & EPG.

If you have a D* receiver that is deactivated and have a dish type specified with NO zip code, then the D* PSIP is used, no D* EPG is used, and the local EPG is ignored.

If you have a D* receiver that is deactivated AND specify no dish is installed, then the receiver uses the full local PSIP data, including the EPG (if the stations choose to fill it in).

The last item seems to be hit and miss. The local PBS stations seem to be best at filling in program descriptions for their EPG's, but even then are spotty. The local network affilliates seem to not provide program descripion. They just provide what is required by the FCC.

Also, it seems that D8 gets their PSIP info from a "service" . If the PSIP info directv sends down with their program guide has incorrect info then that can cause such problems as getting good video on local DTV stations but no audio.

It is a well known problem with some Samsung and RCA stb's. The finger pointing says the local station is supposed to supply the PSIP info to the "service" that puts together D* program guide and send it to D*. My local that I am having the problem with say's their info is correct, but I haven't been told whether they have suppied the "service" with the info that was updated in February. So, the problem could be anywhere.

The audio problem seems to be happening in more than one DMA, so I would suspect a fumbly fingered typist at the "service".

I hope you can all follow this. I got confused trying to write it down!

But, then again, us old guys have an excuse <grin>.