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Call of Duty Black Op will out sell Halo Reach on 360 alone

kamspy
05-18-2010, 02:25 PM
Make your predictions here! We're talking YTD 2010 NPD numbers here folks!

Maybe we can even get a few friendly wagers going (were ya at sobes?!)



We're talking 360 platform only, so no PS3 sales will be included in the results for this.

Damn it! Meant to make this a poll thread.

So copy and paste a vote!

COD7 will outsell Halo Reach

Halo Reach will outsell COD7

I'm a PS3 Fangirl and just want to troll this thread.

Pinoy
05-18-2010, 02:34 PM
I'm a PS3 Fangirl and just want to troll this thread.
:what:



Just kidding. From what I played of the Reach Beta and knowing Halo's rabid fanbase I'm gonna have to go with: Halo Reach will outsell COD7



Of course I haven't played or seen much of cod7 so...

kamspy
05-18-2010, 02:37 PM
Yeah I think COD has transcended hardcore gaming while Halo has only reached critical mass among the hardcore.

I'm shocked at how many people I know bought a 360 just for COD, or dusted it off just for COD. They don't have any interest in a sci-fi shooter.

COD7 will outsell Halo Reach

Quality doesn't play much of a factor. As long as COD7 just adds new maps and weapons to MW2, it will outsell Reach IMO.

MikeRox
05-18-2010, 03:10 PM
I don't know, as MW2 pissed off quite a lot of the MW fanbase. We shall see, but I'd like to think Halo Reach will be the better selling of the two.

eiger
05-18-2010, 03:15 PM
Reach will piss on Black Op.

II SAL II
05-18-2010, 03:20 PM
Zombies !!!

MikeRox
05-18-2010, 03:23 PM
Nazi Zombies?

Razor05
05-18-2010, 04:08 PM
I'm going with Halo Reach. The Halo series has been a huge seller for the 360 and I see Reach doing the same or even better. COD Black Op will do probably do well overall on all the consoles. Heh ok now Kam, start a poll with Black Op against a PS3 game. You know, some PS3 flagship title. ;)

kamspy
05-18-2010, 04:21 PM
There isn't a PS3 flagship title big enough to even compete.:what:

Even if GT5 was confirmed for this year I wouldn't put it above COD7 in sales 2010 YTD. (but I do think GT5 would have higher lifetime sales. GT games have legs)

kamspy
05-18-2010, 04:25 PM
Reach will piss on Black Op.

I smell a bet.

How many million does "piss" constitute?

We can bet a $60 retail game on the outcome if you'd like.

Only NPD will be used, and if Reach ends up in a bundle we'd have to come to some sort of agreement since NPD counts bundled units.

MikeRox
05-18-2010, 04:30 PM
I'm going with Halo Reach. The Halo series has been a huge seller for the 360 and I see Reach doing the same or even better. COD Black Op will do probably do well overall on all the consoles. Heh ok now Kam, start a poll with Black Op against a PS3 game. You know, some PS3 flagship title. ;)

lol, no point really, we all know the PS3 ver of Black Op will outsell ANY flagship PS3 title :p

Razor05
05-18-2010, 05:04 PM
totally agree

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4tfMzTi8-U

Please comment :D

Please explain...girlfriend? ;)

MikeRox
05-18-2010, 05:06 PM
He should be so lucky :p *runs*

PFC5
05-18-2010, 08:05 PM
Nazi Zombies?

Vietcong Zombies. :D

Mase
05-18-2010, 08:28 PM
If this were a modern COD I would say it would be close, but I think peopl will be sitting this one out. People are already pretty pissed off at the brand and WaW from what I recall did not sell as well as cod4 or mw2...

Reach will do big numbers, but I don't think it will be as big as Halo 3 as that crowd has shifted to other impressive shooters. Back when Halo 3 launched there wasn't as many quality shooters and now there are quite a few sooo..

it's hard to call, I will give it to Reach but I honestly don't expect blockbuster type #s like their past installments. Also reach is out sep 25th and cod comes out mid november

bruceames
05-18-2010, 08:55 PM
Halo Reach will easily outsell COD7, probably 1.5:1 or more. Halo only comes out once every two years (or so) while COD every year, so more people will be anxious for Halo for that reason alone.

Cygnus
05-18-2010, 09:10 PM
I think HR will outsell COD for these reasons: 1. very successful beta, 2. MS plans to heavily promote HR, 3. its release in sept vs COD nov date, 4. backlash for IW fiasco. What other big name multiplayer FPS is scheduled this fall? Ghost Recon has been delayed until 2011. Is MoH being released this year?

amdgamer
05-18-2010, 09:18 PM
I think HR will outsell COD for these reasons: 1. very successful beta, 2. MS plans to heavily promote HR, 3. its release in sept vs COD nov date, 4. backlash for IW fiasco. What other big name multiplayer FPS is scheduled this fall? Ghost Recon has been delayed until 2011. Is MoH being released this year?

Here is my prediction. Halo Reach is going to sell hot and sell early. If the reviews for the new COD game are meh, then Halo Reach will maintain a sales lead. If the reviews for COD are raving, then COD will outsell Halo Reach eventually.

I have no plans for picking up another COD game as I stayed clear of MW2. I am a huge fan of the single player component as I rarely play online, and havn't even renewed my gold membership in a while now. I suspect i'll be renewing very soon as Red Dead Redemption will be my next purchase if I ever manage to finish FFXIII. Right now, i'm just frustrated as hell with some of these sadistic boss fights in that game............

eiger
05-18-2010, 11:20 PM
I smell a bet.

How many million does "piss" constitute?

We can bet a $60 retail game on the outcome if you'd like.

Only NPD will be used, and if Reach ends up in a bundle we'd have to come to some sort of agreement since NPD counts bundled units.

Halo 3 did 170 million in 24hrs.

I will bet you the retail cost of a new title ($60) that Reach will outsell Black Ops on launch day in terms of gross revenue. That's one bet.

Another bet would be the margin between the two titles.

BeeF
05-18-2010, 11:39 PM
Halo 3 sold like 8.1 millions copies on one console, MW2 sold like 10 million on two consoles. Halo 3 also sold 4 million before ever being released... on one console. Considering how great the beta for Reach is and the fact that is the next big staple release in the Halo series, it will without a doubt outsell black ops, on one console. Also considering that PS3's have become much more popular lately more people might be buying on the PS3 which might hurt the poll.

Reach will outsell COD7

sufs
05-19-2010, 12:23 AM
I'm changing the poll selections and going with eiger in that Halo Reach will Piss on Black Ops LOL. I would bet except I know for certain that Reach is going to get it's own bundle which will skew numbers IMO.

Imperial
05-19-2010, 02:04 AM
Halo Reach will outsell COD7
Simply because of all the issues with MW2

kamspy
05-19-2010, 02:24 AM
Halo 3 sold like 8.1 millions copies on one console, MW2 sold like 10 million on two consoles. Halo 3 also sold 4 million before ever being released... on one console. Considering how great the beta for Reach is and the fact that is the next big staple release in the Halo series, it will without a doubt outsell black ops, on one console. Also considering that PS3's have become much more popular lately more people might be buying on the PS3 which might hurt the poll.

Reach will outsell COD7

MW2 has surpassed Halo 3 as the best selling 360 game.

How many did ODST do? Because to JoeSixPack, That's as much a full on Halo sequel as Reach. (both non numbered editions).

Sure MW2 alienated some fans, but I still wager they picked up more new fans than lost fans. Not to mention that Activision will likely tie a CD Key to COD7 MP accounts, so discount the used market on the game and I just don't see a scenario where Halo outsells COD here.

kamspy
05-19-2010, 02:37 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UMEa2kk1EEg

Goodnight Halo!

PFC5
05-19-2010, 03:51 AM
I saw the Blackbird in that trailer. That alone is just too cool and I hope that is the spy plane used it this version. Even if you only glimpse it, that is just an awesome plane.

MikeRox
05-19-2010, 05:54 AM
Halo 3 sold like 8.1 millions copies on one console, MW2 sold like 10 million on two consoles.


MW2 has sold 10.7m units on 360 and a further 7.85m on PS3. Heck the PS3 ver isn't far off outselling Halo 3 now.

drbrosco
05-19-2010, 06:26 AM
Sory if this is a dumb question but where is this game's battle taking place at?

From the very 1st little 15 second teaser trailer I was sure it was Vietnam, but when I watched the new video it shows them in snowy places.....there wasn't no snowy places in Vietnam was there???

II SAL II
05-19-2010, 07:13 AM
Sory if this is a dumb question but where is this game's battle taking place at?

From the very 1st little 15 second teaser trailer I was sure it was Vietnam, but when I watched the new video it shows them in snowy places.....there wasn't no snowy places in Vietnam was there??? there are talks that it will take place over several different years. like starting out in NAM and then moving throught eh 80's during the cold war all the way up to modern day. as for this game beating Halo i dont think it will outsell Halo. although i think it should, i dont think it will.

BeeF
05-19-2010, 08:47 PM
MW2 has sold 10.7m units on 360 and a further 7.85m on PS3. Heck the PS3 ver isn't far off outselling Halo 3 now.

I had read that 10.7 or so was the total amount sold on both units. (Which I now know is way off)

Nonetheless, I keep hearing so many people on a lot of different websites (and people in my own life) piss and moan about MW2, which I personally enjoyed (just got sick of it after a while). Bungie has a very dedicated fan base and has given it's fans little reason to lose their loyalty. That along with a brand new multiplayer coming out and a story that Halo fans know should be pretty cool, and a beta that kicks a lot of ass, I think Halo has a pretty good chance here.

I can't find any published websites, but wikipedia is still telling me that Halo 3 is the top selling game on 360.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_best-selling_video_games

BeeF
05-19-2010, 09:11 PM
Here we go, this is more credible: http://vgchartz.com/worldtotals.php?console=X360

So according to this, worldwide, Halo 3 barely outsells MW2 on 360 alone.

Mase
05-20-2010, 03:34 AM
I thought we had some threads showing that Halo 3 had topped 10 million sold, that was at least 6 months ago...

Anyways, Reach will outsell COD in the short time it is out for 2010..

Razor05
05-20-2010, 09:30 AM
I thought we had some threads showing that Halo 3 had topped 10 million sold, that was at least 6 months ago...

Anyways, Reach will outsell COD in the short time it is out for 2010..

You are probably right. As of Jan 3, 2008, Halo 3 has sold 8.1 million copies (Wikipedia). I can see Reach surpassing that.

BeeF
05-20-2010, 11:18 AM
I thought we had some threads showing that Halo 3 had topped 10 million sold, that was at least 6 months ago...

Anyways, Reach will outsell COD in the short time it is out for 2010..

My link shows that it has.

Bigloww
05-20-2010, 11:23 AM
Reach is gonna smash COD7... Bigtime.. Into many tinny bits that lag and glitch all over the place..

BeeF
05-20-2010, 11:31 AM
Also considering the numbers for the last game made by Treayarch things might also not look so great.

But I know, I know, who can say with certainty that's because it was Treyarch and not another stupid WWII game.

Razor05
05-20-2010, 11:37 AM
Also considering the numbers for the last game made by Treayarch things might also not look so great.

But I know, I know, who can say with certainty that's because it was Treyarch and not another stupid WWII game.

My feelings exactly. Can we move on to something different, say Vietnam or Gulf war. I read somewhere before that there was alot of mail against creating a Gulf war game. IMO if that's the case then there shouldn't be any war games at all depicting previous confrontations.

BeeF
05-20-2010, 11:52 AM
This is also interesting, look at this: http://vgchartz.com/swlaunch.php?reg1=All&game1=Halo+3+-+X360[6964]&reg2=All&game2=Call+of+Duty+4%3A+Modern+Warfare+-+X360[7316]&reg3=All&game3=Call+of+Duty%3A+Modern+Warfare+2+-+X360[28848]&weeks=150

This doesn't help my case really because it shows that at the same point in time relative to their release MW2 was beating Halo 3 by about 3.1 million units. Its just really cool how you can make your own graphs of games on this site.

Well... I can't show you the graph I made but click on the link and you can make your own.

PFC5
05-20-2010, 11:59 AM
My feelings exactly. Can we move on to something different, say Vietnam or Gulf war. I read somewhere before that there was alot of mail against creating a Gulf war game. IMO if that's the case then there shouldn't be any war games at all depicting previous confrontations.

I think it has more to do with it STILL being an ongoing war with soldiers dying in real life for a reason not to do a Gulf War version. I can understand that.

MikeRox
05-20-2010, 12:02 PM
One thing with sales though... they aren't a reflection on the quality of either game :)

I expect Reach to be by far the better product. I just think Call of Duty currently has by far the bigger brand recognition now. Black Ops is already getting the same sort of hype campaign MW2 had that was IMO the reason it was such a massive seller. Halo Reach is out far earlier, yet Black Ops has already got bigger retailer exposure. Part of this will be the fact that it is multi platform mind.

Razor05
05-20-2010, 12:06 PM
I think it has more to do with it STILL being an ongoing war with soldiers dying in real life for a reason not to do a Gulf War version. I can understand that.

I can agree with that though. If it's something ongoing, then it should be frowned upon.

kamspy
05-20-2010, 02:03 PM
A lot of people in this thread are confusing quality with mass consumer appeal.

I'm not doubting Reach will be layers better than COD7, but it won't outsell it in 2010.

MikeRox
05-20-2010, 03:38 PM
dammit kam, always nicking my posts but using far fewer words :p stop Americanising my posts! :D

Razor05
05-20-2010, 03:42 PM
A lot of people in this thread are confusing quality with mass consumer appeal.

I'm not doubting Reach will be layers better than COD7, but it won't outsell it in 2010.

I have no confusion at all. Reach has quality and consumer appeal. I still feel Halo has a bigger appeal on the 360 than COD. Of course COD might have a bigger audience on all systems, that's a given, but Halo is the Xbox baby. :yippee::thumbsup::bowdown::D

MikeRox
05-20-2010, 03:45 PM
I have no confusion at all. Reach has quality and consumer appeal. I still feel Halo has a bigger appeal on the 360 than COD. Of course COD might have a bigger audience on all systems, that's a given, but Halo is the Xbox baby. :yippee::thumbsup::bowdown::D

That applied to the original Xbox, but the 360 has attracted a wider audience and so CODs appeal on the 360 is IMO larger than Halo's. Halo was the big title of 2007, Black Ops is of equal presence in 2010.

It's about time the Xbox suffered the same issue as other consoles in that the best games aren't the best selling titles :p

kamspy
05-20-2010, 04:39 PM
The COD series has outsold the Halo series on 360 by a considerable margin to this point.

Razor05
05-20-2010, 08:28 PM
That applied to the original Xbox, but the 360 has attracted a wider audience and so CODs appeal on the 360 is IMO larger than Halo's. Halo was the big title of 2007, Black Ops is of equal presence in 2010.

It's about time the Xbox suffered the same issue as other consoles in that the best games aren't the best selling titles :p

Keep hoping there Mike.;)

Razor05
05-20-2010, 08:29 PM
The COD series has outsold the Halo series on 360 by a considerable margin to this point.

Links?

kamspy
05-20-2010, 08:33 PM
Well, consider that MW2 did 10m on 360 and COD4 did around 8m, I'm sure [email protected], COD3 and COD2 make up any difference between those and Halo 3, ODST and Halo Wars.

PFC5
05-20-2010, 10:20 PM
[email protected] did about 6 mill on the 360 from the earlier link posted also. I think COD2 was listed as well, but do not remember the sales # on the 360, but I think it was almost 3mil.

EDIT: here is the earlier link:

http://vgchartz.com/worldtotals.php?console=X360

MikeRox
05-21-2010, 05:38 AM
Keep hoping there Mike.;)

It won't be a global success until that's the case ;) Everybody knows the mainstream don't base their decisions on quality. I'm sure you love that example to explain the Wii's success and the fact that the 360 is the slowest selling of the current systems.

Razor05
05-21-2010, 08:59 AM
It won't be a global success until that's the case ;) Everybody knows the mainstream don't base their decisions on quality. I'm sure you love that example to explain the Wii's success and the fact that the 360 is the slowest selling of the current systems.

Your exactly correct there Mike. That's a prime example of where you don't need quality to have sales. ;) :D

MikeRox
05-21-2010, 05:34 PM
I knew you'd like that example :D :thumbsup:

Razor05
05-21-2010, 07:07 PM
I knew you'd like that example :D :thumbsup:

Sure did. ;) As that saying goes Mike, beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Who are we to say what's good or not...let the masses speak. ;)

MikeRox
05-22-2010, 05:41 AM
Well it's not just beauty is in the eye of the beholder, there are many other factors involved in why one product's sales are different to another's ;)

You should remember that when commenting on Wii games in the future though :D

Razor05
05-22-2010, 08:32 AM
Well it's not just beauty is in the eye of the beholder, there are many other factors involved in why one product's sales are different to another's ;)

You should remember that when commenting on Wii games in the future though :D

I know, my point being was just let the masses choose, however that may be. Your right, I shouldn't include things that aren't really there.:D;)

BeeF
05-23-2010, 01:15 AM
The COD series has outsold the Halo series on 360 by a considerable margin to this point.

Take a look at my link from earlier...

kamspy
05-23-2010, 12:33 PM
Take a look at my link from earlier...

So 8m for Halo 3 and 3m for Halo ODST?

Well COD beats that with just COD4 and [email protected]

patrickf0345
05-23-2010, 07:39 PM
Having collected and played all games in both series I have no doubt Reach will out sell Black ops . After playing the beta bungie really stepped it up from ODST . treyarch on the other hand would really have to step up to the plate with something remarkable . But let’s face it we all know that they have a long way to go. Now if infinity ward had made Black ops I think this would be a different story.

BeeF
05-24-2010, 01:47 AM
So 8m for Halo 3 and 3m for Halo ODST?

Well COD beats that with just COD4 and [email protected]

Maybe try clicking on it and reading it. 10.9 for Halo 3 10.7 for MW2, on 360 alone. Halo 3 is still the top selling game on Xbox 360.

MikeRox
05-24-2010, 05:26 AM
Maybe try clicking on it and reading it. 10.9 for Halo 3 10.7 for MW2, on 360 alone. Halo 3 is still the top selling game on Xbox 360.

Won't be in a few weeks then. MW2 still sells 50k+ a week and unlike Halo 3 hasn't been on the market nearly 3 years, much of that time as a budget title ;)

BeeF
05-24-2010, 11:52 AM
Won't be in a few weeks then. MW2 still sells 50k+ a week and unlike Halo 3 hasn't been on the market nearly 3 years, much of that time as a budget title ;)

Yeah I know, but it still has sold more as of now.

kamspy
05-24-2010, 08:38 PM
Maybe try clicking on it and reading it. 10.9 for Halo 3 10.7 for MW2, on 360 alone. Halo 3 is still the top selling game on Xbox 360.

Oh, I did. I just only acknowledge NPD though. vgchartzzzz doesn't do it for me.:what:

kamspy
05-24-2010, 08:41 PM
You guy forget that 9.9 million of the 10 million people who bought Modern Warfare 2 couldn't tell you what an Infinity Ward or a Treyarch is.

Also, again, for new comers to the thread: Quality ≠ sales. No one is arguing that COD7 will better than Reach in terms of quality.

BeeF
05-24-2010, 08:51 PM
Oh, I did. I just only acknowledge NPD though. vgchartzzzz doesn't do it for me.:what:

Well then how about a link? Cause I think everyone can agree that 8.1 is the figure from 2008 for Halo 3.

Unless I missed one in the thread, in that case I honestly apologize.

MikeRox
05-25-2010, 05:45 AM
Oh, I did. I just only acknowledge NPD though. vgchartzzzz doesn't do it for me.:what:

NPD give no results outside America though. That leaves out a lot of the market.

kamspy
05-25-2010, 01:05 PM
NPD give no results outside America though. That leaves out a lot of the market.

What is this 'outside America' you're talking about?

Is it a location in a JRR Tokien novel?

BeeF
05-25-2010, 03:22 PM
What is this 'outside America' you're talking about?

Is it a location in a JRR Tokien novel?

I believe that can be quickly interpreted as they don't tally sales outside of the American market.

Considering that I'm the only one thus far who has provided a link with numbers, Halo 3 is still the obvious top seller for 360.

MikeRox
05-25-2010, 03:29 PM
Well Chart Track etc that operate in First World Countries :p don't release actual sales figures, so a lot of guess work is involved when giving worldwide totals.

kamspy
05-26-2010, 02:10 PM
NPD are the only numbers that are made with had data.

VGchartz has zero credibility since they were called out on how they calculate their data.

But since you REALLY want to know, I shot a PM to an NPD crazy over at NeoGAF. I'll get ya the Halo 3 LTD numbers once he get's back to me.

BeeF
05-26-2010, 04:51 PM
I realize vgchartz has no credibility, you can't completely trust wikipedia either. However you can find credible websites with Halo 3's numbers for 2008 at 8.1.

Cygnus
05-26-2010, 05:23 PM
This link (http://www.gamespot.com/news/6184291.html)indicates that MS mentioned halo 3 sold 8.1 million worldwide by january 2008.

kamspy
11-09-2010, 04:13 PM
bump.

It's hard being this right all the time.

John Rambo
11-09-2010, 04:36 PM
How were you right all this time? Has Black Ops (360) already sold more copies than Halo Reach?

Link please?

kamspy
11-09-2010, 04:48 PM
Care for a wager?

> 2.2 Million playing on XBox Live right now. Most I've ever seen on a game just a few hours old.

John Rambo
11-09-2010, 06:12 PM
Care for a wager?

> 2.2 Million playing on XBox Live right now. Most I've ever seen on a game just a few hours old.

No I don't. In fact, I expect Call of Duty to surpass Halo Reach eventually. Call of Duty appeals to a more generic crowd of gamer in my opinion. There's almost no learning curve, and its very easy to get the hang of. Halo is not nice to newbies. The formula is more nuanced and more appreciated by the hardcore Halo fan, and much less by the casual gamer.

Plus, the Call of Duty franchise has been growing exponentially for a few years now. There was a time where Halo sales would be a reasonable fight for Call of Duty sales on all 3 platforms, but Call of Duty has just grown way too rapidly. Its like the GTA of shooters. Everyone buys GTA, and everyone buys Call of Duty.

On the other hand, I, and many others, were displeased by Modern Warfare 2, so while I doubt this will happen, I would not be surprised if Black Ops didn't have the total sales of MW2. Reviewers certainly don't seem to like Black Ops as much as COD4/MW2

kamspy
11-09-2010, 06:54 PM
I'm not a big fan of where COD is at today either. I'll play Black Ops, but I remember when COD was about authenticity. It's what made COD4 so cool, because it blurred the line just a teeny tiny little bit. Now we got futuristic space marines in COD8 and this AWESOMETOWN, U.S.A. 1972 thing going on with Black Ops.

I loved reading the COD1 previews where IW was talking about going to a shooting range and recording all the real gun sounds and impact sounds unique to different materials, etc. Now it's all Zombies and Killstreaks.


It's a sales monster though, so it intrigues me. It's also not "bad". It's like a cheap Will Smith summer action movie type of appeal. It's also by far the best looking shooter on consoles, and by default the best playing. Twice as responsive as Halo Reach. Mathematically, not figuratively. ;)

John Rambo
11-09-2010, 09:10 PM
I'm not a big fan of where COD is at today either. I'll play Black Ops, but I remember when COD was about authenticity. It's what made COD4 so cool, because it blurred the line just a teeny tiny little bit. Now we got futuristic space marines in COD8 and this AWESOMETOWN, U.S.A. 1972 thing going on with Black Ops.

I loved reading the COD1 previews where IW was talking about going to a shooting range and recording all the real gun sounds and impact sounds unique to different materials, etc. Now it's all Zombies and Killstreaks.


It's a sales monster though, so it intrigues me. It's also not "bad". It's like a cheap Will Smith summer action movie type of appeal. It's also by far the best looking shooter on consoles, and by default the best playing. Twice as responsive as Halo Reach. Mathematically, not figuratively. ;)

Best looking? Yes. Best playing? If you're talking in terms of your control over your character, not even close. Halo still dominates this area by far. That's the only reason why I like Halo over COD. Its not because I have some strange affection for aliens and imaginary armor. The controls/aiming is the best of any game ever. By far. And then some.

Call of Duty series I would say is a distant second. This is fact and cannot be disputed.

kamspy
11-09-2010, 09:22 PM
The "feel" of the game is subjective. The responsiveness of player input is not. 60fps > 30fps. ~Twice as responsive.

Also, COD wins the other speed game. You can go from booting the game to boots on the ground in around 60 seconds. That is, IMO, amazing coding.

John Rambo
11-09-2010, 09:32 PM
The "feel" of the game is subjective. The responsiveness of player input is not. 60fps > 30fps. ~Twice as responsive.

Also, COD wins the other speed game. You can go from booting the game to boots on the ground in around 60 seconds. That is, IMO, amazing coding.

Yes, that is good. 60 FPS owns Halo. Halo looks like a broken movie reel after playing COD, and the turnaround time from game to game is insane.

HOWEVER... The aiming mechanics in Halo, and the flawless integration of subtle yet amazing auto-aim functionality is light years ahead of any other console game. Even from game to game, you can see MAJOR differences in how the aiming system was implemented. In Halo 2, I was a LETHAL sniper. If I got my hands on a sniper rifle, it was an automatic 10 kills in a row. Halo 3 had an aiming scheme that moved it more in the direction of COD games; less friction around heads... I was downright WORTHLESS with a sniper rifle.

Stopped playing Halo 3 altogether, and one day Reach comes along, with Halo 2 style sniping, and once again, I'm a sniping monster. Didn't even take any practice. Sweeping headshots left and right, don't even think twice. You can't do that kind of stuff in Call of Duty.

kamspy
11-09-2010, 09:37 PM
I can appreciate some good auto aim. I regularly advocate it whenever some infers that auto aim breaks a shooter.

But as a mouse guy, I can only appreciate it so much. I can see the appeal of Halo. It's just not my kind of game. To me it's slow paced, which for me needs to be a one hit kill game like Rainbow 6, Ghost Recon, ArmA 2 or SWAT 4.

usually in my experience bullet sponge games are very fast paced. Unreal, Quake, TF2 etc.

But I can see the appeal and appreciate the work Bungie did.

kamspy
11-10-2010, 02:51 PM
7 million copies on day 1.

Where's the crow people?

:D

kamspy
11-10-2010, 02:53 PM
Reach will piss on Black Op.

I'm going with Halo Reach. The Halo series has been a huge seller for the 360 and I see Reach doing the same or even better. COD Black Op will do probably do well overall on all the consoles. Heh ok now Kam, start a poll with Black Op against a PS3 game. You know, some PS3 flagship title. ;)

If this were a modern COD I would say it would be close, but I think peopl will be sitting this one out. People are already pretty pissed off at the brand and WaW from what I recall did not sell as well as cod4 or mw2...

Reach will do big numbers, but I don't think it will be as big as Halo 3 as that crowd has shifted to other impressive shooters. Back when Halo 3 launched there wasn't as many quality shooters and now there are quite a few sooo..

it's hard to call, I will give it to Reach but I honestly don't expect blockbuster type #s like their past installments. Also reach is out sep 25th and cod comes out mid november

Halo Reach will easily outsell COD7, probably 1.5:1 or more. Halo only comes out once every two years (or so) while COD every year, so more people will be anxious for Halo for that reason alone.

I think HR will outsell COD for these reasons: 1. very successful beta, 2. MS plans to heavily promote HR, 3. its release in sept vs COD nov date, 4. backlash for IW fiasco. What other big name multiplayer FPS is scheduled this fall? Ghost Recon has been delayed until 2011. Is MoH being released this year?

Here is my prediction. Halo Reach is going to sell hot and sell early. If the reviews for the new COD game are meh, then Halo Reach will maintain a sales lead. If the reviews for COD are raving, then COD will outsell Halo Reach eventually.

I have no plans for picking up another COD game as I stayed clear of MW2. I am a huge fan of the single player component as I rarely play online, and havn't even renewed my gold membership in a while now. I suspect i'll be renewing very soon as Red Dead Redemption will be my next purchase if I ever manage to finish FFXIII. Right now, i'm just frustrated as hell with some of these sadistic boss fights in that game............

Halo 3 sold like 8.1 millions copies on one console, MW2 sold like 10 million on two consoles. Halo 3 also sold 4 million before ever being released... on one console. Considering how great the beta for Reach is and the fact that is the next big staple release in the Halo series, it will without a doubt outsell black ops, on one console. Also considering that PS3's have become much more popular lately more people might be buying on the PS3 which might hurt the poll.

Reach will outsell COD7

I'm changing the poll selections and going with eiger in that Halo Reach will Piss on Black Ops LOL. I would bet except I know for certain that Reach is going to get it's own bundle which will skew numbers IMO.

Halo Reach will outsell COD7
Simply because of all the issues with MW2

Reach is gonna smash COD7... Bigtime.. Into many tinny bits that lag and glitch all over the place..

You can start the line here.

House72
11-10-2010, 03:26 PM
Is there a point to which game sells more?? More doesn't mean better all the time, right?? I just don't get why people get wrapped up in which game sells more, unless you're getting a cut of the profits, then by all means I see a concern..

I can prob assume that no one here is getting a profit from the game, what's the deal then with who sells more???. To me it's like whose got a bigger D$$k contest..

Razor05
11-10-2010, 03:40 PM
Is there a point to which game sells more?? More doesn't mean better all the time, right?? I just don't get why people get wrapped up in which game sells more, unless you're getting a cut of the profits, then by all means I see a concern..

I can prob assume that no one here is getting a profit from the game, what's the deal then with who sells more???. To me it's like whose got a bigger D$$k contest..

Alot of times it's just used to troll. Easy to spot. The same people will always hit the same game or company.

House72
11-10-2010, 03:49 PM
Alot of times it's just used to troll. Easy to spot. The same people will always hit the same game or company.

I thought that was the reason, but thought maybe I was missing something.. :what::what:

People do get heated over what game sells more though, wow.. :busy::busy::gamer:gamer

Pinoy
11-10-2010, 05:07 PM
7 million copies on day 1.

Where's the crow people?

:D

Wait... BO sold 7 million on the 360 alone? Or is that both platforms?

kharaa
11-10-2010, 05:53 PM
http://www.csmonitor.com/Innovation/Horizons/2010/1110/Call-of-Duty-Black-Ops-reportedly-breaks-one-day-sales-record

Call of Duty: Black Ops is the fastest-selling video game of all time – to the tune of over 7 million units sold – according to an early analysis by the gaming site VGChartz. That makes the launch of Black Ops even more successful than the launch of Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2, the last installment in the popular Call of Duty franchise – and the most successful entertainment launch ever.

"If the 7 million for Black Ops holds true, it would make the launch around 10 percent larger than Modern Warfare 2 and the biggest of all time," Brett Walton of VGChartz wrote earlier today. Walton breaks down the 7 million thusly: 3.6 million units in the US, 1.4 in the UK, "over a million units in continental Europe," and 350K units in Canada. 59 percent of Black Ops units were sold for the Xbox 360; the rest were sold for the PS3, the PC, the Wii, and the DS.

So, 7 million, 59 percent is.. 4.130 million copies,

railven
11-10-2010, 07:26 PM
http://www.csmonitor.com/Innovation/Horizons/2010/1110/Call-of-Duty-Black-Ops-reportedly-breaks-one-day-sales-record





So, 7 million, 59 percent is.. 4.130 million copies,

What were Halo Reach numbers for day one?

Haha gotta love :spam:spy haha. He knows how to ruffle the local xbot feathers.

kamspy
11-10-2010, 07:26 PM
Reach is at 5.84 Mil... I think Blops will make up the difference.

Damn VGChartzzz numbers. Come back NPD!

railven
11-10-2010, 07:31 PM
Reach is at 5.84 Mil... I think Blops will make up the difference.

Damn VGChartzzz numbers. Come back NPD!

Was that day one, first 72 hours, or week one for Halo Reach numbers?

Even so, wow give or take 1.5 million difference between the only reason to own an Xbox - Halo, and the best FPS franchise of all history next to Couter Strike - Call of Duty.

I'd still take CoD over any Halo. Well, maybe I'd take Halo 2 over any CoD...hmmm...

CoD4: MW vs Halo 2. Hard to pick. Halo 3 and Reach Around can die in a fire with MW2.

kamspy
11-10-2010, 07:32 PM
That's YTD Reach numbers. Well, chartzzz numbers, but that's all we have to go by these days.

Oh and COD 4 > Any Halo

railven
11-10-2010, 07:35 PM
That's YTD Reach numbers. Well, chartzzz numbers, but that's all we have to go by these days.

Oh and COD 4 > Any Halo

Oh snap that is YTD!? Jesus that is awful. Didn't Halo 3 sell that many in its first week? No one buys Halo after the first month. The used sales cannibalize the fuck out of it.

You can set VGcharts to do day 1 sales.

Well, if those are YTD Halo Reach got pwned!

EDIT: How many people you think traded in Halo Reach for Black Ops? haha.

Mase
11-10-2010, 08:27 PM
Calling Reachs numbers bad is kinda odd, BlackOps certainly sold a lot and the 360 took the lions share. I know at BestBuy the 360 piles were easily 5-6 times more than the PS3 and do people even buy PC games at retail stores anymore?

Anyways Blackops will definitely surpass Reach in sales, both will sell a shbitload but cod will win out. My co-workers who don't game picked it up and some bought 360s just to play it. This game is pulling in the casual crowd

railven
11-10-2010, 08:48 PM
Calling Reachs numbers bad is kinda odd, BlackOps certainly sold a lot and the 360 took the lions share. I know at BestBuy the 360 piles were easily 5-6 times more than the PS3 and do people even buy PC games at retail stores anymore?

Anyways Blackops will definitely surpass Reach in sales, both will sell a shbitload but cod will win out. My co-workers who don't game picked it up and some bought 360s just to play it. This game is pulling in the casual crowd

I called it bad in reference to Halo 3. I remember Halo 3 doing more than that in its first week (I could be wrong of course.) Reach has been out for a few months now.

I'm not turning this into a PS3 vs 360 vs PC fight, just pure Call of Duty versus Halo.

In that respect, for me CoD has always been the bigger/better franchise. I just didn't expect it to unseat Halo as the number 1 360 FPS franchise.

John Rambo
11-10-2010, 08:53 PM
Was that day one, first 72 hours, or week one for Halo Reach numbers?

Even so, wow give or take 1.5 million difference between the only reason to own an Xbox - Halo, and the best FPS franchise of all history next to Couter Strike - Call of Duty.

I'd still take CoD over any Halo. Well, maybe I'd take Halo 2 over any CoD...hmmm...

CoD4: MW vs Halo 2. Hard to pick. Halo 3 and Reach Around can die in a fire with MW2.

Have you ever played Reach? Even once? Or are you a hate merchant? Reach plays very much like 2. Not that you'd know.

John Rambo
11-10-2010, 09:00 PM
That's YTD Reach numbers. Well, chartzzz numbers, but that's all we have to go by these days.

Oh and COD 4 > Any Halo

Wrong as usual

COD4 = 8.47m
Halo 3 = 11.22m

(Hint: this is when you start attacking VGChartz' accuracy) :lol:

kharaa
11-10-2010, 09:05 PM
I think he ment in quality of the game, not the sales, John.

:P

railven
11-10-2010, 09:12 PM
Have you ever played Reach? Even once? Or are you a hate merchant? Reach plays very much like 2. Not that you'd know.

Yes, I have played Halo Reach. I've also played:
Halo on Xbox and Emulated on Xbox 360
Halo 2 on Xbox and Emulated on Xbox 360
Halo PC
Halo 2 PC
Halo 3
Halo 3: OSDT
Halo Wars
Halo Reach

Halo 2, for me - my opinion registered to Railven, was the pinnacle. None of the other Halos did anything special to make me say "OMG Halo tattoo now!"

Halo Reach doesn't play like Halo 2. Saying that is a complete lie unless you are generalizing and "you use a controller, you aim, and you shoot."

Halo 2 didn't have on the fly cloaking, it didn't have stealth mechanics, stealth take downs, and the advance AI Reach does.

Halo's control scheme hasn't evolved much (which isn't a bad thing, if it ain't broke don't fix it.) In the end, they all feel relatively the same in mechanics (odd I'd say the same thing for Call of Duty, and still I'd praise CoD4:MW as the best CoD to date.) And I doubt I'm in a minority of claiming Halo 2 is the best Halo. From a rock solid SP to crazy MP. Note, that they keep reusing Halo 2 maps in later Halo iterations.

John Rambo
11-10-2010, 09:13 PM
I called it bad in reference to Halo 3. I remember Halo 3 doing more than that in its first week (I could be wrong of course.) Reach has been out for a few months now.

Halo 3 week 1: 3,815,444
Reach week 1: 4,049,971

Halo 3 through week 6: 5,454,487
Reach through week 6: 5,912,738

So no, Halo 3 did not beat Halo Reach in week 1 or through week 6. Reach had a better launch, larger week 1, and larger subsequent weeks up through this point (7 weeks). Its not a huge improvement, but this is all more evidence to my previous point:

Call of Duty appeals to a more generic crowd of gamer in my opinion. There's almost no learning curve, and its very easy to get the hang of. Halo is not nice to newbies. The formula is more nuanced and more appreciated by the hardcore Halo fan, and much less by the casual gamer.



In that respect, for me CoD has always been the bigger/better franchise. I just didn't expect it to unseat Halo as the number 1 360 FPS franchise.

Bigger? Of course; its multi-platform, appeals to even the most simple minded of all creatures, and they release one EVERY YEAR. The Halo franchise has released EIGHT titles on THREE gaming platforms; Xbox, X360, and PC. Call of Duty has released a minimum of THIRTY titles in the same time frame across EIGHT different gaming platforms. Are you honestly surprised that Call of Duty finally surpassed Halo (by a tiny margin) as the highest selling Xbox game? If Halo had THIRTY games across eight platforms, the major releases would sell a hell of a lot more than they do now.

Better? Opinions are like assholes. Everybody has one.

John Rambo
11-10-2010, 09:18 PM
Yes, I have played Halo Reach. I've also played:
Halo on Xbox and Emulated on Xbox 360
Halo 2 on Xbox and Emulated on Xbox 360
Halo PC
Halo 2 PC
Halo 3
Halo 3: OSDT
Halo Wars
Halo Reach

Halo 2, for me - my opinion registered to Railven, was the pinnacle. None of the other Halos did anything special to make me say "OMG Halo tattoo now!"

Halo Reach doesn't play like Halo 2. Saying that is a complete lie unless you are generalizing and "you use a controller, you aim, and you shoot."

Halo 2 didn't have on the fly cloaking, it didn't have stealth mechanics, stealth take downs, and the advance AI Reach does.

Halo's control scheme hasn't evolved much (which isn't a bad thing, if it ain't broke don't fix it.) In the end, they all feel relatively the same in mechanics (odd I'd say the same thing for Call of Duty, and still I'd praise CoD4:MW as the best CoD to date.) And I doubt I'm in a minority of claiming Halo 2 is the best Halo. From a rock solid SP to crazy MP. Note, that they keep reusing Halo 2 maps in later Halo iterations.

No, I think Halo 2 was the best also. In fact, I think it is easily the best game ever made. I played Halo CE online for a couple years through tunnel programs. Then I played about 13,000 games of Halo 2 on XBL over the course of three years. Played maybe 2,000 Halo 3 games. Reach multiplayer feels like Halo 2 to me. The aiming mechanics are very similar, as is the weapon balance, the maps (half of them are Halo 2 maps for christ's sake!)

I loved Halo 2. I'd pay thousands of dollars for a 360 remake with XBL. I didn't like Halo 3 all that much (compared to H2), but I freakin love Reach, for all the same reasons why I loved Halo 2.

railven
11-10-2010, 09:18 PM
Halo 3 week 1: 3,815,444
Reach week 1: 4,049,971

Halo 3 through week 6: 5,454,487
Reach through week 6: 5,912,738

So no, Halo 3 did not beat Halo Reach in week 1 or through week 6. Reach had a better launch, larger week 1, and larger subsequent weeks up through this point (7 weeks). Its not a huge improvement, but this is all more evidence to my previous point:

Why do I remember the numbers being bigger? And of course, I said I could be wrong. Sorry Halo isn't my meaning for living :p

But only 500k sales more considering the giant user base increase in the time frame of releases. That isn't very reassuring.

Bigger? Of course; its multi-platform, appeals to even the most simple minded of all creatures, and they release one EVERY YEAR. The Halo franchise has released EIGHT titles on THREE gaming platforms; Xbox, X360, and PC. Call of Duty has released a minimum of THIRTY titles in the same time frame across EIGHT different gaming platforms. Are you honestly surprised that Call of Duty finally surpassed Halo (by a tiny margin) as the highest selling Xbox game? If Halo had THIRTY games across eight platforms, the major releases would sell a hell of a lot more than they do now.

Better? Opinions are like assholes. Everybody has one.

What? You use multi-platform to justify single platform success? THere is no cross platforming for any of the CoD games. You buy it for X-platform you play it on X-platform. The fact that 360 users are buying CoD in such large numbers is amazing to me considering Xbox is the house of Halo.

Call of Duty is a better franchise, no ifs ands or buts! Sometimes the truth hurts :p just accept it already.

John Rambo
11-10-2010, 09:38 PM
Why do I remember the numbers being bigger? And of course, I said I could be wrong. Sorry Halo isn't my meaning for living :p

But only 500k sales more considering the giant user base increase in the time frame of releases. That isn't very reassuring.

Well its just like I said. I think there are somewhere between 15-20 million Xbox 360 owners who are shooter fans. Those who are Halo fans are long time Halo fans, seeing as Halo isn't the most newbie friendly franchise. Halo Reach wasn't exactly the game to pull in new fans. Everyone I've talked to who played Reach online (and wasn't an avid Halo fan) hated it, because they got slaughtered.

Call of Duty on the other hand is a game that anyone can get into. You have cool guns, you run around and shoot people. Very simple. It doesn't take a butt load of controller-skill or knowledge of the game to be a decent player. You just jump in a game and kill people. You don't have to know that softening someone's shield with a grenade is almost mandatory to get away from a battle alive. Or that a melee attack won't kill someone unless their shield is gone. ANY Halo singleplayer after Halo CE means NOTHING to anyone who hasn't played the entire series. Call of Duty games are all generic. The hero is generic, the battles are generic, if not WWII. Anyone can jump in at any time, so they have a better chance of pulling in that entire shooter-fan pool of players.



What? You use multi-platform to justify single platform success? THere is no cross platforming for any of the CoD games. You buy it for X-platform you play it on X-platform. The fact that 360 users are buying CoD in such large numbers is amazing to me considering Xbox is the house of Halo.

Of course. Its a popularity contest, along with the things I mentioned above. There are tens of millions of console owners who've never played a single Halo game because they don't have access. Word of mouth has a big effect on games, and COD is played by more people, and the word undoubtedly spreads farther.

But lets ignore the other consoles. On Xbox 360, there have been SEVEN Call of Duty titles, and their sales have increased with each release, due to increased buzz, popularity, etc. There have only been THREE Halo titles, so they haven't had the same kind of rapid growth.

Toyota might make a better full sized truck than Ford or Chevy, but the Ford F-150 and Chevy Silverado have been around since the beginning of time. When people think of trucks, they think of Silverados and F-150's, which is why they sell way more than Toyota, even though the Toyota truck MIGHT be better than both of them.


Call of Duty is a better franchise, no ifs ands or buts! Sometimes the truth hurts :p just accept it already.

LOL. I'm not even sure CoD is the best realistic war shooter. Bad Company was awfully fun.

Seriously though, the biggest reason why Call of Duty is so popular as an online game, in my opinion, is because IW copied Halo 2's matchmaking system for COD4. Think about it. COD4 launched Call of Duty into the stratosphere as an online giant and put it among top online console games like Halo 2 and Halo 3. What's the lowest common denominator between those 3? Halo 2's party and matchmaking system. No other games had it at the time. Just those 3. The Party/matchmaking system made the game so much more accessible for friends to play. I really think that was paramount to the franchise's success. That and a shit load of games.

John Rambo
11-10-2010, 09:46 PM
I need to get off this damn forum so I can try out Black Ops!

railven
11-10-2010, 09:53 PM
Well its just like I said. I think there are somewhere between 15-20 million Xbox 360 owners who are shooter fans. Those who are Halo fans are long time Halo fans, seeing as Halo isn't the most newbie friendly franchise. Halo Reach wasn't exactly the game to pull in new fans. Everyone I've talked to who played Reach online (and wasn't an avid Halo fan) hated it, because they got slaughtered.

Call of Duty on the other hand is a game that anyone can get into. You have cool guns, you run around and shoot people. Very simple. It doesn't take a butt load of controller-skill or knowledge of the game to be a decent player. You just jump in a game and kill people. You don't have to know that softening someone's shield with a grenade is almost mandatory to get away from a battle alive. Or that a melee attack won't kill someone unless their shield is gone. ANY Halo singleplayer after Halo CE means NOTHING to anyone who hasn't played the entire series. Call of Duty games are all generic. The hero is generic, the battles are generic, if not WWII. Anyone can jump in at any time, so they have a better chance of pulling in that entire shooter-fan pool of players.

This whole paragraph means absolutely nothing. Any game requires a level of skill to be good. People who play Halo are undoubtfully good. The same for people who play Call of Duty.

Maybe consoles are different (actually they are) but join any clan server on CoD for PC and good luck getting any where. Switch it to hardcore and you're dead in the first few minutes watching spectator cams.

Each game plays differently and his different mechanics. Trying to say one requires more skill that the other based on bias is pointless.

If skill is the requirement for a better experience go play SWAT or maybe Raven Shield. Those games required skill.


Of course. Its a popularity contest, along with the things I mentioned above. There are tens of millions of console owners who've never played a single Halo game because they don't have access. Word of mouth has a big effect on games, and COD is played by more people, and the word undoubtedly spreads farther.

But lets ignore the other consoles. On Xbox 360, there have been SEVEN Call of Duty titles, and their sales have increased with each release, due to increased buzz, popularity, etc. There have only been THREE Halo titles, so they haven't had the same kind of rapid growth.

People don't have access to Halo? How does that even work? The simple point to take away from numbers:
From the point Halo 3 launched to when Halo Reach launched the Xbox 360 user base could have possibly doubled, yet the Halo Franchise only sold 500k units more in the same time period for the two titles.

Yet the CoD games sales climbed with the bigger user base.

You use just the games? What about the Halo Books? Comics? Toys? Call of Duty doesn't have any of those other branches to expand their popularity.
EDIT:
To add to this, Call of Duty on 360 has according to you 7 games, I did some checking and Halo has:
Graphic Novels, novels, animated movie, two generation of toy lines, and a clothing line. Call of Duty at most has endorsed GPUs (CoD edition) and I just saw recently a Jeep. Haha.

Toyota might make a better full sized truck than Ford or Chevy, but the Ford F-150 and Chevy Silverado have been around since the beginning of time. When people think of trucks, they think of Silverados and F-150's, which is why they sell way more than Toyota, even though the Toyota truck MIGHT be better than both of them.

What does this even mean? Halo launched before Call of Duty as a franchise.

LOL. I'm not even sure CoD is the best realistic war shooter. Bad Company was awfully fun.

Seriously though, the biggest reason why Call of Duty is so popular as an online game, in my opinion, is because IW copied Halo 2's matchmaking system for COD4. Think about it. COD4 launched Call of Duty into the stratosphere as an online giant and put it among top online console games like Halo 2 and Halo 3. What's the lowest common denominator between those 3? Halo 2's party and matchmaking system. No other games had it at the time. Just those 3. The Party/matchmaking system made the game so much more accessible for friends to play. I really think that was paramount to the franchise's success. That and a shit load of games.

Who said anything about realism? I don't play games for "realism" and if I were to Halo wouldn't be any where on my list.

You do know Matchmaking isn't new? It has been used in PC gaming since Return to castle Wolfenstein (my first personal experience with a Matchmaking system). You are trying to claim Call of Duties popularity is based on a system Microsoft/Bungie copied from the PC communities and other developers? So I can turn around and say their success is based on the same copy and paste (in fact everything the Xbox series introduces is just a copy of the PC side.)

People keep forgetting Call of Duty existed before Xbox 360 and Xbox Live was a house name product. Call of Duty has enjoyed tremendous popularity in the PC community for years (CoD2 still has very active servers, and CoD4 servers dwarf MW2 servers.)

Call of Duty is still the better franchise and your arguments are all collapsing.

John Rambo
11-10-2010, 10:20 PM
The snap-to target when aiming down the sights appears to be gone on the PC version, even when using the Xbox controller. And the graphics don't appear to be much better than MW2. Lame. Should have bought the Xbox version.

John Rambo
11-10-2010, 10:44 PM
This whole paragraph means absolutely nothing. Any game requires a level of skill to be good. People who play Halo are undoubtfully good. The same for people who play Call of Duty.

Blah blah blah... Yeah, yeah, your opinion is better than mine. Let me guess, halo just sucks right? That's why COD is growing faster? Since you just attempted to shoot down any other logical explanation. Why the hell am I even responding to this? :banghead:

Maybe consoles are different (actually they are) but join any clan server on CoD for PC and good luck getting any where. Switch it to hardcore and you're dead in the first few minutes watching spectator cams.

Oh yeah, the 1 shot kill hide and seek game. That takes TOTAL MASTERY of the dual analog joystick in order to be good.

That, or a good hiding spot. :lol:

You're confusing SKILL with PATIENCE

Each game plays differently and his different mechanics. Trying to say one requires more skill that the other based on bias is pointless.

If skill is the requirement for a better experience go play SWAT or maybe Raven Shield. Those games required skill.

Paragraph 1; you explain how saying one requires more skill is bias and pointless

Paragraph 2; you explain how SWAT and Raven Shield require more skill.
:rolleyes:



People don't have access to Halo? How does that even work? The simple point to take away from numbers:
From the point Halo 3 launched to when Halo Reach launched the Xbox 360 user base could have possibly doubled, yet the Halo Franchise only sold 500k units more in the same time period for the two titles.

I know, because Halo sucks. It couldn't possibly have anything to do with what I said before. That would be idiotic.

Yet the CoD games sales climbed with the bigger user base.

You use just the games? What about the Halo Books? Comics? Toys? Call of Duty doesn't have any of those other branches to expand their popularity.
EDIT:
To add to this, Call of Duty on 360 has according to you 7 games, I did some checking and Halo has:
Graphic Novels, novels, animated movie, two generation of toy lines, and a clothing line. Call of Duty at most has endorsed GPUs (CoD edition) and I just saw recently a Jeep. Haha.


Yeah those Halo books and toys really moved copies of the games to kids who otherwise would not have been Halo players :lol:




What does this even mean? Halo launched before Call of Duty as a franchise.

It wasn't the most complex analogy I've used... Think it over and get back to me.



You do know Matchmaking isn't new? It has been used in PC gaming since Return to castle Wolfenstein (my first personal experience with a Matchmaking system). You are trying to claim Call of Duties popularity is based on a system Microsoft/Bungie copied from the PC communities and other developers? So I can turn around and say their success is based on the same copy and paste (in fact everything the Xbox series introduces is just a copy of the PC side.)

Oh, which successful console shooter used a party system and matchmaking before Halo 2?

Oh, some obscure shitty PC game that nobody played once allowed people to search for games? Well fuck Halo! They're just copy-cats! :rolleyes:

People keep forgetting Call of Duty existed before Xbox 360 and Xbox Live was a house name product. Call of Duty has enjoyed tremendous popularity in the PC community for years (CoD2 still has very active servers, and CoD4 servers dwarf MW2 servers.)

Thank you for supporting my point that Call of Duty has a much larger reach and should sell more copies than Halo.


Call of Duty is still the better franchise and your arguments are all collapsing.

Yeah, you did a bang up job of using subjective nonsense to debunk subjective nonsense. Why are we having this conversation?

railven
11-10-2010, 11:45 PM
Blah blah blah... Yeah, yeah, your opinion is better than mine. Let me guess, halo just sucks right? That's why COD is growing faster? Since you just attempted to shoot down any other logical explanation. Why the hell am I even responding to this? :banghead:

Funny, I simply said I prefer CoD more than Halo and you told me I was wrong. SO before you try to claim my opinion is better than anyone's look at who started this whole thing. ;)

And you must lack reading comprehension, I never once said Halo (as a franchise) sucked.


Oh yeah, the 1 shot kill hide and seek game. That takes TOTAL MASTERY of the dual analog joystick in order to be good.

That, or a good hiding spot. :lol:

You're confusing SKILL with PATIENCE

Haha, sure, and Halo requires more than just a well timed grenade? Sure thing :D

Paragraph 1; you explain how saying one requires more skill is bias and pointless

Paragraph 2; you explain how SWAT and Raven Shield require more skill.
:rolleyes:

Again with the lack of reading comprehension. You argued Halo requires more skill, I said it doesn't, and then argued if you want to measure games success by skill go play SWAT or Raven Shield - games that truly require skill.

I know, because Halo sucks. It couldn't possibly have anything to do with what I said before. That would be idiotic.

That one requires more skill than the other? An objective opinion that would be ripped to shred by any person of common sense? Sure, that must be it ;)

Yeah those Halo books and toys really moved copies of the games to kids who otherwise would not have been Halo players :lol:

Okay, so you said one game is more popular because it has 7 iterations to the other 4's and yet you ignore the other branches where one game franchise expands versus the other and yet that is invalid. Talk about dismissing anything that doesn't prove your point.

It wasn't the most complex analogy I've used... Think it over and get back to me.

You're trying to use established brand. Well, I gave examples how Halo is more of an established brand than CoD yet, that doesn't matter. So why should this analogy matter?

Oh, which successful console shooter used a party system and matchmaking before Halo 2?

Oh, some obscure shitty PC game that nobody played once allowed people to search for games? Well fuck Halo! They're just copy-cats! :rolleyes:

Are you kidding me? You're claiming RtCW is an obscure game no one ever played? Holy fuck man you've completely lost all credibility as a gamer. Just go back and play Halo since it is the most important game EVAR!!!

Thank you for supporting my point that Call of Duty has a much larger reach and should sell more copies than Halo.

Sure thing, because Call of Duty greater than Halo :D

Yeah, you did a bang up job of using subjective nonsense to debunk subjective nonsense. Why are we having this conversation?

Look at how I started this response. Again, I simply said I prefer Call of Duty over Halo and you had to defend your precious Master Chief. So, yeah :D

Pinoy
11-11-2010, 01:37 AM
John... did you seriously just call Return to Castle Wolfenstein an 'obscure shitty PC game'? You're kidding right? It's one of the best team based multiplayer games... _EVER_... made.


Other than that you two go on right ahead arguing, don't mind me.

kamspy
11-11-2010, 04:40 AM
Wrong as usual

COD4 = 8.47m
Halo 3 = 11.22m

(Hint: this is when you start attacking VGChartz' accuracy) :lol:

Talking personal preference there. We've already been over those numbers in this thread.

jjufon
11-11-2010, 11:28 AM
Nov. 11 (Bloomberg) -- Activision Blizzard Inc. said “Call of Duty: Black Ops,” the latest version of the best-selling video games, posted $360 million in sales in North America and the U.K. in 24 hours, a record for any entertainment property.

Demand for “Black Ops” surpassed the previous record of $310 million in first-day sales set by last year’s “Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 2,” Santa Monica, California-based Activision said today in a statement.


http://www.businessweek.com/news/2010-11-11/activision-says-call-of-duty-black-ops-sets-record.html

BeeF
11-11-2010, 11:54 AM
Talking personal preference there. We've already been over those numbers in this thread.

ha ha and vgchartz accuracy most certainly was criticized

MikeRox
11-11-2010, 03:19 PM
I wonder how they calculate the sales amounts. Many UK retailers are currently selling Black Ops for a launch price of £25-28 (as opposed to the £49.99 RRP) are they counting these as full price sales as the retailers are taking the hit? Or are they counting them as the price they're being sold at?

John Rambo
11-11-2010, 11:43 PM
Funny, I simply said I prefer CoD more than Halo and you told me I was wrong. SO before you try to claim my opinion is better than anyone's look at who started this whole thing. ;)

And you must lack reading comprehension, I never once said Halo (as a franchise) sucked.

Haha, sure, and Halo requires more than just a well timed grenade? Sure thing :D

Again with the lack of reading comprehension. You argued Halo requires more skill, I said it doesn't, and then argued if you want to measure games success by skill go play SWAT or Raven Shield - games that truly require skill.

That one requires more skill than the other? An objective opinion that would be ripped to shred by any person of common sense? Sure, that must be it ;)

Okay, so you said one game is more popular because it has 7 iterations to the other 4's and yet you ignore the other branches where one game franchise expands versus the other and yet that is invalid. Talk about dismissing anything that doesn't prove your point.

You're trying to use established brand. Well, I gave examples how Halo is more of an established brand than CoD yet, that doesn't matter. So why should this analogy matter?

Are you kidding me? You're claiming RtCW is an obscure game no one ever played? Holy fuck man you've completely lost all credibility as a gamer. Just go back and play Halo since it is the most important game EVAR!!!

Sure thing, because Call of Duty greater than Halo :D

Look at how I started this response. Again, I simply said I prefer Call of Duty over Halo and you had to defend your precious Master Chief. So, yeah :D

No.

John Rambo
11-11-2010, 11:47 PM
John... did you seriously just call Return to Castle Wolfenstein an 'obscure shitty PC game'? You're kidding right? It's one of the best team based multiplayer games... _EVER_... made.


Other than that you two go on right ahead arguing, don't mind me.

Oh.

LOL, yeah, when I think of "games that revolutionized online multiplayer," Return to Castle Wolfenstein is at the top of my list :lol:

John Rambo
11-11-2010, 11:50 PM
Seriously though, what the FUCK. There's no snap-to aim for the Xbox controller in the PC version, so its virtually unplayable with the Xbox controller. I suck donkey balls with KB+M and its not fun playing on Normal. It runs like a plate of dog poop with random hitching, the graphics don't appear to be much better than MW2 X360... Considering I downloaded this game on STEAM, and therefore I can't even eBay it for half price, I just threw away $60, and need to buy it on Xbox if I want to enjoy it...

PFC5
11-11-2010, 11:51 PM
Just to break up things here, I posted in the hot tub thread about my theory of why the water is cloudy and what I did to hopefully see improvement tomorrow.

Let me know what you think of my theory and solution. :hithere:

John Rambo
11-11-2010, 11:53 PM
Just to break up things here, I posted in the hot tub thread about my theory of why the water is cloudy and what I did to hopefully see improvement tomorrow.

Let me know what you think of my theory and solution. :hithere:

LOL! Could you tell how hard I was trying to end that argument? :lol:

PFC5
11-11-2010, 11:55 PM
One word responses usually are dead giveaways. :D :p

kharaa
11-12-2010, 12:11 AM
:P and you can see PFC5 is at the end of his wits

Pinoy
11-12-2010, 01:04 AM
Oh.

LOL, yeah, when I think of "games that revolutionized online multiplayer," Return to Castle Wolfenstein is at the top of my list :lol:

Whoever said it revolutionized online multiplayer :huh
But calling it a shitty obscure pc game that nobody every played is a pretty far stretch. It's a damn good game for it's time.

railven
11-12-2010, 06:52 AM
Whoever said it revolutionized online multiplayer :huh
But calling it a shitty obscure pc game that nobody every played is a pretty far stretch. It's a damn good game for it's time.

RtCW pretty much pushed the class based objective games to the forefront in the PC side.

Battlefield 1942 was created to compete directly with RtCW. I'd say that is a big push for revolutionizing online play.

Trying to downplay it is a poor excuse to win your argument. Next he'll say Wolfenstein 3D was an obscure shitty game because no one played.

John Rambo
11-12-2010, 03:21 PM
Whoever said it revolutionized online multiplayer :huh
But calling it a shitty obscure pc game that nobody every played is a pretty far stretch. It's a damn good game for it's time.

And it had some kind of online matchmaking? Describe it for me. How did it work? Does Halo 2 deserve no credit whatsoever for bringing all these elements together for the first time?

John Rambo
11-12-2010, 03:23 PM
RtCW pretty much pushed the class based objective games to the forefront in the PC side.

Battlefield 1942 was created to compete directly with RtCW. I'd say that is a big push for revolutionizing online play.

Trying to downplay it is a poor excuse to win your argument. Next he'll say Wolfenstein 3D was an obscure shitty game because no one played.

I'm not talking to you in this thread anymore. We can discuss something else in a different thread, but no more Halo vs the world arguments between Rambo and Railven :horse:

Pinoy
11-12-2010, 05:03 PM
And it had some kind of online matchmaking? Describe it for me. How did it work? Does Halo 2 deserve no credit whatsoever for bringing all these elements together for the first time?

Yeah it had matchmaking, and it worked just fine.

Nobody ever said (at least I didn't) that Halo/Bungie do not deserve credit for their matchmaking setup. Almost anybody who's played Halo will tell you that Bungie perfected matchmaking. They didn't invent it but the 3M'd it.

John Rambo
11-12-2010, 05:38 PM
Yeah it had matchmaking, and it worked just fine.

Nobody ever said (at least I didn't) that Halo/Bungie do not deserve credit for their matchmaking setup. Almost anybody who's played Halo will tell you that Bungie perfected matchmaking. They didn't invent it but the 3M'd it.

eh... Anytime someone mentions how Halo revolutionized anything, somebody steps up and comments on how it wasn't the first game to do anything.

I remember once saying how Halo really revolutionized and brought into the mainstream the proper use of dual analog in first person shooters, and somebody chimed in to say that Goldeneye did it first because you could use two N64 controllers.

Halo revolutionized the online matchmaking system for consoles (if not PC's). When Infinity Ward was designing the party and matchmaking system for COD4, do you think they sat around saying "how can we make an online system that is similar to Return to Castle Wolfenstein?" :lol:

kamspy
11-12-2010, 07:13 PM
Matchmaking is nothing to be proud of. It's a giant step backwards. Even Epic is using dedicated servers for Gears 3. Reach not having them is a complete joke. A real amateur bit in an otherwise solid effort.

Pinoy
11-13-2010, 01:46 AM
Halo revolutionized the online matchmaking system for consoles (if not PC's). When Infinity Ward was designing the party and matchmaking system for COD4, do you think they sat around saying "how can we make an online system that is similar to Return to Castle Wolfenstein?" :lol:

No. They probably did that back when they were making CoD 2.

railven
11-13-2010, 07:48 AM
Yeah it had matchmaking, and it worked just fine.

Nobody ever said (at least I didn't) that Halo/Bungie do not deserve credit for their matchmaking setup. Almost anybody who's played Halo will tell you that Bungie perfected matchmaking. They didn't invent it but the 3M'd it.

It's funny that some people believe Match making is this unique thing to Halo or Xbox 360.

In realistic terms Match making is a set of filters designed to sort a pool. That's it. It removes the guess work out of choosing a server. On the console side match making best feature due to P2P communications is latency resolve.

Skill, maps, "rank" and the sort are arbituary in P2P. The best player in the world will lose to a host if their ping is in the 1,000 ms range.

Why I don't get how people praise Bungie for doing what PC developers have been doing for years - perfecting their packet code. The only thing I'd credit Bungie for is bring the PC FPS experience to consoles with a working controller scheme. Everything else was already done and has been done better on PC. But for console gamers it was a brand new world.

Halo 1 to Halo 2 on the console side was poorly designed in terms of packets because Halo 1 wasn't intended for online play. If you look back before the community resolved the code how poorly it handled over a open "LAN" Halo 2 resolved that issue with great strides.

Mase
11-13-2010, 10:26 AM
Rail I know when I talk about what Bungie has done for gaming I mean consoles, as far as consoles go Bungie is the forefather and everyone is copying them. However not everyone. Is getting it right. COD still has a ways to go, we barely have features that halo 2 had! They may not have been the first as the PC side has pretty much done it all first but on a console they wrote the book. I judge all other shooters by Halo and for good reason.

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 10:40 AM
Matchmaking is nothing to be proud of. It's a giant step backwards. Even Epic is using dedicated servers for Gears 3. Reach not having them is a complete joke. A real amateur bit in an otherwise solid effort.

I hate having to pick my own servers. I'd almost rather not play. I just want to turn it on, join up with a friend, and click the playlist of choice and automatically get matched against like skilled players on a random map.

I can't stand having to jump from server to server to find some people who aren't total asshats to play with. That is the lamest form of gaming.

The only time I've done this was in R6V. My friends and I would set up a game and wait 10 minutes for it to fill up (how fucking lame is that?) and then we'd break out the shields and desert eagles and spawn camp everyone until they quit. That's what happens in games where you have to pick your own server. You get FUCKED by the guy running the game.

Halo matchmaking is 100x better in every conceivable way.

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 10:52 AM
It's funny that some people believe Match making is this unique thing to Halo or Xbox 360.

In realistic terms Match making is a set of filters designed to sort a pool. That's it. It removes the guess work out of choosing a server. On the console side match making best feature due to P2P communications is latency resolve.

Skill, maps, "rank" and the sort are arbituary in P2P. The best player in the world will lose to a host if their ping is in the 1,000 ms range.

Why I don't get how people praise Bungie for doing what PC developers have been doing for years - perfecting their packet code. The only thing I'd credit Bungie for is bring the PC FPS experience to consoles with a working controller scheme. Everything else was already done and has been done better on PC. But for console gamers it was a brand new world.

Halo 1 to Halo 2 on the console side was poorly designed in terms of packets because Halo 1 wasn't intended for online play. If you look back before the community resolved the code how poorly it handled over a open "LAN" Halo 2 resolved that issue with great strides.


LOL! Haters gonna hate...

kamspy
11-13-2010, 10:58 AM
5 million ass hats already own Black Ops and play on XBL. I ordered the PC version so I could find a good couple servers and play with good people every time.

With Bad Company 2 I only played on 4-5 different servers. Didn't even bother looking through the rest.

That's some backwards logic you've got working up there Rambo.

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 11:04 AM
5 million ass hats already own Black Ops and play on XBL. I ordered the PC version so I could find a good couple servers and play with good people every time.

With Bad Company 2 I only played on 4-5 different servers. Didn't even bother looking through the rest.

That's some backwards logic you've got working up there Rambo.

I don't give a damn what "server" I'm playing on, I just want fresh meat each game. I don't ever want to play against the same guys. I don't ever want the same teammates, unless I'm in a party with them. That's why matchmaking owns server searches.

If you like getting into a server and grouping up with the best players on that server so you can terrorize anyone who joins that server, that's fine, but YOU are the reason why server searching sucks. Because people stack teams when they're too scared to make teams fair. Rank based Halo Matchmaking does that for people. No cheating, no team stacking, no tricks. Just good honest fights every time.

kamspy
11-13-2010, 11:11 AM
It's not like that. The main server I played on had around 1000 unique players who played more than 20 games on it.

The attraction was server admins who were there to ban glitchers, spammers, exploiters, whiners, etc.

Not to mention the vastly superior connection.

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 11:20 AM
It's not like that. The main server I played on had around 1000 unique players who played more than 20 games on it.

The attraction was server admins who were there to ban glitchers, spammers, exploiters, whiners, etc.

Not to mention the vastly superior connection.

I've never experienced any of those problems on an Xbox 360 Halo game. There is no cheating, glitching, or exploiting, and whiners are avoiding by party chat with the people in my group. Every connection is virtually flawless, and I'm on a very poor ISP. If the connection is sub-optimal, the game automatically changes to a new host.

I guess if you only play shitty, non-halo multiplayer games, there is a whole list of new potential problems that you face... :D

railven
11-13-2010, 11:55 AM
Rail I know when I talk about what Bungie has done for gaming I mean consoles, as far as consoles go Bungie is the forefather and everyone is copying them. However not everyone. Is getting it right. COD still has a ways to go, we barely have features that halo 2 had! They may not have been the first as the PC side has pretty much done it all first but on a console they wrote the book. I judge all other shooters by Halo and for good reason.

I'm not sure how long you've gamed in general across all platforms, but I guess when I argue gaming I don't set lines or walls.

Since I use all platforms frequently I see the comparisons and then I make judgements on them. I'm not a fanboy to any platform (although I'm positive many will argue against that) and I game most on the platform who at that time offers the better experience - last generation it was PS2, this generation its PC, during the 16bit days it was SNES.

Eitherway this notion that one specific company deserves all unquestionable credit for something and anyone arguing other factors are invalid is assinine. Calling RtCW an obscure shitty game is as dumb as a PC gamer saying Halo is an obscure shitty game. Different strokes for different folks. Rambo got pwned, and he just can admit to it. Halo is a bigger franchise than Call of Duty - no one can argue that. Preferrence is subjective (I prefer Call of Duty to it being just generally overall better, and by that I mean the PC version - with mod support), and for me to say I'm suprised Call of Duty is catching/beating Halo is a big accomplishment to Call of Duty growing as a franchise.

But for the Halo fanboy that can't be, CoD copied Halo, CoD is bigger than Halo, Halo branching out to other markets is irrelevant, etc etc.

Mase
11-13-2010, 12:23 PM
It sounds like this reply was more meant for Rambo than me. I've gamed for a long time but mainly on consoles, pc for me was an rts machine. However as long as I have been into consoles I still have not found one shooter that stacks up to what Bungie has done. I'm not talking about Halo so much as I am talking about the features of the match making, party systems, controller setup and gameplay. When you die your bullet doesn't magically dissapear. I could go on and on but what it boils down to is that Bungie got shit right and people are playing catch up to this day.

J-Rod
11-13-2010, 12:26 PM
So uhhh yeah... whats the numbers up too? :) :)

railven
11-13-2010, 12:44 PM
It sounds like this reply was more meant for Rambo than me. I've gamed for a long time but mainly on consoles, pc for me was an rts machine. However as long as I have been into consoles I still have not found one shooter that stacks up to what Bungie has done. I'm not talking about Halo so much as I am talking about the features of the match making, party systems, controller setup and gameplay. When you die your bullet doesn't magically dissapear. I could go on and on but what it boils down to is that Bungie got shit right and people are playing catch up to this day.

My response is in general to whomever wants to read it. But I always come back to the same arguements.

I can name games you've probably never played. And then you can either dismiss them as being obscure and shitty or whatever. But I'd wager money those games have mechanics better than Halo's implementation of the same things.

Halo is a great series/franchise, but in terms of being implemented it is beyond mediocre and its sad that everyone is trying to copy it.

eiger
11-13-2010, 01:11 PM
I made the mistake of going back five pages and catching up on the thread. What a mistake. I want those few minutes of my life back. :banghead:

Play whatever you enjoy. Who cares. Bungie does have the superior mechanics/coding and MP algorithms though. Sorry. :D

Looks like BO has already blown past MW2 sales, or no? So MW2 is no longer "the most succesful entertainment launch in history" or whatever it was referred to.

Everyone had their own numbers. I want someone to post a summary of MW2, BlackOps, Reach. Then do individual units sold by day 1, week 1. PER PLATFORM. (Obviously Reach being exclusive)

Don't know if anyone has done that yet. Didn't see it.

Mase
11-13-2010, 01:34 PM
My response is in general to whomever wants to read it. But I always come back to the same arguements.

I can name games you've probably never played. And then you can either dismiss them as being obscure and shitty or whatever. But I'd wager money those games have mechanics better than Halo's implementation of the same things.

Halo is a great series/franchise, but in terms of being implemented it is beyond mediocre and its sad that everyone is trying to copy it.

Rail are you kidding me right now? :banghead:


I am not the one to call other games obscure as a tool to dismiss them. What other console games compare. This is all I'm talking about, console games, you keep moving the goal posts and generalize anyone who likes halo as some retarded fanboy. If your gonna continue to debate with those tactics than there is no point is debating with you.

railven
11-13-2010, 01:38 PM
Rail are you kidding me right now? :banghead:

What's wrong with my post? You said you've yet to play a game that does -list- things better than Halo, and I said I can name a bunch if you'd like. You can dismiss them as you wish.

There are more games other than just consoles - and if consoles is the only medium one wants to experience I can see why Halo is the king of the hill. But there are countless games that do things better than Halo, just not on consoles.

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 02:09 PM
Eitherway this notion that one specific company deserves all unquestionable credit for something and anyone arguing other factors are invalid is assinine. Calling RtCW an obscure shitty game is as dumb as a PC gamer saying Halo is an obscure shitty game. Different strokes for different folks. Rambo got pwned, and he just can admit to it. Halo is a bigger franchise than Call of Duty - no one can argue that. Preferrence is subjective (I prefer Call of Duty to it being just generally overall better, and by that I mean the PC version - with mod support), and for me to say I'm suprised Call of Duty is catching/beating Halo is a big accomplishment to Call of Duty growing as a franchise.

But for the Halo fanboy that can't be, CoD copied Halo, CoD is bigger than Halo, Halo branching out to other markets is irrelevant, etc etc.

Get over yourself and stop being such a douchenozzel.

#1, I've never even heard of this Return to Castle Wolfenstein game before you just mentioned it; the only one I knew of was the Xbox version which was a total lump of dogshit, not worth $5, so to me, its an obscure shitty PC game. I'm sorry if you were in love with that steaming lump of dog shit. Didn't mean to make you all butt-hurt.

#2, you keep grasping to that "he called RTCW an obscure shitty PC game" and ignoring the greater point. Just because some other game had some type of matchmaking doesn't take anything away from what Halo did to the industry. You beating this to death changes nothing.

#3, Halo is a bigger franchise than Call of Duty? :lol: Ok. You must mean its a BETTER franchise, but certainly not bigger.

railven
11-13-2010, 02:17 PM
Get over yourself and stop being such a douchenozzel.

#1, I've never even heard of this Return to Castle Wolfenstein game before you just mentioned it; the only one I knew of was the Xbox version which was a total lump of dogshit, not worth $5, so to me, its an obscure shitty PC game. I'm sorry if you were in love with that steaming lump of dog shit. Didn't mean to make you all butt-hurt.

#2, you keep grasping to that "he called RTCW an obscure shitty PC game" and ignoring the greater point. Just because some other game had some type of matchmaking doesn't take anything away from what Halo did to the industry. You beating this to death changes nothing.

#3, Halo is a bigger franchise than Call of Duty? :lol: Ok. You must mean its a BETTER franchise, but certainly not bigger.

So do you want me to respond or not because a few posts back you said no more between us in Halo vs the World? I honored that and didn't respond to it but this is the second time you respond to me, about this subject.

So what do you want?

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 02:18 PM
It sounds like this reply was more meant for Rambo than me. I've gamed for a long time but mainly on consoles, pc for me was an rts machine. However as long as I have been into consoles I still have not found one shooter that stacks up to what Bungie has done. I'm not talking about Halo so much as I am talking about the features of the match making, party systems, controller setup and gameplay. When you die your bullet doesn't magically dissapear. I could go on and on but what it boils down to is that Bungie got shit right and people are playing catch up to this day.

Goldeneye did guns and analog sticks. Return to Castle Wolfenstein did matchmaking. Perfect dark did aliens. Halo is just a knock off version of those games. :lol:

[/douche]

Halo was the first to combine flawless dual analog controls, rechargeable shielding system, dual weapon selections, off hand grenade throwing, single button melee, dual wielding, party system, trueskill ranking system with matchmaking, online stats, save films and uploadable photos/videos, downloadable content, all into one great package. Nobody else has done this even remotely close to as good as Halo.

Think about the FPS genre now. Almost all feature the Halo recharging health system. Almost all feature the Halo two-weapon system. Many feature similar controls with off hand grenade throwing and melee, the entire Xbox Live platform now integrates Bungie's trueskill system from Halo 2 and many games use it in a similar matchmaking function. And Call of Duty is now dabbling in replay films.

Despite all this overwhelming evidence, there are still some who will insist that Halo had little or no impact on the FPS genre and revolutionized nothing.... :rolleyes:

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 02:20 PM
So do you want me to respond or not because a few posts back you said no more between us in Halo vs the World? I honored that and didn't respond to it but this is the second time you respond to me, about this subject.

So what do you want?

You deliberately addressed me BY NAME while talking shit. You just quoted someone else. That merits a response. :bs:

railven
11-13-2010, 02:21 PM
Goldeneye did guns and analog sticks. Return to Castle Wolfenstein did matchmaking. Perfect dark did aliens. Halo is just a knock off version of those games. :lol:

[/douche]

Halo was the first to combine flawless dual analog controls, rechargeable shielding system, dual weapon selections, off hand grenade throwing, single button melee, dual wielding, party system, trueskill ranking system with matchmaking, online stats, save films and uploadable photos/videos, downloadable content, all into one great package. Nobody else has done this even remotely close to as good as Halo.

Think about the FPS genre now. Almost all feature the Halo recharging health system. Almost all feature the Halo two-weapon system. Many feature similar controls with off hand grenade throwing and melee, the entire Xbox Live platform now integrates Bungie's trueskill system from Halo 2 and many games use it in a similar matchmaking function. And Call of Duty is now dabbling in replay films.

Despite all this overwhelming evidence, there are still some who will insist that Halo had little or no impact on the FPS genre and revolutionized nothing.... :rolleyes:

Specify console before I list the games that did all those things you listed first on the PC side.

And further emphasis how Halo made by a PC developer brought what PC developers have been doing for a while to consoles.

Just because it was the first time you experience these things doesn't mean it was the first they were used. Something you have a hard time understanding.

railven
11-13-2010, 02:23 PM
You deliberately addressed me BY NAME while talking shit. You just quoted someone else. That merits a response. :bs:

Okay, so next time I'll just say "that guy" and not even acknlowedge you are a poster here.

Either way my shift is over, so if you guys wanna continue this tomorrow I'm all game :D

Until, ciao!

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 02:34 PM
Specify console before I list the games that did all those things you listed first on the PC side.

And further emphasis how Halo made by a PC developer brought what PC developers have been doing for a while to consoles.

Just because it was the first time you experience these things doesn't mean it was the first they were used. Something you have a hard time understanding.

Here's something you don't understand; being first to do something is one thing. Being first to do all those things at once is another thing.

Thomas Edison didn't invent every component in a lightbulb; he was just the first to put everything together into a complete unit...

John Rambo
11-13-2010, 02:36 PM
Okay, so next time I'll just say "that guy" and not even acknlowedge you are a poster here.

Either way my shift is over, so if you guys wanna continue this tomorrow I'm all game :D

Until, ciao!

I'm just saying don't claim you're taking the high road by not responding when you've been talking shit left and right.

Seriously though, I just didn't want to continue discussing which game is BETTER in our opinions. That was pointless. As long as you don't try and convince me that Call of Duty takes more skill and is more fun than Halo, feel free to address me directly. :D

PFC5
11-13-2010, 03:15 PM
Chill guys.

With the volume of sales for both they MUST be good or else people wouldn't keep buying each new version in such large numbers.

For the record, I remember the original Wolfenstein game on the PC back when there was no matchmaking as everyone just had 1200Bps to 14.4kbps modems. There was no internet for average people, and to get game and motherboard/video card patches you had to go on BBS systems to get then and it was all text driven with no graphics because bandwidth was so slow it wasn't practical. :lol:

It was the forerunner of gaming computer graphics that we all enjoy now and many other games used their created graphics engine.

Pinoy
11-14-2010, 01:58 AM
Wonder what people would think if Halo had been the RTS game on Mac it was originally intended to be...

It's funny that some people believe Match making is this unique thing to Halo or Xbox 360.

In realistic terms Match making is a set of filters designed to sort a pool. That's it. It removes the guess work out of choosing a server. On the console side match making best feature due to P2P communications is latency resolve.

Skill, maps, "rank" and the sort are arbituary in P2P. The best player in the world will lose to a host if their ping is in the 1,000 ms range.

Why I don't get how people praise Bungie for doing what PC developers have been doing for years - perfecting their packet code. The only thing I'd credit Bungie for is bring the PC FPS experience to consoles with a working controller scheme. Everything else was already done and has been done better on PC. But for console gamers it was a brand new world.

Halo 1 to Halo 2 on the console side was poorly designed in terms of packets because Halo 1 wasn't intended for online play. If you look back before the community resolved the code how poorly it handled over a open "LAN" Halo 2 resolved that issue with great strides.
I give Bungie credit for their matchmaking because it gets players of equal skill together quite more often than not. Out of all the times I ever played Halo rarely did I ever end up in a completely lopsided match.


Chill guys.

With the volume of sales for both they MUST be good or else people wouldn't keep buying each new version in such large numbers.

For the record, I remember the original Wolfenstein game on the PC back when there was no matchmaking as everyone just had 1200Bps to 14.4kbps modems. There was no internet for average people, and to get game and motherboard/video card patches you had to go on BBS systems to get then and it was all text driven with no graphics because bandwidth was so slow it wasn't practical. :lol:

It was the forerunner of gaming computer graphics that we all enjoy now and many other games used their created graphics engine.

Yeah I remember that one too. Pretty much helped define the FPS genre into what it is today. Of course it's not the game Railven was talking about (RtCW is only about 10 years old now)

J-Rod
11-16-2010, 01:47 PM
Chill guys.

With the volume of sales for both they MUST be good or else people wouldn't keep buying each new version in such large numbers.

For the record, I remember the original Wolfenstein game on the PC back when there was no matchmaking as everyone just had 1200Bps to 14.4kbps modems. There was no internet for average people, and to get game and motherboard/video card patches you had to go on BBS systems to get then and it was all text driven with no graphics because bandwidth was so slow it wasn't practical. :lol:

It was the forerunner of gaming computer graphics that we all enjoy now and many other games used their created graphics engine.


AHHH BBS' -- the good ole days. I belonged to one, that was some cool ass shit in junior high. none of my friends even knew what the hell I was doing, it was crazy.

Razor05
11-16-2010, 03:20 PM
Wonder what people would think if Halo had been the RTS game on Mac it was originally intended to be...

I give Bungie credit for their matchmaking because it gets players of equal skill together quite more often than not. Out of all the times I ever played Halo rarely did I ever end up in a completely lopsided match.

Yeah I remember that one too. Pretty much helped define the FPS genre into what it is today. Of course it's not the game Railven was talking about (RtCW is only about 10 years old now)

Probably nothing because we most likely wouldn't have the Halo we have now.;)

MikeRox
11-16-2010, 04:34 PM
There are games on Mac? :D

Cygnus
11-16-2010, 04:36 PM
Mac is to computing as wii is to gaming :haha:

/runs

There are games on Mac? :D

kamspy
11-16-2010, 04:48 PM
There are games on Mac? :D

2 biggest games are. WoW and Farmville.

MikeRox
11-16-2010, 05:12 PM
Mac is to computing as wii is to gaming :haha:

/runs

It has the best selling games of all time and the most highly acclaimed games of the decade?

kamspy
11-16-2010, 05:13 PM
It has the best selling games of all time and the most highly acclaimed games of the decade?

http://www.abload.de/img/tiger1puqg.gif

Mase
11-16-2010, 08:05 PM
It has the best selling games of all time and the most highly acclaimed games of the decade?

So now sales matter :p

John Rambo
11-16-2010, 10:28 PM
LOL @ Wii

MikeRox
11-17-2010, 03:17 PM
So now sales matter :p

Sales always matter, check out the Bizarre thread. Sales don't effect the quality of a game, but they certainly effect the likelihood of a sequel/similar game and the viability of the business going forwards.

I don't recall claiming otherwise? I usually get lectured about how sales and profit are irrelivant to gamers.

J-Rod
11-18-2010, 11:52 AM
http://www.abload.de/img/tiger1puqg.gif

That is some funny shit right there..... I'm laughing hard, nice work!



@MikeRox Wii wants to play :p