High Def Forum
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is this necessary?

uglijimus
04-07-2010, 09:57 AM
I'm about to take the plunge into HDTV. My first one. Haven't decided on anything, not even whether it's going to be LCD or plasma. As far as size goes, I think i'm looking for something from 42'-52' inches...

Of PQ is important, but I'm most worried about motion. I've seen some
hdtvs where the motion seemed, unnatural, or speeded up. Is this affected by something called 120hz refresh or 240hz? The higher the hertz equals the smoother and more natural motion?

complete noobie

bigmatt7487
04-07-2010, 10:09 AM
I'm about to take the plunge into HDTV. My first one. Haven't decided on anything, not even whether it's going to be LCD or plasma. As far as size goes, I think i'm looking for something from 42'-52' inches...

Of PQ is important, but I'm most worried about motion. I've seen some
hdtvs where the motion seemed, unnatural, or speeded up. Is this affected by something called 120hz refresh or 240hz? The higher the hertz equals the smoother and more natural motion?

complete noobie

If you're concerned AT ALL about motion, go Plasma. I was in your boat a short while back and bought an LCD because of my family's viewing habits. Big mistake. I am very sensitive to motion issues, and all I see on my LCD is blur/smearing. It is so bad that my TV is basically a paperweight now.

From the knowledge I have gathered, Plasma is much better at handling motion than LCDs.

oblioman
04-07-2010, 10:15 AM
I'm about to take the plunge into HDTV. My first one. Haven't decided on anything, not even whether it's going to be LCD or plasma. As far as size goes, I think i'm looking for something from 42'-52' inches...

Of PQ is important, but I'm most worried about motion. I've seen some
hdtvs where the motion seemed, unnatural, or speeded up. Is this affected by something called 120hz refresh or 240hz? The higher the hertz equals the smoother and more natural motion?

complete noobie

If your sensitive to motion, LCD should be out of the question. if you be shopping at your local stores, you will see a preponderance of LCD tv's. They look pretty good on the showroom floor,,have all the bells and whistles,,,salespeople are now being told to call them LED tv's (they be LCD's with LED backlight). The problem begins when ya get it home. The uneven backlight, poor off-axis viewing, motion artifacts all make for a viewing experience less than stellar. If ya wish to save some money and have a superior picture,,plasma is the king. Panasonic or Samsung - no lcd can beat the pic quality of these two plasmas. :2cents

DoctorCAD
04-07-2010, 11:08 AM
If your sensitive to motion, LCD should be out of the question. if you be shopping at your local stores, you will see a preponderance of LCD tv's. They look pretty good on the showroom floor,,have all the bells and whistles,,,salespeople are now being told to call them LED tv's (they be LCD's with LED backlight). The problem begins when ya get it home. The uneven backlight, poor off-axis viewing, motion artifacts all make for a viewing experience less than stellar. If ya wish to save some money and have a superior picture,,plasma is the king. Panasonic or Samsung - no lcd can beat the pic quality of these two plasmas. :2cents

In your opinion...don't forget to add that.
My Samsung has very even (but not very dark) backlight, very good off-axis viewing and I watch hockey a lot without any motion artifacts, so my viewing is stellar.

Other than the not too dark thing, its a fine TV choice.

ddeerrff
04-07-2010, 11:38 AM
Same with my Samsung LCD.

As long as I am not trying to watch in a blacked out room (there is always daylight or a light on in the room) then the black levels are more than black enough. At least as good as our previous CRT.

I typically watch about 30 degrees off of center line. As hard as I look, I can not see any difference in contrast, colors, or general PQ between my normal viewing position and a dead on position.

Motion artifacts and Soap Opera Effect? Plasma is the winner here, but with proper blur and judder settings, I don't have any issues my Samsung.

uglijimus
04-07-2010, 02:04 PM
thanks for the responses. But I'm still curious as to what specification is representative of the smoothness of motion. 120hz? If both a LCD and a plasma both say 120hz, in theory shouldn't they both have the same degree of smooth motion?

Loves2Watch
04-07-2010, 02:08 PM
thanks for the responses. But I'm still curious as to what specification is representative of the smoothness of motion. 120hz? If both a LCD and a plasma both say 120hz, in theory shouldn't they both have the same degree of smooth motion?

No it has to do with a difference in technology. LCD's have a much slower response time due to the crystal physically having to twist to arrive at the proper color whereas in a plasma gas is used and voltage applied. Plasma is at least 1000 times faster in this category hence it can deliver pictures with no blur or smear where a LCD may during fast moving scenes or objects.

jkkyler
04-07-2010, 02:18 PM
Same with my Samsung LCD.

As long as I am not trying to watch in a blacked out room (there is always daylight or a light on in the room) then the black levels are more than black enough. At least as good as our previous CRT.

I typically watch about 30 degrees off of center line. As hard as I look, I can not see any difference in contrast, colors, or general PQ between my normal viewing position and a dead on position.

Motion artifacts and Soap Opera Effect? Plasma is the winner here, but with proper blur and judder settings, I don't have any issues my Samsung.

Although I am sure you have a fine tv, stating that the black level exceeds a CRT is either pure folly or hyperbole. IMHO and I am sure many will back me - none of the current techs- LCD/LED, DLP. or plasma rival the blacks on a crt tube tv.

ddeerrff
04-07-2010, 03:45 PM
Although I am sure you have a fine tv, stating that the black level exceeds a CRT is either pure folly or hyperbole.

Not at all. Remember, I am referring to a 'normally' lighted room, not a darkroom.

Turn on the room light, and turn the CRT TV off. Now look at the TV screen and tell me how black it is. A black pixel on a CRT will never be any blacker than what you see as reflected light off the screen.

As long as the light output of an 'off' cell on an LCD display is less than the amount of light simply reflected off it from ambient lighting, then it is as good as it needs to be.

For a darkened room/home theater environment, there is no question the CRT and plasma will give you blacker blacks. But if you are watching in a normally lighted room, the LCD black level is low enough as to be below observable.

Perhaps I shouldn't be commenting here as I actually watch TV in the daytime with the curtains open, and at night with lights on in the room.

jkkyler
04-07-2010, 04:15 PM
As long as the light output of an 'off' cell on an LCD display is less than the amount of light simply reflected off it from ambient lighting, then it is as good as it needs to be.

Therein lies the issue -on an LCD the light output is not less than reflected ambient lighting

ddeerrff
04-07-2010, 08:54 PM
Therein lies the issue -on an LCD the light output is not less than reflected ambient lighting
And that depends on the room lighting.

I'm watching now and it is showing a 4:3 shot. I'm about 10 feet away (46" TV) and I see no difference in 'blackness' between the black side bars and the piano-black frame. There is a 100W lamp in the living room, and about 150W of incandescent lighting in an ajoining dining room.

uglijimus
04-08-2010, 12:39 PM
I guess I'll just have to go and check it out for myself. But I'm sure I'll be leaning a little more towards plasma...

ddeerrff
04-08-2010, 01:52 PM
I guess I'll just have to go and check it out for myself. But I'm sure I'll be leaning a little more towards plasma...
Certainly not trying to talk you out of a Plasma, uglijius. Under many if not most circumstances, a Plasma is the best choice. I just get a little tired of the LCD bashing around here giving the impression that an LCD TV will be unwatchable - when in reality, the faults that do admittedly exist in the technology are not as bad as all that and will generally go unnoticed by the average viewer.

uglijimus
04-08-2010, 02:15 PM
Certainly not trying to talk you out of a Plasma, uglijius. Under many if not most circumstances, a Plasma is the best choice. I just get a little tired of the LCD bashing around here giving the impression that an LCD TV will be unwatchable - when in reality, the faults that do admittedly exist in the technology are not as bad as all that and will generally go unnoticed by the average viewer.

I have taken everything with a grain of salt as I read it. Admittedly I am an audiophile, not a videophile. So I am sure that I'm not quite as picky as most of the audience here. I just wanted to get some experts' opinions. And I got exactly that.:)

dsskid
04-08-2010, 02:55 PM
Certainly not trying to talk you out of a Plasma, uglijius. Under many if not most circumstances, a Plasma is the best choice. I just get a little tired of the LCD bashing around here giving the impression that an LCD TV will be unwatchable - when in reality, the faults that do admittedly exist in the technology are not as bad as all that and will generally go unnoticed by the average viewer.

I agree with you.

GymBrat98
04-08-2010, 04:38 PM
Certainly not trying to talk you out of a Plasma, uglijius. Under many if not most circumstances, a Plasma is the best choice. I just get a little tired of the LCD bashing around here giving the impression that an LCD TV will be unwatchable - when in reality, the faults that do admittedly exist in the technology are not as bad as all that and will generally go unnoticed by the average viewer.


Preach it Ddeerrff !:banana::thumbsup::yippee::hithere:

http://i293.photobucket.com/albums/mm49/LIovemykittez/My%20Posterz/AnimatedBrat.gif