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New Panny plasma, HORRIBLE SD and red lines in HD

sincraft
09-27-2009, 04:17 PM
Just picked up a new panny 54" plasma, TC-54PS14 from Costco.

Plugged it in with the cable box which is an explorer 8300hdc with a HDMI cable. Nice thick new cable, decent one.

Turned the tv on, almost vomited at the quality of SD. Just shockingly worse than our crt. I know that it's not going to be as good, but it looks HORRIBLE>

So then, I switch to HD and get RED Horizontal bars across the screen, middle right with a tiny flicker on the left side too. Each bar is about 6" long, and there are about 8 of them above and below each other, beside each other composing approximate 20% of the screen. Each line is made up of these tiny vertical lines.

Here's the thing, when I tried it on our old sd tv, I see the same bars on hd channels....but sd looks fine.

I contacted Comcast as I had no sound either, they resolve this but were unable to get the picture cleaned up. They reset the box etc.

Comcast also informed me that they do not broadcast in 1080p? What is the purpose of a 1080p tv then? I know that the feed coming to comcast is most likely 1080i but I know there are some programs that run 1080p occasionally right?

I tried several HDMI slows and component cables.

Even if I try to ignore the red lines, the HD quality is not that hot. It appears that 720p looks better than 1080i.

If this is the case, wouldn't the 720p tv of the same size (actually 1" larger) look the exact same unless I'm running a blue ray...of which I will rarely do

I'm thinkng cable box....is this possible? Should I request a specific box or is there anything...

Thanks.

Signed,
A EXTREMELY frustrated new Plasma owner with a massive headache.

P.S. Comcast VS Directv? Anyone?

stinkfist69
09-27-2009, 04:45 PM
Sounds like a cable problem not your Plasma TV that is for sure. I have the same TV just bought it also. The picture with my Dish network & DTV satellite receivers is incredible. I don't have cable but my friend does with his Samsung LCD and it looks bad compared to my HD stuff. But that could be his TV also. Also as far as HDMI cables go it does not matter if it is a $200 rip off Monster cable or a $5 Monoprice cable. digital is digital that is not the problem. How does your Blu-Ray player look? Also what are your settings on your TV? Make sure to put your picture contrast down to 50% or below for 200 hours for break in.

sincraft
09-27-2009, 05:47 PM
Sounds like a cable problem not your Plasma TV that is for sure. I have the same TV just bought it also. The picture with my Dish network & DTV satellite receivers is incredible. I don't have cable but my friend does with his Samsung LCD and it looks bad compared to my HD stuff. But that could be his TV also. Also as far as HDMI cables go it does not matter if it is a $200 rip off Monster cable or a $5 Monoprice cable. digital is digital that is not the problem. How does your Blu-Ray player look? Also what are your settings on your TV? Make sure to put your picture contrast down to 50% or below for 200 hours for break in.

Yes I have the settings on default which is very low. The picture looks pretty bad in sd. So bad that if we swap this cable box and see no improvement it will go back. Very dull lifeless, colorless, fuzzy images. Not sure why I don't hear others complaining about sd lately...everyone I see looks horrible. I figured they had things setup wrong and that my tv would be better, as I would hook the thing up correctly. :)

OH well

Lets hope it's the box. Half tempted to make an HD tv antenna to check it out.

Also thinking of getting dtv, I know sd was better in sd on our crt so maybe in hd it would be even better than Comcast. Comcast's service is so poor. Signals very low , overloaded routers etc. Just can't imagine what they are thinking when they advertise 'more hd' channels etc

Anything else I can try?

1986pacecar
09-27-2009, 05:55 PM
Yes I have the settings on default which is very low. The picture looks pretty bad in sd. So bad that if we swap this cable box and see no improvement it will go back. Very dull lifeless, colorless, fuzzy images. Not sure why I don't hear others complaining about sd lately...everyone I see looks horrible. I figured they had things setup wrong and that my tv would be better, as I would hook the thing up correctly. :)

OH well

Lets hope it's the box. Half tempted to make an HD tv antenna to check it out.

Also thinking of getting dtv, I know sd was better in sd on our crt so maybe in hd it would be even better than Comcast. Comcast's service is so poor. Signals very low , overloaded routers etc. Just can't imagine what they are thinking when they advertise 'more hd' channels etc

Anything else I can try?

Sorry to hear about your new tv but I agree that it is probably cable related. Directv is much better than cable and I know this from experience as the cheapskate in me tried to save a buck and swapped to Time Warner. That lasted one whole day, then I switched back. I don't care if they give it away I'll never go back.

PFC5
09-27-2009, 06:04 PM
If you had the red lines on HD signals with your CRT I would assume your CRT was HD also. That would lead me to believe that it is a cable issue, but it could also be the HDTV is defective, but it is a long shot.

Try adjusting the picture settings to what I have in my "SETTINGS" link in my signature and see if that helps! The display model you bought is a very nice display so I would say it is either defective, your cable box is set up wrong, or your TV settings are wrong.

FYI. SD signals were only designed to look good on 27" screens or smaller. Although my 50" Panasonic plasma does a better job with SD channels than any other HD display I have had in my home (9 so far), it is not going to look as crisp and clean as a SD signal would look on a 50"+ display.

sincraft
09-27-2009, 08:30 PM
No our crt was not HD. That's why I thought, ok those red lines are because its capturing an hd feed or something and the tv can't handle it. But, same thing on the panny :(

Also, we are noticing a very annoying green cast on EVERYTHING, especially blacks. I then SUDDENLY remembered, my last tv that I purchased was a panasonic super black...it had a green cast on it 20+ years ago and I took it back for a Sony. Colors are STILL great on the Sony.

Could this also be related to our issue? They are sending someone out *cough, laugh* on weds to scratch their head and do what we did - call a tech support person that will tell me and I quote "I don't really known nothing about hd stuff, just want I types in the box and what it tells me to tell you"

I'm not joking, that was Comcasts tech support. They DID get me into the sound settings though so that was cool. Not sure why HDMI was disabled.

It shows 1080i, the tv shows 1080i...the picture is...a bit better than our Sony 32", but ALOT better than the panny sd.

Then...

I started flipping channels, and found HBO. My Myself and Irene was on. And I suddenly noticed how much more crisp it looked. Everything was still WAY too green but it looked very crisp.

So is Comcast dumbing down the general tv channels to save bandwidth? We have an old infrastructure here, clicking on things takes forever and all the menus are super old. They say they can't upgrade it to what people just over the next town have because we have an old infrastructure.

I'm concerned I won't be able to get Directv. We have a 3 story townhouse with a 40 foot tree behind us. If the sat signal comes in from high above, then we would be ok, but from what I remember you have to point it just over the horizon, and even if it clears the tree it will possibly be obscured by a hill.

The people across the street without trees have directtv, but I see NOONE on my side with it. Making me a bit worried as I don't want to be stuck with comcast.

Does anyone have that dish pointer website handy?

And thanks for any tips. Oh and any idea on the color or what till this red lines issues resolves to figure it out?

oblioman
09-27-2009, 09:00 PM
Since your TV has a QAM tuner, unhook the cable from the cable box, and plug it directly in to your TV. perform an "autoscan" and see if you are getting any signal in the clear. this could take any where from 5 to 20 minutes. You will not get any encrypted channels (HBO,ESPN,etc.) but if your local cable company has any in the clear channels (ABC,CBS,Etc.) these will show up as digital like 6.1,,8.1,,etc. If they do show up with the same red lines,,me would say the TV either is way out of tune,,,or bad. If they show up in HD glory,,,it be the cable box.

pappylap
09-27-2009, 09:07 PM
broadcast signals are almost always either 720p or 1080i the point of having a 1080p set my good man is that you have nearly 2 times the number of pixels within your display than a 720/1080i set with which to render the images.....if the Panny is still hooked up via HDMI and the box says it is disabled I would suggest enabling it...If hooked up with Componant (red,green,blue) make certain the blue cable is not hooked into the green output & green into blue, this is a common mistake and will not display the colors accurately..

PFC5
09-27-2009, 09:09 PM
No our crt was not HD. That's why I thought, ok those red lines are because its capturing an hd feed or something and the tv can't handle it. But, same thing on the panny :(

Also, we are noticing a very annoying green cast on EVERYTHING, especially blacks. I then SUDDENLY remembered, my last tv that I purchased was a panasonic super black...it had a green cast on it 20+ years ago and I took it back for a Sony. Colors are STILL great on the Sony.

Could this also be related to our issue? They are sending someone out *cough, laugh* on weds to scratch their head and do what we did - call a tech support person that will tell me and I quote "I don't really known nothing about hd stuff, just want I types in the box and what it tells me to tell you"

I'm not joking, that was Comcasts tech support. They DID get me into the sound settings though so that was cool. Not sure why HDMI was disabled.

It shows 1080i, the tv shows 1080i...the picture is...a bit better than our Sony 32", but ALOT better than the panny sd.

Then...

I started flipping channels, and found HBO. My Myself and Irene was on. And I suddenly noticed how much more crisp it looked. Everything was still WAY too green but it looked very crisp.

So is Comcast dumbing down the general tv channels to save bandwidth? We have an old infrastructure here, clicking on things takes forever and all the menus are super old. They say they can't upgrade it to what people just over the next town have because we have an old infrastructure.

I'm concerned I won't be able to get Directv. We have a 3 story townhouse with a 40 foot tree behind us. If the sat signal comes in from high above, then we would be ok, but from what I remember you have to point it just over the horizon, and even if it clears the tree it will possibly be obscured by a hill.

The people across the street without trees have directtv, but I see NOONE on my side with it. Making me a bit worried as I don't want to be stuck with comcast.

Does anyone have that dish pointer website handy?

And thanks for any tips. Oh and any idea on the color or what till this red lines issues resolves to figure it out?

This sounds like an issue with the cable box and/or the connection being used. Many of these cable boxes do not work properly with HDMI or DVI connections on the boxes. Try component (red/green/blue) for the video and red/white for the audio and see if that solves the issue.

Did you try the settings I have a link to in my signature like I suggested? Also remember that you have to adjust the settings for each input as they have a memory setting.

Please post all your picture settings (including the second page of settings) so we can see if that is the problem.

Loves2Watch
09-27-2009, 09:16 PM
Make sure the sharpness is at 50 (that would be 0 on every other brand of TV.). That will help with the SD picture a bit.

sincraft
09-27-2009, 10:53 PM
yes I checked the settings, everything is just a minor tweak or obvious setting that won't even touch this issue of the red bars.


Image of the red bars.

I did as someone mentioned and plugged the coax directly into the tv. It scanned, found like 80 analog and 30 digital. I surfed and found that some stations showed up full screen, some showed with gray bars on the sides, and others showed in letterbox. Odd, when we had it hooked up to the box it didn't do this.
I did manage to find some 'hd' stations but the programming did not appear to be in hd.
At any rate, no red bars on any station..

Why am I seeing such different sizing on different stations? Does the cable box automatically size this for us prior to plugging the coax directly into the tv.

I know the cable from the box outside to the inside of the house is small, not like the thick cable I used to run throughout the house. Don't know if this matters much.

So take a look at that image and tell me what you think. I'm going to go watch borat now on some of the worst sd quality I've seen since my grandfather had rabbit ears :crying:

Thanks for the input guys, it has been at the very least, helpful enough to keep me from going bonkers over this until I resolve it.

sincraft
09-27-2009, 10:54 PM
ok it said I can only post images after 5 or more post so, ....look below..

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2455/3960937719_9d64551dc3_b.jpg

Oh btw I'd like to add if I didn't already. For those on the fence about this tv, if I can work out the green cast issue, the red bars issue, and somehow resolve my HORRIBLE sd picture quality issue, this is a great tv for the price :) I was very very surprised to see (or hear) how good the speakers were on this. At 30 it was too loud.....too loud on a flatscreens built ins??? YES! Finally they figure out how to get decent sound out of a flatscreen.

I wonder how many people take these tvs back because they dont know where to go to find out what tweaking they need to do to get an acceptable picture?

Techlord
09-28-2009, 12:10 AM
broadcast signals are almost always either 720p or 1080i the point of having a 1080p set my good man is that you have nearly 2 times the number of pixels within your display than a 720/1080i set with which to render the images.....if the Panny is still hooked up via HDMI and the box says it is disabled I would suggest enabling it...If hooked up with Componant (red,green,blue) make certain the blue cable is not hooked into the green output & green into blue, this is a common mistake and will not display the colors accurately..

I thought the difference between 1080i and 1080p was the scan rates not pixel count? It takes a 1080i signal two times to scan one full frame while 1080p signal takes one time to scan one full frame, please correct me if I am wrong.

stinkfist69
09-28-2009, 12:42 AM
ok it said I can only post images after 5 or more post so, ....look below..

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2455/3960937719_9d64551dc3_b.jpg

Oh btw I'd like to add if I didn't already. For those on the fence about this tv, if I can work out the green cast issue, the red bars issue, and somehow resolve my HORRIBLE sd picture quality issue, this is a great tv for the price :) I was very very surprised to see (or hear) how good the speakers were on this. At 30 it was too loud.....too loud on a flatscreens built ins??? YES! Finally they figure out how to get decent sound out of a flatscreen.

I wonder how many people take these tvs back because they dont know where to go to find out what tweaking they need to do to get an acceptable picture?


You think the SD channels look bad on your plasma... You should see them on a DLP or LCD alot worse. I have the same TV as you and my SD channels look very good. Almost as good as on my 42" CRT. I would try a different coax cable from your cable provider. What does a DVD look like or a Blu-Ray? Does it have the same issues?

PFC5
09-28-2009, 03:36 AM
ok it said I can only post images after 5 or more post so, ....look below..

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2455/3960937719_9d64551dc3_b.jpg

Oh btw I'd like to add if I didn't already. For those on the fence about this tv, if I can work out the green cast issue, the red bars issue, and somehow resolve my HORRIBLE sd picture quality issue, this is a great tv for the price :) I was very very surprised to see (or hear) how good the speakers were on this. At 30 it was too loud.....too loud on a flatscreens built ins??? YES! Finally they figure out how to get decent sound out of a flatscreen.

I wonder how many people take these tvs back because they dont know where to go to find out what tweaking they need to do to get an acceptable picture?

I do not see ANY "green cast" in that pic. I do see the red pixels so that leads me to believe that you do not have a strong signal since they went away when you removed the cable STB out of the chain. So I would have them test the signal strength coming into the house. This often does not show up with SD signals because the data size is much smaller compared to HD signals so it would not be noticeable if the signal strength is enough for SD but not enough for HD.

It seems apparent this is NOT a HDTV issue but rather an issue with the cable system IMO based on what we know right now.

Can you please try using component cables with the cable STB and also try using MY settings to confirm this?

Techlord
09-28-2009, 04:20 AM
I do see the red pixels so that leads me to believe that you do not have a strong signal since they went away when you removed the cable STB out of the chain. So I would have them test the signal strength coming into the house. This often does not show up with SD signals because the data size is much smaller compared to HD signals so it would not be noticeable if the signal strength is enough for SD but not enough for HD.

It seems apparent this is NOT a HDTV issue but rather an issue with the cable system IMO based on what we know right now.


That's cables biggest drawback, RG6 coax cable can receive interference. I have high speed cable internet from my cable company (Cox Communications) and just had some techs out here last Thurday because my moden signals were WAY OFF, all they did was give me my own dedicated connection to the TAP. That fixed everything, this isn't the first or last time they will be out here! "I guaranty you this."

pappylap
09-28-2009, 06:07 AM
I thought the difference between 1080i and 1080p was the scan rates not pixel count? It takes a 1080i signal two times to scan one full frame while 1080p signal takes one time to scan one full frame, please correct me if I am wrong.

You are correct but a properly deinterlaced 1080i image on a 1080p set will look exactly like a1080p image on that same set as there is the same amount of information being displayed.....540x2=1080
However, the 1080p set has almost double the pixel count to display the image than the old 720/1080i sets.

sincraft
09-28-2009, 02:40 PM
yes I tried the settings and comp cables. Occurs with comp cables too.
I have the new (used) stb in the back of my vehicle (at work now) will report back when I see what effect, if any, it has on my signal.

We are contemplating going to dtv. 3 of the people I work with have all switched because the quality is THAT much better from what I understand. Comcast is a joke around here apparently for signal quality. Never really knew. I knew they overloaded their routers and thus, voip was a joke but as a sd tv owner didn't care much about the tv side of things. I don't really watch much to begin with, might now though :)

The green color issue seems to turn certain shades of yellow green and black has a green cast to it. I will see if it looks like this in HD. If it does and comcast doesnt resolve it, I will switch to dtv. If that doesn't resolve it, I will switch tv's if adjustments do not resolve as I do not believe this is a defect but just the way the tv looks.

Also, it was mentioned in these forums to keep the tv down to 50% on things, I gotta say - it is VERY dim like this. Do plasmas slowly dim over time.

Thanks

Techlord
09-28-2009, 03:20 PM
Do plasmas slowly dim over time. Thanks

Yes they do, plasmas and LCDs at half life dim. I don't think you will notice it though, if you do then increase the settings to get it bright enough. What type of environment do you watch TV, in somewhat dim lighting or bright lighting? If watching in a dim environment there's no reason to have a bright display in a dark room. When you go to the movies is the picture bright or somewhat dim? What picture mode are you in? That makes a big difference!

Loves2Watch
09-28-2009, 06:17 PM
FYI - The half life (when the display panel is half as bright as when new) for Panasonic plasma TV's is 100,000 hours. That's over 20 years leaving the TV on all day long so I doubt you would see a dimming, at least in this decade.

Techlord
09-28-2009, 09:27 PM
FYI - The half life (when the display panel is half as bright as when new) for Panasonic plasma TV's is 100,000 hours. That's over 20 years leaving the TV on all day long so I doubt you would see a dimming, at least in this decade.

"The average consumer buys a new TV every 8 years."

sincraft
09-28-2009, 09:53 PM
Cable box fail.
Works fine now. Thanks for everyones input.

Hoping that SD looks better when I switch to dtv or dishnetwork. HBO looks good, the standard local channels however are pretty bad. BUT they have most of those in hd. I doubt we will move much from HD to be honest.

If cable providers allowed you to JUST get the HD channels, and all of them, that's what I would pick and ditch the rest.

Techlord
09-28-2009, 10:01 PM
I'm glad everything worked out for you, now you can enjoy watching TV! :D

sincraft
09-29-2009, 10:13 PM
I'm enjoying it. Probably a bit too much. I'm very close to the tv watching how great it is. :) At all angles. Patting myself on the back for waiting to get this wonderful tv.

HOWEVER - I'm still a bit mystified by this green cast on things that I can't seem to get rid of, and I've noticed a 'rattle' in the speakers.

At first I was pretty darn impressed with the sound, but now there is an annoying rattle that I can hear when the volume is up to 1/3 (about where we need it, we are all pretty hard of hearing). I put my hand on the case and it seems to lessen the issue but I can't pinpoint where exactly it is coming from. If I can't stop it with some stick on rubber pads to absorb some of the shock from the speakers, I'll open the entire tv up and stop it for sure.

No worries, I've taken many of these apart and replaced boards on them

As far as the green cast goes. It's on the edges of many things, but also seems to have a green cast on dark gray items with lower light on them. No adjustments will make them go away. Researching this I didn't really find much about this issue. Could the TV be defective? I'm wondering if a visit to the store will either confirm it's a model wide thing or just my models issue.

I really don't want to pack this up and take it back and have the same issue, I can't imagine that this is a defect...

Any suggestions? I've tried many many settings.

PFC5
09-29-2009, 10:27 PM
First I would say do NOT open up the tv yourself while it is under warranty as this would likely void said warranty. ;)

Can you please post your picture settings so we can help with the "green cast" you seem to notice? I asked before but you must have missed this.

pappylap
09-29-2009, 10:30 PM
Virtually all displays with the exception of the Pioneers have pretty poor sound systems. I guess the manufacturers assume everyone will be hooking through their home audio systems....

stinkfist69
09-29-2009, 10:55 PM
I'm enjoying it. Probably a bit too much. I'm very close to the tv watching how great it is. :) At all angles. Patting myself on the back for waiting to get this wonderful tv.

HOWEVER - I'm still a bit mystified by this green cast on things that I can't seem to get rid of, and I've noticed a 'rattle' in the speakers.

At first I was pretty darn impressed with the sound, but now there is an annoying rattle that I can hear when the volume is up to 1/3 (about where we need it, we are all pretty hard of hearing). I put my hand on the case and it seems to lessen the issue but I can't pinpoint where exactly it is coming from. If I can't stop it with some stick on rubber pads to absorb some of the shock from the speakers, I'll open the entire tv up and stop it for sure.

No worries, I've taken many of these apart and replaced boards on them

As far as the green cast goes. It's on the edges of many things, but also seems to have a green cast on dark gray items with lower light on them. No adjustments will make them go away. Researching this I didn't really find much about this issue. Could the TV be defective? I'm wondering if a visit to the store will either confirm it's a model wide thing or just my models issue.

I really don't want to pack this up and take it back and have the same issue, I can't imagine that this is a defect...

Any suggestions? I've tried many many settings.

I think you need to get a OTA or try a DVD blu-ray and see if the green is still there. You are still having cable boxes issues I bet. I have your same TV and with my DTV & Dish network it is a incredible picture with no green casts. What setting do you have TV your sound on? The surround sound gave me issues and weird sounds. I just wanted to see what it sounded like with thee speakers. I use my home theater for sound like most everyone. Also post you picture setting please.

PFC5
09-30-2009, 01:51 AM
Make sure the color correction setting is OFF. That makes the greens & blues more pronounced as the only thing I can think of that could possibly give you any green cast issues. We really do need to know all your settings though or else we are just clutching at straws to help.

sincraft
09-30-2009, 09:44 PM
Ok so the cable guy showed up, cleaned up some connections at the demarc, and then checked the signal. +12 is what he was saying or something along those lines. I know how to check again to get the exacts but he seemed extremely confident that there is no reason to troubleshoot the lines, but was concerned about my hodge podged splitter job at my demarc. Radio shack equip and home depot compression fittings done care of <me>. He put much better leads on the board and better tighter fittings...

No difference.

SD is unwatchable. The first thing he said was
"Why is your tv so dim, is this new?!"
and
"I think you have your green way out of adjustment, I see green on all the black areas there, do you see that?"

Of course I laughed and said "YES, I do see that..that is why you are here basically haha" Of course I laughed on the outside, vomited a little on the inside.

My settings? Ok based on the recommendations of these forums, everything is at or less than 50. So I have everything in the factory setting of 'normal'.

It looks ok until we switch it to vivid, then we like that much better. Sharpness is up much more etc and it's brighter, but more washed.

My concern is, if all of these 'better' settings seem to have the contrast ALL the way up. I was concerned about this tv when i was picking it out because it was more dim than the lcd's by far.

They have a sony bravia 46" for 100 less than what I paid...but the better half likes the size of this one better. (thats what she said) :yippee:

So, suffer until I get directv and get past my 150 hours of break in time?

Could one of you experts on panny plasmas swing by my house and tell me everything is cool? Sorry airfare not included. I'm poor now. :(

OH, and just one more thing. I asked him about passing the signal straight through, he said I don't want to do that. Gave some long explanation as to why. He seemed to really by up on all of this, vs me...who is fumbling in the dark. It seems like it just isn't sizing things right, we are always fighting it to either just, full, zoom etc.

We were watching an HD channel of an old rerun of the office (thus the ...thats what she said pun on the brain), and it was obvious it wasn't being sent out on hd. Zoom was the only option to get it to fill the screen without having black in the screen.

To answer antoher persons question, I dont think I have surround on. I dont see that as an option to be honest. I am impressed with the sound and I think the rubber pads I stuck around the speaker output area worked a bit. At 30 , like I said previously...it's loud. I stuck two wii game containers behind the tv deflecting the soudn that shoots down on these tvs outwords, and it was like increasing the volume even more. We have it on a stand fyi. Not that I would do that on a perm basis, but it was an interesting experiment as the sound seemed more crisp.

Its good to know that if I don't want to watch the news in 5.1 , just basic tv I can use just the basic tv sound and be very happy with it. Unlike so many other tvs out there that I've heard of.

Anyway, thanks for the input on this matter. I truly appreciate it. I want to keep this tv and be happy with it, again the green is the biggest drawback, then the low level of brightness/contrast. Somewhere between the lcd at the store and the current settings would be fine. :) I REALLY like the viewing angle, it can't be beat by any lcd I can't imagine.

PFC5
09-30-2009, 11:44 PM
How can we help if you do not list ALL settings like we asked?

It sounds like it may be something wrong with the TV, but we do not know unless you list ALL the settings. I think i have asked for them 3 times now, but you still have not listed them. Until we get those there is not much we can say more.

Try these settings but leave the contrast /picture setting at 50 when watching regularly until you get your 200 hours on the display:

CUSTOM Mode (each input has it's own memory settings so you must set it for each input)
Picture (contrast) = 70
Brightness = 50
Color = 42
Tint = +5
Sharpness = 56
Temp = WARM
Color mgmt = Off
Both noise reductions = Off
Black level = Light

Please try those settings and tell me if that looks better. If it doesn't, then you may have a defective display so you should return it for an exchange if within the return period, or call Panasonic to come look at it under warranty.

Good luck!

Techlord
10-01-2009, 12:03 AM
If you are quoting internet signal levels then you have a problem! Plus +12 on the Downstream Receive Power Level is WAAAAY out of spec! Your Downstream Receive Power Level should be no less than -15 and no more than +15, +12 is real close to the limit for internet signal levels.

sincraft
10-01-2009, 08:22 AM
PFC I will try those settings tonight.

Techlord, I will post every spec on this box when I get home tonight. The +12 was what was listed on the cable box. Apparently that is a above average signal based on his statements. Once I post my signals I will have more fuel to go to bat with if you guys find it an issue. I can reference materials and show them once they arrive to rectify it.

sincraft
10-01-2009, 09:29 PM
Ok I set those setting to what you listed, without the contrast past 50 and I still appear to be very dull, lifeless and GREEN around the edges. From shirt collars to the dark grays looking more like a hue of green, to green shirts and grass looking REAAAAAAAAAAAAALLY green. The green doesn't look bad, it's almost too pleasing to the eyes while everything else does pop too, not like the green. It is very bright while everything else is rather dull / dim. Almost like a crt that has been around for 30 years. Using the presets like vivid, etc help this, but as it has been pointed out, I need to leave it at these levels for awhile to ensure burn in properly. We have about 20 hours on it now.

Oh and I took the signals off of the box tonight, not sure what this all means so hopefully someone can decipher. here is the one that cable guy seemed most interested in.

Current QAM:
Level : 10dbmv (in orange as to signify levels out of balance or something..only setting showing this)
S/N: 38db
EQ gain 1.0

Current FDB:
S/N: 34db
Level 4dbmv

Current RDC:
Power = 29 dbmv

PFC5
10-01-2009, 10:15 PM
It sounds like you have a defective display. I would call Panasonic right away or if you can, just exchange it.

If you are use to having an overly bright and overly saturated colors those settings will not meet that. BUT, if you want it to look like real life and natural then that should be proper. Many people do not properly adjust settings in their displays so when they see them correctly they think there is something wrong, but that green is definitely NOT right.

Did you use those settings while in "CUSTOM" mode?

sincraft
10-03-2009, 12:28 AM
Yea I'm not sure what is going on. Is there a disc or something that I can download and burn that will show me correct colors vs my tv or that will show me obviously blown out colors?

I'd like to look in the store before I take it back at the one they have displayed. I'd hate to take this back if it isn't defective, just me being overly obsessive about a color mismatch.

Yes I too like more realistic colors, as it stands now with 50% contrast and those settings you relayed, it just isn't. Way too dim. I think LCDs are too bright personally. And when you try to get them dimmed they seem almost like they have a dark mask on the tv, kinda like my panny does now, but I 'believe' that will change when I adjust up after burn in time...which I will follow pretty religiously to be honest. We are now about 30 hours in. I left it on this evening when I wasn't really watching to get more hours into it.

I have a decent camera, maybe I could take a pic and post it and you could tell me what you think, I hope I can capture the green highlights...very hard to notice.

But like tonight I was watching the hockey game on the settings you mentioned. No it wasn't custom, it was standard that I adjusted. The yellow border around the boards looked more like yellow green, and the gold on the jersey's looked...gold green, more like brown than gold?

All the colors are a bit more muted than they were before with these settings you suggested but the green still stands out, like the ads along the boards of the ice arena...the green ad really stood out while the reds/blues seemed to match each other in intensity.

PFC5
10-03-2009, 04:11 AM
Yea I'm not sure what is going on. Is there a disc or something that I can download and burn that will show me correct colors vs my tv or that will show me obviously blown out colors?

I'd like to look in the store before I take it back at the one they have displayed. I'd hate to take this back if it isn't defective, just me being overly obsessive about a color mismatch.

Yes I too like more realistic colors, as it stands now with 50% contrast and those settings you relayed, it just isn't. Way too dim. I think LCDs are too bright personally. And when you try to get them dimmed they seem almost like they have a dark mask on the tv, kinda like my panny does now, but I 'believe' that will change when I adjust up after burn in time...which I will follow pretty religiously to be honest. We are now about 30 hours in. I left it on this evening when I wasn't really watching to get more hours into it.

I have a decent camera, maybe I could take a pic and post it and you could tell me what you think, I hope I can capture the green highlights...very hard to notice.

But like tonight I was watching the hockey game on the settings you mentioned. No it wasn't custom, it was standard that I adjusted. The yellow border around the boards looked more like yellow green, and the gold on the jersey's looked...gold green, more like brown than gold?

All the colors are a bit more muted than they were before with these settings you suggested but the green still stands out, like the ads along the boards of the ice arena...the green ad really stood out while the reds/blues seemed to match each other in intensity.

Try changing the mode to "CUSTOM" as this is the best mode besides Cinema which is for when the lights are dim or out when watching a movie. Each mode changes many behind the scenes settings like gamma levels, etc that really do alter the picture quality even when on the same settings. I think CUSTOM would be the best choice for you, but remember you have to adjust the settings for each input when using the CUSTOM mode.

That green you are seeing is likely a defective display. I would exchange it and then you will see that is the problem. I have no such issue with mine and this is the first I have heard about this with the Panasonic plasmas so I have to assume it is defective at this point.

Why spend more time breaking in a display that is defective?

sincraft
10-12-2009, 09:25 PM
Ok so I called Costco to see if they had one in stock to return mine with, and they do not. Talked to the manager and he seemed to think that my issue was phosphor lag, and that all plasma's suffer from this. He said that people that don't notice it are fine to have plasmas, but those with better eyes, will notice it...

So I did the research, it appears very much like what I am experiencing. Darken the tv and the darks or grays have a green tint, and all the edges...especially on darker stations like SD...have a green tinty line along the edges of all the people.

It's not localized what so ever, it's all over.

I pointed it out to several people that noticed it after awhile, when I turned the tv on however it was the first thing I noticed from MINUTE ONE of owning this tv.

Costco said they would take it back, and that they get a high number of returns from plasmas because they are 'too dim'. I too can't stand how dim standard mode is. I would be ok with some of the other presets and settings mentioned in these forums, but that seems like I'm turning my TV up ALL the way just to get the same brightness of an lcd on middle settings????

I love the quickness of this tv, and the image quality with a quality signal seems very good on HD, and even the green lag seems to go away...although dark yellows look more like green...the lag isn't as bad.

But again, I didn't notice this at the stores...I did notice that it was slightly dimmer than the lcds but honestly I DO NOT want the brightness that the lcds at the stores were set at, WAY too bright imo.

Is it still possible to be a defective tv or did the costco guy hit the name on the head?

By the way, my eyes suck. I've got all kinda medical things wrong with them. I can see colors well but everything else is fail. I don't see this on any other tv that I've ever seen anywhere.

OH I tried to take pictures of it, they just aren't coming out to show what I'm talking about. :banghead:

stinkfist69
10-12-2009, 09:56 PM
Ok so I called Costco to see if they had one in stock to return mine with, and they do not. Talked to the manager and he seemed to think that my issue was phosphor lag, and that all plasma's suffer from this. He said that people that don't notice it are fine to have plasmas, but those with better eyes, will notice it...

So I did the research, it appears very much like what I am experiencing. Darken the tv and the darks or grays have a green tint, and all the edges...especially on darker stations like SD...have a green tinty line along the edges of all the people.

It's not localized what so ever, it's all over.

I pointed it out to several people that noticed it after awhile, when I turned the tv on however it was the first thing I noticed from MINUTE ONE of owning this tv.

Costco said they would take it back, and that they get a high number of returns from plasmas because they are 'too dim'. I too can't stand how dim standard mode is. I would be ok with some of the other presets and settings mentioned in these forums, but that seems like I'm turning my TV up ALL the way just to get the same brightness of an lcd on middle settings????

I love the quickness of this tv, and the image quality with a quality signal seems very good on HD, and even the green lag seems to go away...although dark yellows look more like green...the lag isn't as bad.

But again, I didn't notice this at the stores...I did notice that it was slightly dimmer than the lcds but honestly I DO NOT want the brightness that the lcds at the stores were set at, WAY too bright imo.

Is it still possible to be a defective tv or did the costco guy hit the name on the head?

By the way, my eyes suck. I've got all kinda medical things wrong with them. I can see colors well but everything else is fail. I don't see this on any other tv that I've ever seen anywhere.

OH I tried to take pictures of it, they just aren't coming out to show what I'm talking about. :banghead:

I think you were misinformed at Costco about some things about plasmas. My friend is a manager at Costco and he told me that they returned about 10 Plasmas last year and over 50 LCD's. Also as far as phosphor lag I have owned four Plasma's and two LCD's and I have 20/20 vision never seen this green phosphor lag they are talking about. I also can't see how all plasma's have this. I think you just have a bad panel. My Plasma is not to dark. In fact when I had my high end LCD I put it next to my Pioneer Plasma and it had so much better picture and clarity then the LCD that is was a joke for me to keep the LCD. I bought into the bright looks from the store.

sincraft
10-12-2009, 10:33 PM
What about Panny service? Do they send techs to home or do you take tv to them? Also, are they capable or do they just swap boards like most of them do?

I picked up some extra cash swapping boards for a few companies on the weekends and evenings, was pretty lucrative when these tvs were pretty new.

Most of these folks had dead tv's, and were happy when I left. Many expected me to fix the horrible SD quality they had. Wondering if I could tweak something for them. I would play with settings etc but for the most part I was a board jockey. My job, don't think...just remove the 5000 screws and swap the boards and ribbon cables.

MOST however, didn't even know that they were blind as bats. I'd say 90% of them. They either 1. didn't have HD service or 2. weren't tuning to the HD channels. Pretty sad actually.

That was a few years ago...

But I digress.

So it appears the consensus is that I have a defective panel. Should I 1. wait for a product to swap with or 2. call panny service?

The model at the store is as bright as my model. So I don't think that is going to change. I'm concerned as only 100 contrast seems to appeal to me with this tv. My family has a Sony LCD that looks GREAT! I wish I had it. But it is much smaller (46).

daleb
10-13-2009, 12:47 PM
I think you were misinformed at Costco about some things about plasmas. My friend is a manager at Costco and he told me that they returned about 10 Plasmas last year and over 50 LCD's. Also as far as phosphor lag I have owned four Plasma's and two LCD's and I have 20/20 vision never seen this green phosphor lag they are talking about. I also can't see how all plasma's have this. I think you just have a bad panel. My Plasma is not to dark. In fact when I had my high end LCD I put it next to my Pioneer Plasma and it had so much better picture and clarity then the LCD that is was a joke for me to keep the LCD. I bought into the bright looks from the store.

But how many plasmas did they sell vs. LCD? I'm willing to bet they sold a lot more LCDs.

daleb
10-13-2009, 12:50 PM
What about Panny service? Do they send techs to home or do you take tv to them? Also, are they capable or do they just swap boards like most of them do?

I picked up some extra cash swapping boards for a few companies on the weekends and evenings, was pretty lucrative when these tvs were pretty new.

Most of these folks had dead tv's, and were happy when I left. Many expected me to fix the horrible SD quality they had. Wondering if I could tweak something for them. I would play with settings etc but for the most part I was a board jockey. My job, don't think...just remove the 5000 screws and swap the boards and ribbon cables.

MOST however, didn't even know that they were blind as bats. I'd say 90% of them. They either 1. didn't have HD service or 2. weren't tuning to the HD channels. Pretty sad actually.

That was a few years ago...

But I digress.

So it appears the consensus is that I have a defective panel. Should I 1. wait for a product to swap with or 2. call panny service?

The model at the store is as bright as my model. So I don't think that is going to change. I'm concerned as only 100 contrast seems to appeal to me with this tv. My family has a Sony LCD that looks GREAT! I wish I had it. But it is much smaller (46).

As long as Costco has a generous return/swap policy, I would swap it. That will certainly isolate any problems that might have nothing to do with the display, like input sources.
You could call Panasonic tech support and just ask if they are familiar with these issues. If they say it is definitely the panel, then you have something to work with.

PFC5
10-13-2009, 06:45 PM
As long as Costco has a generous return/swap policy, I would swap it. That will certainly isolate any problems that might have nothing to do with the display, like input sources.
You could call Panasonic tech support and just ask if they are familiar with these issues. If they say it is definitely the panel, then you have something to work with.

Excellent advice as usual Daleb. :thumbsup:

It looks extremely likely that it is a defective panel so exchanging it is the best choice if possible.

stinkfist69
10-13-2009, 07:21 PM
But how many plasmas did they sell vs. LCD? I'm willing to bet they sold a lot more LCDs.

Yes the sold five times as many LCD's. But most of the returned LCD's bought plasma instead. I think they sell so many LCD's is because of the way they look at the store compared to plasmas. But when you get then home then they look bad. But most just keep them because they have never seen a plasma in the house and probably never will so they don't know any difference. I would just take the Panasonic back to Costco get Costco cash and go to other Costco that has the Panasonic in stock or wait till the G10's are in. But it sounds like the brightness of the LCD.

daleb
10-14-2009, 01:17 PM
Yes the sold five times as many LCD's. But most of the returned LCD's bought plasma instead. I think they sell so many LCD's is because of the way they look at the store compared to plasmas. But when you get then home then they look bad. But most just keep them because they have never seen a plasma in the house and probably never will so they don't know any difference. I would just take the Panasonic back to Costco get Costco cash and go to other Costco that has the Panasonic in stock or wait till the G10's are in. But it sounds like the brightness of the LCD.

I would agree, many if not most people do not appreciate Plasma, especially is brightly lit showrooms. When I first responded to your question I was thinking of 'failed displays' not just returns to swap with another type. The beauty of Costco, they allow you more time to make up your mind after it is in your home. Probably not their intent, but it can work that way!

sincraft
10-27-2009, 10:15 PM
Just fyi we are opting to keep this model as I visited two different Costco's and saw the same 'green' cast on their demo models.

Obviously not a defective tv. A co-worker that bought the previous years version 46" stated he does not have that on his, maybe it's just this model. I was wondering why it was SO cheap.

It's ok. The option is the larger Samsung that is more pixelated, blurry, uneven colors. The list could go on. Now if it were the same price I might think about it but it's $500 more (or was...now the panny is back to regular price).

It does seem a bit better the higher the quality and brightness/contrast. But when you take the floor models down to standard settings even on their HD feed, it's noticeable.

The best way I can describe this (and I hope I don't make people sick when they see it themselves with their tv) is when you are watching the tv show "The Office". when they look through the blinds with the camera, there is a very bad green cast on all of the blinds. The blinds are actually cream in color in reality but very GREEN on this tv.

How green? Well, not green green but there is a noticable green cast that comes out blatantly when they shoot the camera through the blinds. Cant give you episodes to watch or anything to test this with but I assure you everyone sees it that watches our tv.

BUT Like I said, it's not defective as the same issues are there on the demo models at two different stores. Bad batch? Yea possibly...but I dont think so.

Oh well, while it was expensive it was far less expensive for what I got than another tv of its size. It's eventually going to be a game room tv anyway.

stinkfist69
10-27-2009, 10:55 PM
Just fyi we are opting to keep this model as I visited two different Costco's and saw the same 'green' cast on their demo models.

Obviously not a defective tv. A co-worker that bought the previous years version 46" stated he does not have that on his, maybe it's just this model. I was wondering why it was SO cheap.

It's ok. The option is the larger Samsung that is more pixelated, blurry, uneven colors. The list could go on. Now if it were the same price I might think about it but it's $500 more (or was...now the panny is back to regular price).

It does seem a bit better the higher the quality and brightness/contrast. But when you take the floor models down to standard settings even on their HD feed, it's noticeable.

The best way I can describe this (and I hope I don't make people sick when they see it themselves with their tv) is when you are watching the tv show "The Office". when they look through the blinds with the camera, there is a very bad green cast on all of the blinds. The blinds are actually cream in color in reality but very GREEN on this tv.

How green? Well, not green green but there is a noticable green cast that comes out blatantly when they shoot the camera through the blinds. Cant give you episodes to watch or anything to test this with but I assure you everyone sees it that watches our tv.

BUT Like I said, it's not defective as the same issues are there on the demo models at two different stores. Bad batch? Yea possibly...but I dont think so.

Oh well, while it was expensive it was far less expensive for what I got than another tv of its size. It's eventually going to be a game room tv anyway.

Like I said I have your exact TV right now. I Bought it and a 46" Panasonic from Costco. They don't have this green shade problem. Also I ask my friend who is a Costco manager & he has never been told about this green shade problem or has had any returned for this. I think you got a bad panel. Are you still using cable TV or satellite? Also what does a blu-ray DVD look like?

PFC5
10-27-2009, 11:04 PM
Like I said I have your exact TV right now. I Bought it and a 46" Panasonic from Costco. They don't have this green shade problem. Also I ask my friend who is a Costco manager & he has never been told about this green shade problem or has had any returned for this. I think you got a bad panel. Are you still using cable TV or satellite? Also what does a blu-ray DVD look like?

I agree it must be a bad panel as this is NOT what I see with my prior year model nor what I see in the stores for the current models.

This unit should be exchanged and/or a call should be placed to Panasonic for a tech to look at it. It is NOT "normal" and should not be accepted as it is being described.