Please Help Me - Tosh DLP

Soni

Hi Guys, i'm after your help and advice.

I live in England , and as you are probably aware, DLP is a relatively new technology over here. I've purchased the Tosh DLP - 46WM48P which i believe is the equivalent model to your 46HM84, and although i think the set is the muts nuts, it does have a very irritating problem.

Myself and other owners that i know of, are thinking of returning their sets due to a terrible blurring problem on medium speed camera pans. Its a real shame as i absolutely adore this TV, it has the sharpest picture of all the DLP sets currently available, and displays lovely vibrant colours. Have any of you guys experienced problems like this? It occurs on our standard digital reception (which is not HD yet - apparently HD is being broadcasted by SKY from January 2006), but it is also blurring on DVD's, and i have the Denon 2910 which i consider to be quite a good player.

Any comments from any of you would be much appreciated, as i would like to get to the bottom of the problem and not have to return the set.

kdog044

I don't know why you are having a problem with DVD's but it may be the "macroblocking bug" that plagues many players that use the Faroudja 23XX chip. The broadcast issue is called "temporal dithering" and it is something that occurs on DLP sets and is not unique to one manufacturer. I believe LCD sets have a similar problem called "motion blur".

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Toshiba 62HMX94
Motorola DCT6412 and Motorola Cable Card
Sony DVP-NS975V DVD Player
Sony STR-DE935 Receiver

Soni

Thanks Kdog for your reply . The panning blur isn't only on the Denon player, it's on Toshiba, Samsung, and the Panasonic! I have my Denon hooked up to the Tosh via HDMI, and the blurring is still present. Quite a few people over here are thinking of returning the Tosh, but to be honest, apart from the blurring, its a wicked set. I've even spoken to some owners that have downloaded HD clips off the net, onto their PC, and hooked it up to the Tosh via HDMI, and the panning blur is still there with HD! We're at a bit of a loss! I understand you guys have had a similar problem when the Olympics were broadcasted?

kdog044

I'm not sure of the models you are referring to but the Panasonic S97, Samsung HD941 and the Toshiba v592 all use the Faroudja 2310 deinterlacer. Sony is one of the few that uses it's own deinterlacer so it does not suffer from the macroblocking bug. I don't know if that is the problem as I haven't seen what you are referring to but I don't have any PQ issues with my player and display. I have seen the broadcast problem though and the only time I notice it is during sporting events such as basketball with camera pans during player movement.

I didn't have my set during the Olympics but I think that was a different problem with pixelation and I thought it was a problem with the encoders or some other hardware issue with the feeds. I believe it was most noticable during the diving if I remember reading correctly.

__________________
Toshiba 62HMX94
Motorola DCT6412 and Motorola Cable Card
Sony DVP-NS975V DVD Player
Sony STR-DE935 Receiver

Soni

I've spoken over on the English Forums, and owners of other models for example Optoma and Samsung, inform me that they don't have the problem us Tosh owners are experiencing. They also own Panasonic, Sammy, and Denon players. Do any of you guys in the US have ANY problems with panning???? The sought of thing we're seeing is a fizzyness/blur type of problem on medium speed panning shots. P.S - if your not seeing these problems is the English Tosh 46WM48 the same spec as your US Tosh 46HM84?

RSawdey

Can you give us a link to specs on a UK site? It sounds more like the buggy Tosh LCD RPTV than their DLP RPTV...

The 46HM84 is a DLP model that uses the HD2+ chip...

Soni

Thank you for your reply RSawdey - The following link is in German -
http://www.toshiba.de/consumer/products/4/
but it is the WM 48 P (52") however i've got the 46". The problem over here exists on both the 46 and 52. As you will see it is definately the DLP HD2+ Chip Rear Pro and not the LCD Rear Pro. It looks identical to your 46/52 HM84. I've tested every Tosh DLP i've seen in the shops - and they've all got this blinking problem! I've got an engineer coming from Comet next Saturday (not that there's anything they can do - but they've got to look at it first) and then i may be thinking about returning it, i don't want to as its a lovely set apart from the blurring, but i haven't spent £600 on a Denon 2910 player, to see blurring on the Tosh. It seems to defeat the object. The films its noticeable on is Gladiator - 3 minutes and 16 seconds in as Maximus is walking through the ranks prior to the battle, he greets all his soldiers, look closely at his face, it blurs big time and his whole face seems to fall apart, another one is The Day After Tommorrow, right at the beginning when the snow starts in hong kong and the chinese guy is having a drink at the outside bar as the police car drives past, look at his face as the camera pans towards him, his face blurs, the chopper flying over New York during the storm, as it flies accross the screen - there's like a fizzing dotty/blurring all over the helicopter. Its a shame as the picture is one of the most sharpest out of all the DLP's we have over here - i've tested the Sammy 46 HD3 and also the HD2 50" Pedestal stand type, and both of those don't have any blurring but their picture is to smoothed out for my liking. I would be interested in hearing from you guys once you've tested those discs!

RSawdey

You might want to look at the Sammy 4674...

I'd guess the Tosh ran into a timing glitch, something to do with 50 Hz/ 60 Hz issue. The Samsung DLP has the same DLP chip, but better upconversion.

kdog044

Soni,

I sent you a PM. I don't know if your set is equivalent to the HM84 but I don't have the problems you are describing. I checked Gladiator at the spot you mentioned and have no blurring or picture breakup. I've watched about 15 or 20 DVD's since I purchased mine a few weeks ago and I have not seen any artifacts will viewing any of them.

__________________
Toshiba 62HMX94
Motorola DCT6412 and Motorola Cable Card
Sony DVP-NS975V DVD Player
Sony STR-DE935 Receiver

Soni

Thanks Kdog and RSawdey for your replies - Sorry for the delay in responding but i don't seem to be getting E-mail notification of new posts from this site - even though i've selected it in the settings!

I have seen the Sammy your referring to - its called the Samsung SP46 over here. I demoed the problem DVD's on the Sammy in store and it didn't have any of the blurring or oil painting effect that the Toshiba exhibits. Although i found the picture on the Sammy not to be as pin sharp as the Toshiba. Its a shame, as i really like the look of the Tosh and its picture sharpness - i'll have to give it some carefull consideration.

videobruce

I looked at the '05 models with the black bezel around the screen and on 3 different sets when I hooked a B&K HD signal generator up to them I saw a very noisy image at the lower end of the grey scale range. It seems to look as there is too much amplification being used on the component inputs. I also noticed vertical lines are wavy. Again, as if there is either a excessive signal level or to my gain somewhere. I haven't seen this on the Mits LCD and the JVC D-ILA.

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