Best HD Set for Standard TV?

JimThompson · 08-21-2005, 04:56 AM

Opinions on the best HD set if much of what you watch is standard TV? I've researched and found HD sets I'm OK with for HDTV, but I'm not sure how my ordinary TV viewing will be.

I have my eye on the JVC HD-ILAs (2k,720) and the Samsung HLR5078(3K,1080). I don't watch much TV except news and golf. I want a new TV, though, so I may as well get what's out there. Will also use it for a PC monitor when I am too lazy to go to my office. Plasma not an option for me. Despite the brilliant picture, every plasma TV I've seen is basically a mirror, and I do not watch TV in a dark room. In fact, I can't figure out how people pay so much for a good plasma picture and then see a reflection of everything in the room--very distracting for me.

Anyway, of course I'd like all my TV fare to be HD, but right now the offerings from Comcast are limited. I'm worried that if I buy an HD set I'll get great occasional HD viewing and crappy everyday viewing. Saw the JVC HD-ILA and the salesperson couldn't get a decent SD display, period. But of course it may have been he and not the set. A few things I've noticed:

1. The aspect ratio issues are VERY annoying. Short, fat people, or people with fat left arms and normal bodies, or cropped pictures...I'm a little surprised that folks obsess over HD PQ and ignore distortion. I will definitely plan to watch undistorted SD and live with black bands.
2. I want to make sure the bands are black and I don't know how to research this. My brother's TV (Samsung/Akai, wide-screen but not HD) has bright silver sidebands for "regular" TV programming. It is so distracting and annoying that he uses the full screen and lives with image distortion or crops. Observations? I am aware that watching a distorted image for long enough will let some people's brains reprogram the distorted image to "normal" but I am not one of them.

Cost is not an issue except I'm too cheap to spend much considering my casual, non-aficionado viewing habits, and the limitations of the current broadcasts. I'm not in a contest to get some spectacular set which "blows away the competition." I just want a decent HDTV that gives me a decent everyday experience. I'm OK with paying a few thousand if the TV will position me for future improvements in broadcasting; certainly over $3500 would make me start to complain a bit. If anyone has advice, or can point me to the right place, I'd appreciate it. Many thanks.

rslamon · 08-21-2005, 06:18 AM

You can change the ratios to "full screen" depending on your connection set up. For regular cable (video 1 connection) I set it up this way for viewing STD. I only watch the HD channels on the DVI connection where I left the setting to "Natural" and everything seems to be ok.

Suomi · 08-21-2005, 12:04 PM

When shopping for my TV, I settled on the Toshiba 52HM84 because I thought it handled regulard broadcast signals better than anything else I saw. This set does, however, only have light grey side bars. It bothered me at first but I got used to it. Now I have Dish Network, and my 811 STB has the option for grey or black sidebars for 4:3 broadcasts. Perhaps the Comcast box would have the same feature. You might look into that, so you have one less thing to worry about when shopping.

Nuked · 08-21-2005, 01:22 PM

The light grey side bars I believe are to prevent burn-in. Is the TV or cable/STB/receiver/signal strength/settings most responsible for the pq of SD?

**PFC5** · 08-21-2005, 02:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimThompson

Opinions on the best HD set if much of what you watch is standard TV? I've researched and found HD sets I'm OK with for HDTV, but I'm not sure how my ordinary TV viewing will be.

I have my eye on the JVC HD-ILAs (2k,720) and the Samsung HLR5078(3K,1080). I don't watch much TV except news and golf. I want a new TV, though, so I may as well get what's out there. Will also use it for a PC monitor when I am too lazy to go to my office. Plasma not an option for me. Despite the brilliant picture, every plasma TV I've seen is basically a mirror, and I do not watch TV in a dark room. In fact, I can't figure out how people pay so much for a good plasma picture and then see a reflection of everything in the room--very distracting for me.

Anyway, of course I'd like all my TV fare to be HD, but right now the offerings from Comcast are limited. I'm worried that if I buy an HD set I'll get great occasional HD viewing and crappy everyday viewing. Saw the JVC HD-ILA and the salesperson couldn't get a decent SD display, period. But of course it may have been he and not the set. A few things I've noticed:

1. The aspect ratio issues are VERY annoying. Short, fat people, or people with fat left arms and normal bodies, or cropped pictures...I'm a little surprised that folks obsess over HD PQ and ignore distortion. I will definitely plan to watch undistorted SD and live with black bands.
2. I want to make sure the bands are black and I don't know how to research this. My brother's TV (Samsung/Akai, wide-screen but not HD) has bright silver sidebands for "regular" TV programming. It is so distracting and annoying that he uses the full screen and lives with image distortion or crops. Observations? I am aware that watching a distorted image for long enough will let some people's brains reprogram the distorted image to "normal" but I am not one of them.

Cost is not an issue except I'm too cheap to spend much considering my casual, non-aficionado viewing habits, and the limitations of the current broadcasts. I'm not in a contest to get some spectacular set which "blows away the competition." I just want a decent HDTV that gives me a decent everyday experience. I'm OK with paying a few thousand if the TV will position me for future improvements in broadcasting; certainly over $3500 would make me start to complain a bit. If anyone has advice, or can point me to the right place, I'd appreciate it. Many thanks.

I also hate those gray bars on the side when watching 4:3 programming.

I believe the JVC DILA sets DO have the gray bars, maybe someone that owns one can tell us if you can change them to black via the cable box. I know the Scientific Atlanta boxes have that option, but I do not know if it will allow the gray bars to be changed with the JVCs.

I have heard mixed reviews on the JVC when they display SD channels. Some say they look great, some say they are the worst. It depends partly on the signal so you will need to check this at more than one store. I have heard the same mixed reviews on the Toshiba, and most other HDTVs.

I will say that overall, I am very pleased with the SD channels on my RCA DLP, but they do not sell the model I have with the HD2+ chip anymore, except with the Thin Profile series. The standard RCA DLP models have either the HD3 or HD4 chip in them which are wobulated. Some are saying that the HD4 chips are much better than the HD3, so it may be an option to check out.

I had also tried a Samsung, and liked the SD PQ on it, but I returned it for the lip-sync issue.

You might want to consider a smaller screen to help with the SD PQ. I went with a 50" for my viewing distance of 10-12' which would have allowed a 56" screen, but the bigger the screen the harder it will be to display a good SD channel generally. SD signals were never designed to be displayed on anything larger than 36", so when you blow up that signal on a larger TV it will not look as good.

What you need to do is go to at least several stores and look at the Sd PQ of all the HDTVs you are interested in. Only your eyes will know what is acceptable.

Hope this helps!

Good luck & happy hunting!

JimThompson · 08-21-2005, 09:41 PM

Thank you kindly, each of you.

FWIW I did see in the Samsung brochure that the "normal" view has black sidebars. I don't know if the color of the sidebar has to do with burn-in; the Samsung notes on their site claims it's not an issue.

I thought I saw gray sidebars on the JVC when the store guy was fiddling with it, so I will be buying the Samsung.

jt

hb2474 · 08-21-2005, 10:19 PM

DLP's dont burn in!

kdog044 · 08-22-2005, 08:41 AM

The grey bars are a hold over from CRT sets and aren't needed anymore. There are a few manufacturers like Toshiba and JVC who still use them for some reason. As mentioned earlier, certain STB's will output black bars with you set the 4:3 option to "off" which will then use the HD resolution setting (i.e. 720p or 1080i) and use the black bars to fill the screen on 4:3 images. The problem with this is you can't use the stretch modes of the TV. I prefer to set my STB to 480i or 480p for the 4:3 menu option and use my TheaterWide I stretch mode to fill the screen. This Toshiba mode keeps the center of the screen intact and slightly stretches the left and right side to fill the screen.

JimThompson · 08-22-2005, 09:25 PM

Not to belabor it, but I have been surprised--startled, really--that so many folks who worry about a single pixel being dead, or a black that isn't black enough don't mind a little distortion. It just strikes me as odd that we accept "stretching" so cavalierly but nitpick over whether or not the distorted image is Highly Defined enough.

licher12 · 08-23-2005, 01:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimThompson

Not to belabor it, but I have been surprised--startled, really--that so many folks who worry about a single pixel being dead, or a black that isn't black enough don't mind a little distortion. It just strikes me as odd that we accept "stretching" so cavalierly but nitpick over whether or not the distorted image is Highly Defined enough.

Bump this I have always been startled myself at people who stretch to fit lol. People cars etc look retarted out of ratio. Makes me want to vomit.

kdog044 · 08-23-2005, 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by licher12

Bump this I have always been startled myself at people who stretch to fit lol. People cars etc look retarted out of ratio. Makes me want to vomit.

That depends on how the display stretches the picture. The nice thing about the way mine is configured is you have the OPTION to stretch or not and Toshiba IMO has some of best stretch modes available.

08-21-2005, 04:56 AM	#1
JimThompson Ignorant but not stupid. Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 5	Best HD Set for Standard TV? Opinions on the best HD set if much of what you watch is standard TV? I've researched and found HD sets I'm OK with for HDTV, but I'm not sure how my ordinary TV viewing will be. I have my eye on the JVC HD-ILAs (2k,720) and the Samsung HLR5078(3K,1080). I don't watch much TV except news and golf. I want a new TV, though, so I may as well get what's out there. Will also use it for a PC monitor when I am too lazy to go to my office. Plasma not an option for me. Despite the brilliant picture, every plasma TV I've seen is basically a mirror, and I do not watch TV in a dark room. In fact, I can't figure out how people pay so much for a good plasma picture and then see a reflection of everything in the room--very distracting for me. Anyway, of course I'd like all my TV fare to be HD, but right now the offerings from Comcast are limited. I'm worried that if I buy an HD set I'll get great occasional HD viewing and crappy everyday viewing. Saw the JVC HD-ILA and the salesperson couldn't get a decent SD display, period. But of course it may have been he and not the set. A few things I've noticed: 1. The aspect ratio issues are VERY annoying. Short, fat people, or people with fat left arms and normal bodies, or cropped pictures...I'm a little surprised that folks obsess over HD PQ and ignore distortion. I will definitely plan to watch undistorted SD and live with black bands. 2. I want to make sure the bands are black and I don't know how to research this. My brother's TV (Samsung/Akai, wide-screen but not HD) has bright silver sidebands for "regular" TV programming. It is so distracting and annoying that he uses the full screen and lives with image distortion or crops. Observations? I am aware that watching a distorted image for long enough will let some people's brains reprogram the distorted image to "normal" but I am not one of them. Cost is not an issue except I'm too cheap to spend much considering my casual, non-aficionado viewing habits, and the limitations of the current broadcasts. I'm not in a contest to get some spectacular set which "blows away the competition." I just want a decent HDTV that gives me a decent everyday experience. I'm OK with paying a few thousand if the TV will position me for future improvements in broadcasting; certainly over $3500 would make me start to complain a bit. If anyone has advice, or can point me to the right place, I'd appreciate it. Many thanks.

08-21-2005, 06:18 AM	#2
rslamon High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 145	You can change the ratios to "full screen" depending on your connection set up. For regular cable (video 1 connection) I set it up this way for viewing STD. I only watch the HD channels on the DVI connection where I left the setting to "Natural" and everything seems to be ok. __________________ My equipment: -------------------------------------- Panasonic TC-P50X1 Onkyo TX-DS494 (Time to upgrade) Panny DMP-BD35 Blu Ray player Motorolla DCT 2000 Infinity speakers

08-21-2005, 12:04 PM	#3
Suomi blah Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Lansing, MI Age: 29 Posts: 130	When shopping for my TV, I settled on the Toshiba 52HM84 because I thought it handled regulard broadcast signals better than anything else I saw. This set does, however, only have light grey side bars. It bothered me at first but I got used to it. Now I have Dish Network, and my 811 STB has the option for grey or black sidebars for 4:3 broadcasts. Perhaps the Comcast box would have the same feature. You might look into that, so you have one less thing to worry about when shopping. __________________ • Toshiba 52HM84 • Onkyo TX-SR701 receiver with 6.1 surround • Sony DVP-NC875V 5 DVD/SACD carousel • Harmon/Kardon T20 turntable (circa 1983) • Technics RS-TR 252 cassette deck (you remember tapes right?) • Toshiba W528 HiFi VCR (for my few remaining video cassettes) • Dish Network with 211 receiver (HDMI and component video for when the HDMI doesn't work and digital optical audio)

08-22-2005, 08:41 AM	#8
kdog044 High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Michigan Posts: 437	The grey bars are a hold over from CRT sets and aren't needed anymore. There are a few manufacturers like Toshiba and JVC who still use them for some reason. As mentioned earlier, certain STB's will output black bars with you set the 4:3 option to "off" which will then use the HD resolution setting (i.e. 720p or 1080i) and use the black bars to fill the screen on 4:3 images. The problem with this is you can't use the stretch modes of the TV. I prefer to set my STB to 480i or 480p for the 4:3 menu option and use my TheaterWide I stretch mode to fill the screen. This Toshiba mode keeps the center of the screen intact and slightly stretches the left and right side to fill the screen. __________________ Toshiba 62HMX94 Motorola DCT6412 and Motorola Cable Card Sony DVP-NS975V DVD Player Sony STR-DE935 Receiver

08-21-2005, 01:22 PM	#4
Nuked I Love old movies Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Florida Posts: 11	The light grey side bars I believe are to prevent burn-in. Is the TV or cable/STB/receiver/signal strength/settings most responsible for the pq of SD?

08-21-2005, 09:41 PM	#6
JimThompson Ignorant but not stupid. Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 5	Thank you kindly, each of you. FWIW I did see in the Samsung brochure that the "normal" view has black sidebars. I don't know if the color of the sidebar has to do with burn-in; the Samsung notes on their site claims it's not an issue. I thought I saw gray sidebars on the JVC when the store guy was fiddling with it, so I will be buying the Samsung. jt

08-21-2005, 10:19 PM	#7
hb2474 Samsung DLP 56" 811 box Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 93	DLP's dont burn in!

08-22-2005, 09:25 PM	#9
JimThompson Ignorant but not stupid. Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 5	Not to belabor it, but I have been surprised--startled, really--that so many folks who worry about a single pixel being dead, or a black that isn't black enough don't mind a little distortion. It just strikes me as odd that we accept "stretching" so cavalierly but nitpick over whether or not the distorted image is Highly Defined enough.