UHF Antenna Gain Comparison Charts

stampeder · 01-16-2009, 01:19 PM

All gain figures are Net Gain in dBi, which is the default standard for computer design and modeling software.

Code:

Gain Figures For Similar Large-Sized UHF Antennas

Channel  4228   4228HD  PR-8800  DB-8    DBGH   M-8

14      10.00   13.15   12.50   11.00   14.34   14.93
19      12.00   13.75   13.70   12.00   17.17   15.63^
27      14.00   13.85   14.50   13.50   17.83   16.40^
35      15.50   13.05   14.40   14.20   18.26   16.77^
43      15.70   13.25   12.00   15.00   16.53   17.07^
52      15.00   13.85   10.50   16.00    8.92*  17.25
60      14.00   13.85   10.00   16.60      NA   16.07

Notes:

CM4228 is the original Channel Master 8-bay bowtie reflector (data from HDTVPrimer site)
CM4228HD is the new Channel Master 8-bay bowtie reflector (data provided by CM to videobruce - a DHC member. Assumed to have been in dBd)
PR-8800 is an 8-bay bowtie reflector made by Winegard (data from HDTVPrimer site)
DB-8 is an 8-bay bowtie reflector made by Antennas Direct (data from HDTVPrimer site)
DBGH is a Double Bay Gray Hoverman (data from 300ohm - a DHC member)
* is the listed gain on Channel 51 (antenna not designed for 52 and higher)
M-8 is a DIY 8-bay 52x40 5 inch space angled Reflector & Elements 17in 450 ohm feed (data from mclapp - a DHC member)
^ is the listed gain on the next highest channel since tables did not match all channels

The new Channel Master 4228HD is outclassed by all the other antennas in the chart in most of the UHF spectrum.

It is not a bad antenna; it is just an also-ran. The two Do-It-Yourself antennas (the DBGH and the M-8) are clearly in a league of their own.

stampeder · 01-16-2009, 01:20 PM

All gain figures are Net Gain in dBi, which is the default standard for computer design and modeling software.

Code:

Gain Figures For Similar Medium-Sized UHF Antennas

Channel  4221   4221HD  PR-4400  DB-4    SBGH    M-4

14       9.50   13.05    9.00    5.00   14.24    9.87
19      10.50   12.75   10.00    7.50   14.74   13.52^
27      11.50   12.45   11.00   10.25   14.61   14.91^
35      13.00   13.55   12.00   11.40   14.75   15.91^
43      13.50   15.05   12.50   12.10   15.30   16.75^
52      14.20   13.75   13.00   12.85   15.03   16.21
60      15.00   15.15   14.00   13.20     NA*   13.85

Notes:

CM4221 is the original Channel Master 4-bay bowtie reflector (data from HDTVPrimer site)
CM4221HD is the new Channel Master 4-bay bowtie reflector (data provided by CM to videobruce - a DHC member. Assumed to have been in dBd)
PR-4400 is a 4-bay bowtie reflector made by Winegard (data from HDTVPrimer site)
DB-4 is a 4-bay bowtie reflector made by Antennas Direct (data from HDTVPrimer site)
SBGH is a Single Bay Gray Hoverman Gold Standard (GH10 data from j3d - a DHC member)
* antenna not designed for 52 and higher
M-4 is a DIY 4 Bay 40x44 14 inch Reflector spacing fwd ele & refl (data from mclapp - a DHC member)
^ is the listed gain on the next highest channel since tables did not match all channels

As you can see, the SBGH takes the lower range handily, and the DIY 4-bay by mclapp easily pulls away in the mid to high range.

willscary · 01-16-2009, 03:12 PM

Stampeder,

Is there any chance you could add the 91XG to the top chart and the 43XG to the bottom chart?

thanks,

Bill

stampeder · 01-16-2009, 07:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willscary

any chance you could add the 91XG to the top chart and the 43XG to the bottom chart?

I could but they are Corner Reflector Yagis (dissimilar antennas in concept to those reflector-based antennas in the charts). Here are the numbers on the Antennas Direct 91XG for comparison (data from HDTVPrimer site):

Code:

Channel     Net Gain dBi

14              11.50
19              12.00
27              13.40
35              14.40
43              14.95
52              15.60
60              16.60

You can see that the two Large DIY antennas (DBGH and M-8) smoke the 91XG, while the Small DIY antennas (SBGH and M-4) are equal or better to it. The 91XG fares well against the commercial Large-Sized antennas, but unfortunately it's strongest reception is on the channels that will be disappearing after the digital transition.

Sorry but I do not have data for the 43XG at this time.

crabby_bob · 01-16-2009, 08:05 PM

Looking at your information I would have expected the 91XG and the CM 4228 to perform equally well but I got much better results from the 91XG. From what I've read on this site I tend to believe that is because the 91XG does better of dealing with multipath signals. I'm curious as to whether or not you would recommend trying one of the other antennas in your table.

Here's my tvfool info

stampeder · 01-17-2009, 12:44 PM

It doesn't surprise me when a person has results that go against what the data tells us. Two side-by-side houses can have different reception needs, so I'm fine with what you've found for your own situation. The 91XG has wonderful directionality for rejecting multipath, and the CM4228 is no slouch in that department either, so its not really a matter of gain figures in your case.

For me the comparison charts are the best way to look at how each model does when put in the same situation.

In the case of the DBGH antenna, we have reports from people all over North America who built one of how much more powerful it is than any commercial antenna on the market they've tried. The comparison data shows such a big gap in gain that it is not surprising that in the "real world" it is stronger.

The SBGH is very popular because it costs a fraction of what a commercial antenna does (just the parts at Home Depot or Lowes) yet gives about the same performance.

cheers

smdp1 · 01-17-2009, 12:57 PM

anyone tried a 4 bay GH?.....not that I could ever use one because of wind load here, but just a thought for the heck of it......

stampeder · 01-17-2009, 01:35 PM

I haven't heard of anyone trying a 4-bay GH, and I don't know if any of the computer modelers have looked into it. You could ask them by following the links in this:

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=81982

samstom · 01-18-2009, 08:56 PM

Guys,
Judging from the chart, does it mean that the new 4228HD has the same gain as the new 4221HD? Their gain seems to be pretty similar, are they?

Has most of the UHF gain on the new 4228 been compromised cos I have a separate antenna for VHF and I need a good one for my UHF channels?

jim5506 · 01-18-2009, 09:06 PM

Judging by the chart, you can see that figures often do lie.

We have apples, oranges, apricots and pears to compare here.

stampeder · 01-18-2009, 11:03 PM

I'm not sure what you're getting at, but you are free to interpret the charts how you see fit. They're net gain figures for similar antennas, with a corner reflector yagi for comparison.

No big philosophical issues being discussed here, just the numbers on display.

Its good to have this information for checking out which antennas to go with. Regardless, the factual, real world evidence is that the DBGH kicks butt.

samstom · 01-19-2009, 01:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stampeder

I'm not sure what you're getting at, but you are free to interpret the charts how you see fit. They're net gain figures for similar antennas, with a corner reflector yagi for comparison.

No big philosophical issues being discussed here, just the numbers on display.

Its good to have this information for checking out which antennas to go with. Regardless, the factual, real world evidence is that the DBGH kicks butt.

For example the net gain for 4221HD is 15.05 on ch 43 while the figure for 4228HD is at 13.25. Does this mean that 4221 fares better on ch43 as compared to 4228? I am thinking of upgrading to a 4228 HD and I would like more info on this antenna.

willscary · 01-19-2009, 08:33 AM

The 4228 has more gain at that channel. The 4228 is a better antenna if all of your channels are between 24 and 51. If, however, you want to pick up channels 7-23, the 4228HD is a better candidate.

The original 4228 was hailed as a UHF antenna with some gain on a few VHF high channels (9-12). The new 4228HD has been redesigned and gives better gain on all VHF high channels (7-13) and has also been tuned to give better performance on low UHF channels 14-23 at the expense of some gain on mid and upper UHF channels. CM has essentially flattened the gain curve to give fairly equal gain across the UHF spectrum, plus increased upper VHF gain across the spectrum.

Also, the new 4228 HD is lighter in weight, it comes fully assembled and ready to mount, and it has a built in matching balun. None of these features are on the 4228 original.

If you wnat better gain from channel 23 on up, look for an original. If you want an antenna with good gain and a flat gain curve, look at the 4228HD. If you really want the best, try making one of the GH designs stampeder talks about. You could spend $10 and a Saturday morning and perhaps end up with a much better antenna than either of the Channel Masters.

I bought antennas, but that is me...I believe fully that Stampeder's antenna is better than my 4228HD and my 91XG, but mine are mounted 43' in the air and right now I have 1/4" of ice on them, 30" of snow on the ground, it is -5 degrees and the wind is blowing 15 mph. I am not sure a homemade design would hold up to my conditions without some kind of failure, either in the antenna or my tower and mast.

Bill

samstom · 01-19-2009, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by willscary

The 4228 has more gain at that channel. The 4228 is a better antenna if all of your channels are between 24 and 51. If, however, you want to pick up channels 7-23, the 4228HD is a better candidate.

The original 4228 was hailed as a UHF antenna with some gain on a few VHF high channels (9-12). The new 4228HD has been redesigned and gives better gain on all VHF high channels (7-13) and has also been tuned to give better performance on low UHF channels 14-23 at the expense of some gain on mid and upper UHF channels. CM has essentially flattened the gain curve to give fairly equal gain across the UHF spectrum, plus increased upper VHF gain across the spectrum.

Also, the new 4228 HD is lighter in weight, it comes fully assembled and ready to mount, and it has a built in matching balun. None of these features are on the 4228 original.

If you wnat better gain from channel 23 on up, look for an original. If you want an antenna with good gain and a flat gain curve, look at the 4228HD. If you really want the best, try making one of the GH designs stampeder talks about. You could spend $10 and a Saturday morning and perhaps end up with a much better antenna than either of the Channel Masters.

I bought antennas, but that is me...I believe fully that Stampeder's antenna is better than my 4228HD and my 91XG, but mine are mounted 43' in the air and right now I have 1/4" of ice on them, 30" of snow on the ground, it is -5 degrees and the wind is blowing 15 mph. I am not sure a homemade design would hold up to my conditions without some kind of failure, either in the antenna or my tower and mast.

Bill

Hi Bill and guys,
Do u know of any sites where I can order the original 4228 online? The channels I need are between ch 23 and 46. I might be able to mount the 4228 outside my window as I live in a 26 storey condo and the yagi antennas are pretty much out for me. I can still combined the remaining VHF signals with the MATV sys on the roof.

Any ideas where I can get the old 4228? Thanks a lot for helping!

stampeder · 01-19-2009, 12:45 PM

The original CM4228 is disappearing from stock everywhere. Keep phoning the 1-800 numbers you find on the web, but I don't know if you'll have much luck. Some used ones have been coming up on private sale at sites like Craigslist here and there.

How about building an SBGH or DBGH?

01-16-2009, 01:19 PM	#1
stampeder Canadian OTA Guy Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Delta, BC, Canada Posts: 43	UHF Antenna Gain Comparison Charts All gain figures are Net Gain in dBi, which is the default standard for computer design and modeling software. Code: Gain Figures For Similar Large-Sized UHF Antennas Channel 4228 4228HD PR-8800 DB-8 DBGH M-8 14 10.00 13.15 12.50 11.00 14.34 14.93 19 12.00 13.75 13.70 12.00 17.17 15.63^ 27 14.00 13.85 14.50 13.50 17.83 16.40^ 35 15.50 13.05 14.40 14.20 18.26 16.77^ 43 15.70 13.25 12.00 15.00 16.53 17.07^ 52 15.00 13.85 10.50 16.00 8.92* 17.25 60 14.00 13.85 10.00 16.60 NA 16.07 Notes: CM4228 is the original Channel Master 8-bay bowtie reflector (data from HDTVPrimer site) CM4228HD is the new Channel Master 8-bay bowtie reflector (data provided by CM to videobruce - a DHC member. Assumed to have been in dBd) PR-8800 is an 8-bay bowtie reflector made by Winegard (data from HDTVPrimer site) DB-8 is an 8-bay bowtie reflector made by Antennas Direct (data from HDTVPrimer site) DBGH is a Double Bay Gray Hoverman (data from 300ohm - a DHC member) * is the listed gain on Channel 51 (antenna not designed for 52 and higher) M-8 is a DIY 8-bay 52x40 5 inch space angled Reflector & Elements 17in 450 ohm feed (data from mclapp - a DHC member) ^ is the listed gain on the next highest channel since tables did not match all channels The new Channel Master 4228HD is outclassed by all the other antennas in the chart in most of the UHF spectrum. It is not a bad antenna; it is just an also-ran. The two Do-It-Yourself antennas (the DBGH and the M-8) are clearly in a league of their own. Last edited by stampeder; 01-16-2009 at 01:52 PM.

01-16-2009, 01:20 PM	#2
stampeder Canadian OTA Guy Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Delta, BC, Canada Posts: 43	All gain figures are Net Gain in dBi, which is the default standard for computer design and modeling software. Code: Gain Figures For Similar Medium-Sized UHF Antennas Channel 4221 4221HD PR-4400 DB-4 SBGH M-4 14 9.50 13.05 9.00 5.00 14.24 9.87 19 10.50 12.75 10.00 7.50 14.74 13.52^ 27 11.50 12.45 11.00 10.25 14.61 14.91^ 35 13.00 13.55 12.00 11.40 14.75 15.91^ 43 13.50 15.05 12.50 12.10 15.30 16.75^ 52 14.20 13.75 13.00 12.85 15.03 16.21 60 15.00 15.15 14.00 13.20 NA* 13.85 Notes: CM4221 is the original Channel Master 4-bay bowtie reflector (data from HDTVPrimer site) CM4221HD is the new Channel Master 4-bay bowtie reflector (data provided by CM to videobruce - a DHC member. Assumed to have been in dBd) PR-4400 is a 4-bay bowtie reflector made by Winegard (data from HDTVPrimer site) DB-4 is a 4-bay bowtie reflector made by Antennas Direct (data from HDTVPrimer site) SBGH is a Single Bay Gray Hoverman Gold Standard (GH10 data from j3d - a DHC member) * antenna not designed for 52 and higher M-4 is a DIY 4 Bay 40x44 14 inch Reflector spacing fwd ele & refl (data from mclapp - a DHC member) ^ is the listed gain on the next highest channel since tables did not match all channels As you can see, the SBGH takes the lower range handily, and the DIY 4-bay by mclapp easily pulls away in the mid to high range. Last edited by stampeder; 01-16-2009 at 01:52 PM.

01-16-2009, 08:05 PM	#5
crabby_bob High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 120	Looking at your information I would have expected the 91XG and the CM 4228 to perform equally well but I got much better results from the 91XG. From what I've read on this site I tend to believe that is because the 91XG does better of dealing with multipath signals. I'm curious as to whether or not you would recommend trying one of the other antennas in your table. Here's my tvfool info Last edited by crabby_bob; 01-16-2009 at 10:07 PM.

01-17-2009, 12:44 PM	#6
stampeder Canadian OTA Guy Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Delta, BC, Canada Posts: 43	It doesn't surprise me when a person has results that go against what the data tells us. Two side-by-side houses can have different reception needs, so I'm fine with what you've found for your own situation. The 91XG has wonderful directionality for rejecting multipath, and the CM4228 is no slouch in that department either, so its not really a matter of gain figures in your case. For me the comparison charts are the best way to look at how each model does when put in the same situation. In the case of the DBGH antenna, we have reports from people all over North America who built one of how much more powerful it is than any commercial antenna on the market they've tried. The comparison data shows such a big gap in gain that it is not surprising that in the "real world" it is stronger. The SBGH is very popular because it costs a fraction of what a commercial antenna does (just the parts at Home Depot or Lowes) yet gives about the same performance. cheers Last edited by stampeder; 01-17-2009 at 12:47 PM.

01-17-2009, 12:57 PM	#7
smdp1 digital DX'n is alive Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Greenhill, AL. Posts: 658	anyone tried a 4 bay GH?.....not that I could ever use one because of wind load here, but just a thought for the heck of it...... __________________ my antenna is bigger than yours...lol couldn't resist

01-16-2009, 03:12 PM	#3
willscary DIGITAL OTA is the KING! Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 70	Stampeder, Is there any chance you could add the 91XG to the top chart and the 43XG to the bottom chart? thanks, Bill

01-17-2009, 01:35 PM	#8
stampeder Canadian OTA Guy Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Delta, BC, Canada Posts: 43	I haven't heard of anyone trying a 4-bay GH, and I don't know if any of the computer modelers have looked into it. You could ask them by following the links in this: http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=81982

01-18-2009, 08:56 PM	#9
samstom My plasma is High Def. Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 7	Guys, Judging from the chart, does it mean that the new 4228HD has the same gain as the new 4221HD? Their gain seems to be pretty similar, are they? Has most of the UHF gain on the new 4228 been compromised cos I have a separate antenna for VHF and I need a good one for my UHF channels? Last edited by samstom; 01-18-2009 at 09:02 PM.

01-18-2009, 09:06 PM	#10
jim5506 Yellow Submarine Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lubbock, Texas Posts: 2,418	Judging by the chart, you can see that figures often do lie. We have apples, oranges, apricots and pears to compare here. __________________ Programming: Dish HD Absolute with 0.01 Cinemax Displays: Sony VPH-D50Q - 7 ft on the wall; Hitachi 57R59 Receivers: DishNetwork ViP722k; DishNetwork ViP211K; DishNetwork ViP211; DishNetwork 301; 2 - TiVo Series 2's; Accurian 6000; Samsung SIR-T351; Panasonic ShowStopper 2000; ATI HDTV Wonder Dish 1000 on 110,119,129; Dish 500 on 61.5; DPP44 Sony 80GB PS3; Toshiba HD-DVD

01-18-2009, 11:03 PM	#11
stampeder Canadian OTA Guy Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Delta, BC, Canada Posts: 43	I'm not sure what you're getting at, but you are free to interpret the charts how you see fit. They're net gain figures for similar antennas, with a corner reflector yagi for comparison. No big philosophical issues being discussed here, just the numbers on display. Its good to have this information for checking out which antennas to go with. Regardless, the factual, real world evidence is that the DBGH kicks butt.

01-19-2009, 08:33 AM	#13
willscary DIGITAL OTA is the KING! Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 70	The 4228 has more gain at that channel. The 4228 is a better antenna if all of your channels are between 24 and 51. If, however, you want to pick up channels 7-23, the 4228HD is a better candidate. The original 4228 was hailed as a UHF antenna with some gain on a few VHF high channels (9-12). The new 4228HD has been redesigned and gives better gain on all VHF high channels (7-13) and has also been tuned to give better performance on low UHF channels 14-23 at the expense of some gain on mid and upper UHF channels. CM has essentially flattened the gain curve to give fairly equal gain across the UHF spectrum, plus increased upper VHF gain across the spectrum. Also, the new 4228 HD is lighter in weight, it comes fully assembled and ready to mount, and it has a built in matching balun. None of these features are on the 4228 original. If you wnat better gain from channel 23 on up, look for an original. If you want an antenna with good gain and a flat gain curve, look at the 4228HD. If you really want the best, try making one of the GH designs stampeder talks about. You could spend $10 and a Saturday morning and perhaps end up with a much better antenna than either of the Channel Masters. I bought antennas, but that is me...I believe fully that Stampeder's antenna is better than my 4228HD and my 91XG, but mine are mounted 43' in the air and right now I have 1/4" of ice on them, 30" of snow on the ground, it is -5 degrees and the wind is blowing 15 mph. I am not sure a homemade design would hold up to my conditions without some kind of failure, either in the antenna or my tower and mast. Bill

01-19-2009, 12:45 PM	#15
stampeder Canadian OTA Guy Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Delta, BC, Canada Posts: 43	The original CM4228 is disappearing from stock everywhere. Keep phoning the 1-800 numbers you find on the web, but I don't know if you'll have much luck. Some used ones have been coming up on private sale at sites like Craigslist here and there. How about building an SBGH or DBGH?

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