Over-the-Air Reception Devices Rule

Necroscope

I am on the Board of Directors of a Condo complex. This is an issue we have been "addressing" for the last few months. The FCC guidelines/rules are actually fairly clear. Residents are able to install DBS dishes (up to one meter in diameter) or other OTAR (over-the-air reception) devices on or in property that is their EXCLUSIVE-USE area. This would include backyards, patios, balconies, etc. This would not (typically) include roofs, exterior walls, fences, etc. These areas are (depending on the Association's governing documents) usually common areas that the Association has control over, so therefor can regulate. I think it is wrong for others who are posting on this thread to suggest that residents of common interest developments have the right to erect/install dishes or other OTAR devices as they please. Obviously, if the Board approves the installation on common area, then it is okay. But if it is prohibited, then it is up to the resident to install the device in their Exclusive Use area. Even then, certain reasonable aesthetic guidelines can be required. So everyone, please don't get so "gung ho" about having the right to install their dishes wherever they want!!

Tower Guy

You are in a perfect position to provide a single dish for all residences. If you did so, the contention would vanish.

terryb4866

I am also on the "Board of Directors" of a home owners assocaition that is a CONDO association. The exterior of the units belong to the assocaition not the resident. Condo associations can restrict the installation of Satallite dishes and antennas. . We have allowed residents to install only satellite dishes with the boards approval. In our case the residents does not own anything outside of the unit. All exterior buildings and grounds are common area.

Don_M

Like you, I am an HOA director in a 240-unit association, and what you say is completely true in actual condominiums -- but only when the antenna is permanently secured (i.e., screwed or bolted) to an exterior surface like a roof or side of a building that is owned by the association.

However, it is not true of all attached residential dwelling units. My townhouse is legally an attached single-family dwelling; when my wife and I bought it, we also purchased the land lot upon which it is situated -- "fee-simple" ownership, for you lawyers out there. The declaration specifies that we also own the fenced patio, covered porch, all exterior walls and the roof. Unit owners, and not the association, are responsible for maintaining and repairing the unit exterior, including the roof.

In communities like ours, the HOA board does NOT have the power to restrict antenna placement in the same way your association does. Please see http://fjallfoss.fcc.gov/edocs_publi...CC-07-98A1.pdf, in which the five-member Federal Communications Commission denied the appeal of an Illinois townhouse association, filed after a member successfully challenged the HOA's prohibition against roof-mounted TV antennas to the FCC Media Bureau. The commissioners found for the unit owner because he owns the roof above his unit, even though the HOA is responsible for its maintenance. We're thus able to mount an antenna anywhere on outside of our unit we wish. (BTW, we don't -- our antenna system is inside our attic. This has more to do with difficulty in properly grounding the antenna than with condo aesthetics or rules.)

Ownership of an exterior feature is not the only test under in the OTARD rule. Here's a quote from the FCC Consumer Facts flyer on the subject: "Under the OTARD rules, an owner or a tenant (emphasis mine) has the right to install an antenna (the meets size limitations) on property that he owns or over which he has exclusive use or control... the rules apply to 'exclusive use' areas, like terraces, balconies or patios. 'Exclusive use' means an area of the property that only you and people you permit may enter and use." Antennas meeting size limitations include direct broadcast satellite dishes less than one meter (39.37 inches) in diameter and antennas "designed to receive local television broadcast signals." (See http://www.fcc.gov/cgb/consumerfacts/consumerdish.pdf)

Terryb, your association certainly can prohibit residents from bolting antennas to the building exterior or roof, but you may only regulate placement if someone finds a way to erect an outdoor antenna that meets all OTARD requirements. If your development has features such as individual balconies, you're on far less certain legal ground if, for example, someone wants to clamp an antenna mount to a balcony safety railing and mount an antenna outside his/her unit. You could still require prior approval for such installations as you do for dishes, though.

smdp1

hmm....this kinda junk is why I moved out of city apartments and rental places into a small house in the country.....lower monthly payment than my rent was and I can do what I ____ well please with it..... ...just a personal feeling of coarse, but renting is just throwing away money anyway...and HOA's are pains....so here I sit in the middle of nowhere with no HOA and no landlord to tell me what I can and can't do and 100+ acres of nothing around me.....(yes I had a couple of sour experiences that have affected my point of view) I realize that some have to rent because of other reasons, but if you rent don't gripe about the rules...you knew what they were when you moved in....don't like it move out....thats what I did....I never even fussed......they said no...I said bye...and never looked back.....best move I ever made....(well my last rental place didn't care what I did, but I didn't have a yard so I left).....hehe...we were shooting fireworks here at 10pm and no one even griped.....

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my antenna is bigger than yours...lol couldn't resist

static1701

We just bought a house last year, and we wanted a sub with an HOA. When we drove around looking for houses, we saw a lot of trashy and un-kept houses even in good areas. The sub we bought in is not over the top with rules. Our sub looks good. They don't hassel me about my antenna (The other half does). If work would not have been so far, we would have move out to the sticks.

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30 Feet off the ground

Gabrielle

I am really not trying to be obtuse, but just want to check the details of the OTARD rule as it applies to a development of single-family residences that is governed by an HOA. If I understand it correctly, I am able to install a dish or another small antenna that's less than 1 meter in diameter (like a Wineguard square shooter or a Lacrosse) without having to get approval from the HOA. But can they restrict the placement of a traditional aerial roof antenna (my husband just told me that they are called Yagi) that is larger than 1 meter if it's placed on a mast that is lower than 12 feet? Thanks for the help.

jim5506

The one meter restriction is for satellite dishes.

If you need a 20 ft antenna to receive over-the-air (OTA) broadcasts, then the HOA cannot restrict the size of a standard antenna.

They cannot impose any restrictions on the installation of your antenna that costs you more money.

If you live in an historic district its a different issue.

The overall idea is that TV reception is a public safety concern and your HOA cannot prevent you from being able to receive TV transmissions, no matter how ugly the antenna is.

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Gabrielle

Thank you for your reply. I do need clarification on one point, though. You indicated that the 1 meter restriction is only for satellite dishes, but point 2 of the FCC document seems to indicate that its for regular antennas as well or does point 3 mean regular Yagi antennas? In point 2 - what is a fixed wireless signal other than via satellite - wouldn't that be regular digital TV transmission? If that is the case what is the difference between the "antenna for fixed wireless signals other than satellite" (as mentioned in point 2) and "antenna that is designed to receive local television broadcast signals" (as mentioned in point 3)? Thanks for your help.

(2) An antenna that is one meter or less in diameter or diagonal measurement and is designed to receive video programming services via broadband radio service (wireless cable) or to receive or transmit fixed wireless signals other than via satellite.

(3) An antenna that is designed to receive local television broadcast signals. Masts higher than 12 feet above the roofline may be subject to local permitting requirements.

Don_M

Points 2 and 3 are apples and oranges. Point 2 has to do with antennas for "wireless cable" and Internet services, which are subject to the 1-meter limit. You can ignore this paragraph because a) it has nothing to do with the type of antenna you're contemplating and b) these subscription services aren't offered on any widespread basis these days. "Wireless cable" companies popped up in the 90s; most have long since folded.

No size limit is mentioned in point 3 for good reason. An antenna "designed to receive local television broadcast signals" means different things depending on distance to the transmitters. Here are two scenarios:

* "Community A" is within 10 miles of all TV broadcasters in its market area, and all signals arrive from pretty much the same direction. Because the OTA signals are strong, Community A can restrict antenna size to specified maximums and prohibit the use of rotators. At that distance, a small, fixed antenna will capture all local signals reliably. A "1-meter limit" -- or even restricting antennas to indoor/attic use only -- might be enforceable in this community.

* "HOA B" is located 40-60 miles from the transmitters, which send signals toward the HOA from many different directions. Owners of property in this community are very likely to need larger antennas, rotators and rooftop mounting to achieve the same reception reliability as people living in "Community A". "HOA B" has less ability to restrict antenna size, equipment and even placement because the signal environment is so much weaker. A 1-meter limit on antenna dimensions would likely be unenforceable in this community under OTARD.

For similar reasons, the rule is silent on antenna design -- Yagi, LPDA, bowtie, flying saucer, what have you. These decisions are left up to the homeowner and the association.

Sooner or later, you'll need to talk to someone in the HOA. Bring along a copy of the OTARD Rule, make it plain that you desire reception of local television broadcasts over the air, and let them know you're willing to install the smallest antenna necessary to get reliable reception. If they're a reasonable bunch of people, they may surprise you by being pleasant to work with!

Gabrielle

Don M. Thank you very much for explaining the differences between the two sections. I really appreciate your taking the time to do so.

Addyct

Quick Question.
This rule states that one cannot be restricted from "installing" an antenna. does that rule include holes that would need to be made in walls?
I plan on mounting an antenna on my back deck, which would qualify as a Exclusive Use Area, but i need to drill a hole through the wall to get it inside.

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jim5506

We need more information.

Is this a condo or apartment building?

Do you own a condo or lease/rent an apartment?

__________________
Programming: Dish HD Absolute with 0.01 Cinemax
Displays: Sony VPH-D50Q - 7 ft on the wall; Hitachi 57R59
Receivers: DishNetwork ViP722k; DishNetwork ViP211K; DishNetwork ViP211; DishNetwork 301; 2 - TiVo Series 2's; Accurian 6000; Samsung SIR-T351; Panasonic ShowStopper 2000; ATI HDTV Wonder
Dish 1000 on 110,119,129; Dish 500 on 61.5; DPP44
Sony 80GB PS3; Toshiba HD-DVD

Addyct

It's an Apartment building that I rent. I read through the lease, and there is a clause for Satellite dishes stating that i am not allowed to damage the building in any way when installing one, but it says nothing about antennas.

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Don_M

A dish is an antenna by another name. The intent of the lease clause is to prevent damage to the building, regardless of antenna type.

Since you have a deck, there's a simple and inexpensive solution that will keep you and the management happy: Make your own mount in a cement-filled bucket. Stick a mast into the center of the cement while it's still wet. You can use antenna mast, rigid PVC water pipe or any other material with an outside diameter of about 1 1/2 inches. Mount the antenna to the mast after the cement dries, probably in a day or so depending on temperature and humidity. Place the bucket on the deck for best antenna aim.

This method eliminates holes from the mount, but you'll still have a coax cable to route inside. A flat coax like this one can be connected to regular cables inside and outside; the maker claims it will fit through frames and sills of closed doors and windows. This way, there's no hole needed for the cable, either.