tigerbangs prescription for deep fringe reception

Rick0725

you may want to combine a 91xg uhf antenna to your setup, use your RS VU190XR for vhf, and amplified with a cm7777 preamp.

Rick0725

Also consider 2 antennas. The performance will be less of a compromise with less cost as the combos mentioned above.

suggest the 91xg ($80) combined with a winegard ya1713 or y10 7-13 ($40) as so

http://home.indy.rr.com/challengerul/antenna.html

uhf KLPA-DT 26.1 PBS ALEXANDRIA LA 57° 17.0 26
uhf KALB-DT 5.1 NBC ALEXANDRIA LA 145° 32.9 35
vhf KNOE-DT 7.1 CBS MONROE LA 36° 67.5 7
uhf KLAX-DT 31.1 ABC ALEXANDRIA LA 56° 16.9 32
uhf KAQY-DT 57.1 ABC COLUMBIA LA 36° 58.1 57
vhf KPLC-DT 7.1 NBC LAKE CHARLES LA 187° 73.0 8
uhf KLFY-DT 56.1 CBS LAFAYETTE LA 156° 82.9 56

wurban

I'm the US distributor of Televes antenna products. As an antenna contractor serving sports bars, fitness clubs, financial institutions, and rich folks, I've tested every antenna that I can get my hands on. The Blake from Sheffield, England had been my favorite until I tried the DAT 75. With the Blake, I could receive digital stations that I couldn't get with any other rig, but unfortunately it is a flimsy, lightweight unit, like many discussed in this forum. The Televes DAT 75 is a far more rugged unit, and it's easy to point precisely - both left to right as well as tilt. While it has similar gross gain figures to other antennas, it does a better job of actually receiving stations year after year than any other antenna in it's price range including the Blake. Many DXers won't need an antenna like the DAT 75, or want to make the investment, but it is a unit that should be considered when weather, large birds, durability, and high performance are factors in their selection. Televes products will be available through national retailers very soon. If you are a retailer or writer, please contact me.
Will Urban
http://antennavoodoo.com

randyskog

Hello All,

First, thanks to you for sharing your insight to us less educated.
If anyone has any questions re: concrete please send me a note.
We are moving to Tennessee, near Columbia, south of Nashville, zip code 38401.
The current owner uses Dish Network.
I was hoping to use an antenna to receive hd thru a tuner since we primarilly watch only network, Fox, and UPN most of the time. We have plenty of space, including a two story house to mount an antenna.
I checked on CEA.
We are 40-55 miles from the stations.
Seems like we are locked to channels up to 30. The signal is blue and purple and there is a close antenna angle to the broadcast.
Any thoughts on which antenna? and if we need an amp?

Thanks,
Randy


blue - vhf WNPT 8 PBS NASHVILLE TN 23° 42.3 8
blue - vhf WKRN 2 ABC NASHVILLE TN 23° 42.3 2
blue - uhf WZTV 17 FOX NASHVILLE TN 18° 47.8 17
blue - vhf WSMV 4 NBC NASHVILLE TN 18° 47.8 4
violet - vhf WTVF 5 CBS NASHVILLE TN 20° 57.5 5
violet - uhf WUXP 30 MNT NASHVILLE TN 19° 57.1 30

tigerbangs

A deep-fringe all-channel antenna should do the trick for you. Look at the Channel Master Crossfire 3671, or the Winegard HD-8200 or the Wade-Delhi VU-936SR with the optional VU8PZ powerzoom UHF attachment. For a preamplifier, try a Channel Master Titan 7777 or a Winegard AP8275. It doesn't look like you'll need a rotator, though...

http://www.channelmaster.com/
http://www.winegard.com/
http://www.wade-antenna.com/
http://www.pctinternational.com/chan...stallation.pdf

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Dolphan

Tigerbangs. Could you give us a little insight as to what we can expect a preamp to do for our antennas. Looking at antennaweb it looks like it gives you greater range by strengthening weaker signals. I have some stations that are just under 50 for signal strength. My receiver does not "lock" until steady over 50. Is this the type of problem a preamp would help?

Could you also tell us which splitters are needed for OTA. I have seen 5-1000 GHZ ones and also 40-2050 GHZ splitters.

Thanks this is a great forum!

tigerbangs

When used with a properly installed antenna system, a preamplifier can add 10-15 miles of useful range. Most antennas don't meet that criteria, however, being either inadequately grounded, mounted or aimed to optimize reception.

In digital reception, a low-noise preamplifier can have the same effect, but is often misused as a band-aid for an inadequate antenna installation.
Digital reception is far more dependent upon signal QUALITY than it is signal quantity. Digital tuners can function with almost infinitesimally small amounts of a high-quality signal, but, especially earlier digital tuners, can be flummoxed by multipath signals and electrical impulse noise which a preamplifier is powerless to fix. When you fix the multipath and the electrical impulse noise problems, digital reception invariably improves.

A cable TV splitter is usually rated to pass 5-1000Mhz: Digital satellite splitters are usually rated to pass 40-2150Mhz. Either is acceptable for OTA reception, but neither type of splitter should be used between the preamplifier or it's power supply, as they will often not pass the Direct Current that powers the preamplifier.

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jfowlerpa

I've been following Tigerbangs prescription exactly, one step at a time. I installed a CM7777 pre-amp yesterday and it had a great affect on channels and quality. Last weekend I suffered through Daytona on WOLF 56-1 at 35-40% signal with choppy video and audio. My location is just south of Bethlehem PA. I get the following channels by applying Tigerbangs prescription to the letter (Panasonic TH-42PX60U ATSC tuner):

Antenna pos 130-140 (Phila direction - 37.5 miles)
3-1 KYW-DT CBS 88%
6-1 WPVI-HD ABC 70%
6-2 WPVI-SD ABC local talk shows 74%
6-3 WPVI-WX 24-hour Weather 70%
10-1 WCAU-DT NBC 75%
10-2 WX-PLUS 24-hour Weather 74%
17-1 WPHL-D1 MyPHL 80%
17-2 WPHL-D2 TheTube Music videos pretty cool 78%
29-1 WXTFDT FOX 65%
35-1 WYBE-DT 80%
57-1 WPSG-DT The CW 50%

48-1 WGTW-D1 Religious programming 70%
48-2 WGTW-D2 Church TV 70%
48-3 WGTW-D3 JCTV religious music videos 70%
48-4 WGTW-D4 Spanish Religious TV 70%
48-5 WGTW-D5 E/I 70%
61-1 ION Paid Programming 82%
61-2 QUBO Kids programming 82%
61-3 IONLIFE 88%
61-4 WORSHIP Religion 80%

Antenna pos 285-295 (Scranton direction - 44 miles)
16-1 WNEP-DT ABC 82%
16-2 Anytime Local news/Weather 80%
22-1 WYOU-DT CBS 68%
28-1 WBRE-DT NBC 71%
44-1 WVIA-DT PBS 67%
44-2 WVIA-DT PBS 68%
44-3 WVIA-DT PBS 68%
44-4 WVIA-DT PBS 68%
56-1 WOLF-DT FOX 70%
56-2 PA's CW 70%
56-3 WQMY My network TV 70%

Antenna pos 240-245 (Allentown direction - 3.5 miles)
39-1 WLVT-DT PBS 65%
39-3 39KIDS PBS 65%
39-4 DLC PBS 60%
69-1 WFMZ-S1 Local 88%
69-2 WFMZ-S2 24-hour Weather 88%
69-3 WFMZ-HD No programming 88%

Antenna pos 85-90 (NYC direction - ?? miles)
52-1 WNJT-DT PBS 70%
52-3 NJN-3 PBS 70%
52-4 NJN-4 PBS 70%

It works and I'm loving high def for free.

tigerbangs

i am very glad to hear that...sounds as if you are well-positioned to pick up quite a bit of digital TV...congratulations!

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DeerHunter

Tigerbangs. A question with regards to earth curvature. With some research I found out that the earth curves about 8 inches per mile of distance. Is this correct?

If so, then would it be correct in assuming that with a specific height of a given point to another point would negate the curvature?

Example:

Broadcast tower: 4300ft above sea level
Receive Antenna: 720ft above sea level
Distance between: 73.8 miles.

At 8 inches per mile... 8*73.8=590.4inches/12inches=49.2ft

So, between the broadcast tower and the receive antenna there is 49.2ft of declination? Wouldn't the height of the broadcast tower or receive antenna in fact negate this curvature?

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Rick0725

you also need to take into account geography between the receiving antenna to tower in a trace from low elevation to high elevation. if there is a bump in between your results will be hampered...signal will be blocked.

at the fringe of reception the only alternative is to install as high as possible with the most powerful antenna and best preamp, cm7777. there are other variables besides curvature that come into play and can not be determined till you install.

in your case would try a 91 xg which can easily be tilted up to try to squeek more signal.

75 miles is at the fringe of signal in most cases and geography does not work in your favor there. you will not realize success till you give it a try.

tigerbangs

If you are talking about the Mt. Mansfield transmitters, then you are talking about some of the highest transmitters in North America. Practically speaking, the issue that you will face in Wallingford is not the sheer distance between the transmitters, but rather, the mountains that lie in between the transmitters and your location, as each mountain will refract or block the signals coming from the transmitters. I personally know that reception is possible in VT at substantial distances between Mt. Mansfield, as my folks had a house down near Stratton Mtn, and I used to be able to get channels 3 and 5 from the Burlington area without a problem. Our house was about 1500' ASL, about 2/3 up Snow Valley, and from that location I was able to pick up Boston , Manchester, NH, Burlington-Plattsburg and Mt. Washington and even Montreal VHF, at a distance of 170 miles!. Because of the location of the house on the hill, Albany wasn't possible, even though it was actually closer to us than was Burlington. UHF was never an issue in those days, as WFFF and channel 22 weren't on the air in those days. Theoretically, under flat conditions, the Mt. Masnfield stations should easily reach over 100 miles with a good signal, as people in Montreal will tell you, the Burlington stations come in in Montreal without much of a problem at a distance of almost 90 miles. So, to answer your question, yes, in theory, 4000'+ of transmitting height should make reception pretty easy at a distance of 75 miles, but the geographical features of the state are working against you. In the right location, good reception should be possible, but reception is almost impossible to predict because of the terrain.

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DeerHunter

Tigerbangs, thanks. Looks like I'll have a little experiment to conduct when spring rolls around.

Rick good to hear from you as well!

I can tell you this for sure....The next house I buy, OTA reception of DTV will play a major role in my decision!!!!

If you guys have any other information or tips that'll help me with my dilemma please let me know.

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Rick0725

give directv another shot in the spring when the snow is off the roof.

you already have the waivers, the installer was 4 hours late, snowing out, snow on roof, couple of stories up, and he would have done a half ass job under the conditions.

I would have said impossible too to save my ass from falling in poor conditions.

DeerHunter

Tiger,

Take a peek. This is what I'm up against. The only REAL problem between my locale & Mt. Mansfield, aside from the distance, is Bloodroot Mt.

I think I might have a chance, but once again I won't know til I try this spring.

My plan calls for a 91XG, CM7777 pre-amp, and getting as much height on the antenna as I possibly can.

Me, Mt. Mansfield.jpg

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