HTPC HDCP Hard Drive?

techtruth · 03-19-2005, 10:12 AM

Greetings to the FORUM...

I am hoping to get some guidance from the EEs among you on a subject I've been intently researching with no success....

Is it an illusion...or are members of the HTPC, HDTV, MCE 2005 forums unconcerned about how and when HTPCs are going to store HDCP encoded data on fixed-disks?

It seems pretty evident that HDCP content (read Hollywood films and top TV shows in HD) are the cornerstone of the "killer app" that will ultimately drive mass adoption of converged home networks. And it seems inaccurate to call a device a media-server where in order to watch HDCP content you have to load a disc in an optical drive? This is identical to the much-ridiculed "floppy shuffle" that characterized pre LAN file sharing.

So the question is, what HDCP compliant silicon must reside on the PC motherboard and elsewhere in order to move HDCP content from a SATA drive to either an integrated or HBA type DVI/HDMI connector? How are HDCP compliant STBs encoding and managing the drive channel?

It would appear that without an existing or upgrade path to an HDCP drive channel, any box that aspires to media-server status becomes a non-starter later this year.

Thanks for any insights or guidance you can offer...

Ga_Dutchman · 03-19-2005, 10:31 AM

As far as copy protected HD content the whole purpose of HDCP/HDMI is to prevent users from getting the data stream to a harddrive. As far as what exact silicon is involved to design a HDCP compliant interface, I don't know but some well worded google's should get you plenty. But it probably will be illegal for anyone to market a box or hardware of any type which would allow you to get copy protected HD onto your hard drive. That being said, given time and enough hardware/software hackers, anything is possible

RSawdey · 03-19-2005, 02:05 PM

The programmer community is pretty aware of the issues & what's being done about it... introducing the "Trusted PC". It's evolving with MS's DRM (digital rights management) copy protection & hardware protected interfaces where the 'clear' data is never brought out to any pins (not hardware hackable). The file stored from your protected interface will be encrypted in such a way that it will be useless to anyone else that doesn't have your unique decryption key. Expect to hear about 'Trusted' entertainment PCs in the Fall with HDMI out & Firewire/HDCP & CableCard tuners.

techtruth · 03-20-2005, 09:33 PM

O.K. and many thanks Mr. Wizard....

Does this then confirm the notion that any HTPC built or bought prior to the introduction of "Trusted PC" (i.e. front to back HDCP transport) interfaces will never house HDCP content on a hard drive, be it external or internal?

RSawdey · 03-21-2005, 07:08 AM

Can't be done... internal tuners are OTA only, Firewire ports aren't HDCP so won't pass protected content.

techtruth · 03-21-2005, 01:52 PM

Do you mean that we will never see Entertainment PC/Media Servers where protected HD content will be stored on a hard drive and shared among several devices in a home LAN? or that given existing products on the market, it can't be done?

If protected HD content will never reside on a hard drive, and HD use will be restricted to passing BluRay DVD's around, then the whole idea of the home entertainment LAN is absurd.

RSawdey · 03-21-2005, 03:57 PM

None of the stuff on the Server, or flying thru the air, will be in the clear. Everything is stored & broadcast encrypted. It's a 'trusted' device. Use of it's Firewire port for archiving will be restricted by content owners.

What can't be done NOW is manipulation or even display of any copy protected content on a PC, because they aren't considered 'trusted' with such valuable content, currently.

Once we see a 'Trusted PC' for entertainment, it's a whole new game... HDMI, Firewire/HDCP, CableCard... but you will also be restricted in several ways in how you use your content... sending a zillion copies of the latest PPV event to the 'net is NOT going to be possible... you COULD even be restricted to ONLY viewing it live...

techtruth · 03-21-2005, 04:17 PM

Thanks again Mr. Wizard....

You've confirmed what I believed to be true....that building a high-end HTPC...915 chipset...800Mhz FSB...DDR2...under the notion that it will someday serve as a media-server for secure HD content is a no-go....instead scale back to a SD distribution platform while preserving WM HD playback. Once trusted PC platforms appear with some form of multi-user license for HD content, that's when you spend money...

03-19-2005, 10:12 AM	#1
techtruth The Dawn of Man Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 4	HTPC HDCP Hard Drive? Greetings to the FORUM... I am hoping to get some guidance from the EEs among you on a subject I've been intently researching with no success.... Is it an illusion...or are members of the HTPC, HDTV, MCE 2005 forums unconcerned about how and when HTPCs are going to store HDCP encoded data on fixed-disks? It seems pretty evident that HDCP content (read Hollywood films and top TV shows in HD) are the cornerstone of the "killer app" that will ultimately drive mass adoption of converged home networks. And it seems inaccurate to call a device a media-server where in order to watch HDCP content you have to load a disc in an optical drive? This is identical to the much-ridiculed "floppy shuffle" that characterized pre LAN file sharing. So the question is, what HDCP compliant silicon must reside on the PC motherboard and elsewhere in order to move HDCP content from a SATA drive to either an integrated or HBA type DVI/HDMI connector? How are HDCP compliant STBs encoding and managing the drive channel? It would appear that without an existing or upgrade path to an HDCP drive channel, any box that aspires to media-server status becomes a non-starter later this year. Thanks for any insights or guidance you can offer...

03-20-2005, 09:33 PM	#4
techtruth The Dawn of Man Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 4	Thanks Mr. Wizard O.K. and many thanks Mr. Wizard.... Does this then confirm the notion that any HTPC built or bought prior to the introduction of "Trusted PC" (i.e. front to back HDCP transport) interfaces will never house HDCP content on a hard drive, be it external or internal?

03-21-2005, 01:52 PM	#6
techtruth The Dawn of Man Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 4	Can't be done? Do you mean that we will never see Entertainment PC/Media Servers where protected HD content will be stored on a hard drive and shared among several devices in a home LAN? or that given existing products on the market, it can't be done? If protected HD content will never reside on a hard drive, and HD use will be restricted to passing BluRay DVD's around, then the whole idea of the home entertainment LAN is absurd.

03-21-2005, 03:57 PM	#7
RSawdey Mr. Wizard Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ferndale, Michigan Age: 61 Posts: 5,981	None of the stuff on the Server, or flying thru the air, will be in the clear. Everything is stored & broadcast encrypted. It's a 'trusted' device. Use of it's Firewire port for archiving will be restricted by content owners. What can't be done NOW is manipulation or even display of any copy protected content on a PC, because they aren't considered 'trusted' with such valuable content, currently. Once we see a 'Trusted PC' for entertainment, it's a whole new game... HDMI, Firewire/HDCP, CableCard... but you will also be restricted in several ways in how you use your content... sending a zillion copies of the latest PPV event to the 'net is NOT going to be possible... you COULD even be restricted to ONLY viewing it live... Last edited by RSawdey; 03-21-2005 at 04:02 PM.

03-21-2005, 04:17 PM	#8
techtruth The Dawn of Man Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 4	All Clear Thanks again Mr. Wizard.... You've confirmed what I believed to be true....that building a high-end HTPC...915 chipset...800Mhz FSB...DDR2...under the notion that it will someday serve as a media-server for secure HD content is a no-go....instead scale back to a SD distribution platform while preserving WM HD playback. Once trusted PC platforms appear with some form of multi-user license for HD content, that's when you spend money...

03-19-2005, 10:31 AM	#2
Ga_Dutchman A couch and an HDTV to go please. Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 11	As far as copy protected HD content the whole purpose of HDCP/HDMI is to prevent users from getting the data stream to a harddrive. As far as what exact silicon is involved to design a HDCP compliant interface, I don't know but some well worded google's should get you plenty. But it probably will be illegal for anyone to market a box or hardware of any type which would allow you to get copy protected HD onto your hard drive. That being said, given time and enough hardware/software hackers, anything is possible

03-19-2005, 02:05 PM	#3
RSawdey Mr. Wizard Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ferndale, Michigan Age: 61 Posts: 5,981	The programmer community is pretty aware of the issues & what's being done about it... introducing the "Trusted PC". It's evolving with MS's DRM (digital rights management) copy protection & hardware protected interfaces where the 'clear' data is never brought out to any pins (not hardware hackable). The file stored from your protected interface will be encrypted in such a way that it will be useless to anyone else that doesn't have your unique decryption key. Expect to hear about 'Trusted' entertainment PCs in the Fall with HDMI out & Firewire/HDCP & CableCard tuners.

03-21-2005, 07:08 AM	#5
RSawdey Mr. Wizard Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ferndale, Michigan Age: 61 Posts: 5,981	Can't be done... internal tuners are OTA only, Firewire ports aren't HDCP so won't pass protected content.