Would You Upgrade to a New Receiver Right Now Just for PLIIz?

JMS · 08-30-2009, 08:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loves2Watch

I wouldn't necessarily call it high end either but not low end by any means. I would call it the starting point of better audio equipment.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Marlowe

EXACTLY -- of course it's not "high end" but it seems to get a great deal of criticism because of its "price point" in the market; as as said, I feel it's more of one of the company's mid-priced offerings, even though that usually equates to the $1K-plus models.

Home Theater magazine gives it thumbs up in their "ENTRY LEVEL" class.

http://www.hometheatermag.com/buyersguides/avreceivers/

Loves2Watch · 08-30-2009, 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMS

Home Theater magazine gives it thumbs up in their "ENTRY LEVEL" class.

http://www.hometheatermag.com/buyersguides/avreceivers/

And rightly so.

caliberconst. · 08-30-2009, 11:20 AM

Can someone tell me the difference between Onkyo's PLIIz, and yamahas presence speakers. Yamaha has been doing these presence speakers for while. I think what Yamaha's Presence speakers just matrix the front speakers to accomplish this, so is this what PLIIz does since there is no discs that actually have PLIIz. Also these height speakers seem like they would be nice for drama/comedy movies that dont use the surrounds verry much.

Loves2Watch · 08-30-2009, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caliberconst.

Can someone tell me the difference between Onkyo's PLIIz, and yamahas presence speakers. Yamaha has been doing these presence speakers for while. I think what Yamaha's Presence speakers just matrix the front speakers to accomplish this, so is this what PLIIz does since there is no discs that actually have PLIIz. Also these height speakers seem like they would be nice for drama/comedy movies that dont use the surrounds verry much.

Dolby Pro Logic IIz Benefits

* Introduces front height channels for more spacious surround sound - requires 2 extra front speakers
* Delivers a compelling and enveloping listening experience
* Adds depth and dimension for a lifelike soundstage
* Provides you with a wide range of choices for speaker positioning to optimize sound in almost any room
* Works with existing soundtracks by identifying and decoding spatial cues that occur naturally in a soundtrack

See here for further info - http://www.dolby.com/consumer/techno...logic-IIz.html

JMS · 08-30-2009, 02:33 PM

Here is what Yamaha says about their "Presence Speaker" feature:

Quote:

What are Presence speakers?

Presence speakers supplement the sound from the front speakers with extra ambient effects produced by CINEMA DSP. These effects include sounds that Filmmakers intend to locate a little farther back behind the screen in order to create more theater-like ambiance. Place these speakers at the front of the room about 0.5 - 1 m (1 -3 ft) outside the front speakers, facing slightly inwards, and about 1.8 m (6 ft) above the floor.

NOTE: The Presence speakers are also utilized if the receiver has the Dialog Lift feature that adjusts the height of the front and center channel sounds by assigning some of the front and center channel elements to the presence speakers. The larger the parameter, the higher the position of the front and center channel sound.

Yamaha's presence speakers feature seems to be just another of their sometimes brilliant DSP modes where generated ambience (similar to reverb) is fed to the height speakers with the goal being the simulation of a larger room -- such as a movie theater. Dolby PL IIz, on the other hand, extracts a signal from the available audio content to the overhead speakers in order to give a impression of overhead sound (such as rainfall).

The speaker placement recommendations differ somewhat:

Yamaha

Dolby

Dolby seems to have taken the height speaker concept right out of Yamaha's playbook and fit it to the existing Dolby Pro Logic matrix model.

http://www.electronichouse.com/artic...ound_presence/

caliberconst. · 08-30-2009, 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMS

Here is what Yamaha says about their "Presence Speaker" feature:

Yamaha's presence speakers feature seems to be just another of their sometimes brilliant DSP modes where generated ambience (similar to reverb) is fed to the height speakers with the goal being the simulation of a larger room -- such as a movie theater. Dolby PL IIz, on the other hand, extracts a signal from the available audio content to the overhead speakers in order to give a impression of overhead sound (such as rainfall).

The speaker placement recommendations differ somewhat:

Yamaha

Dolby

Dolby seems to have taken the height speaker concept right out of Yamaha's playbook and fit it to the existing Dolby Pro Logic matrix model.

http://www.electronichouse.com/artic...ound_presence/

Verry informative thank you verry much. I tried to get the presence speakers on my yammy to work when I first got it, but could not get them to work along with the 7.1. I have since droped the two back speakers, thinking maybe I'll try the presence speakers again.

Peter Marlowe · 08-30-2009, 09:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loves2Watch

The TX-NR5007 is rated at 145 watts per channel, and its power supply features a massive toroidal transformer and a pair of 22,000 microfarad storage capacitors to handle even the most dynamic source material. Both the TX-NR5007 and the 140-watt-per-channel TX-NR3007 feature separate power supply transformers for audio and video processing and reproduction. All three receivers, including the 135-watt-per-channel TX-NR1007, feature a push-pull amplification topology, with three-stage inverted Darlington circuitry and the company's highly regarded WRAT (Wide Range Amplifier Technology) for highly dynamic and linear response throughout the audible spectrum.

See full press release here - http://www.gspr.com/onkyo/x007.html

Was this a quote/clip from the press release?

Wow -- those power specs seem pretty aggressive; do Onkyo's more "top tier" receivers like these put out pretty close to what they're claiming -- and are 135-145 watts per channel enough to pressurize just about any sized room (save for a theater-sized setting)?

Peter Marlowe · 08-30-2009, 09:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JMS

Home Theater magazine gives it thumbs up in their "ENTRY LEVEL" class.

http://www.hometheatermag.com/buyersguides/avreceivers/

And I still don't subscribe to the fact that the models are ENTRY LEVEL -- at all.

JohninTenn · 08-30-2009, 09:52 PM

If they are up to date with HDMI 1.3's Where are the new 1.4's?

Peter Marlowe · 08-30-2009, 09:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohninTenn

If they are up to date with HDMI 1.3's Where are the new 1.4's?

Are you referring to these new Onkyos being discussed?

Loves2Watch · 08-30-2009, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Marlowe

Was this a quote/clip from the press release?

Wow -- those power specs seem pretty aggressive; do Onkyo's more "top tier" receivers like these put out pretty close to what they're claiming -- and are 135-145 watts per channel enough to pressurize just about any sized room (save for a theater-sized setting)?

Yes, from the linked press release. Did you not read it?

Yes they are rated more closely to their actual all channels driven power rating. Remember, these models are just a side step from their costlier brothers in the Integra line (which continually get rave reviews). And it certainly would create enough sound level to fill all but an auditorium.

Peter Marlowe · 08-30-2009, 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loves2Watch

Yes, from the linked press release. Did you not read it?

No, I didn't. I just read what you typed.

Quote:

Yes they are rated more closely to their actual all channels driven power rating. Remember, these models are just a side step from their costlier brothers in the Integra line (which continually get rave reviews). And it certainly would create enough sound level to fill all but an auditorium.

Of course these could canabalize sales from their premium Integra brand as TSX and TL sales have been eating up Accord sales for awhile (Acura and Honda I'm talking about); nice to know that they can hold their own with the power specs though. Perhaps I'll consider these for the next upgrade when we move...

Would it make sense at this price point to consider separates instead of a beefy receiver like one of these Onkyos?

JMS · 08-31-2009, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caliberconst.

I tried to get the presence speakers on my yammy to work when I first got it, but could not get them to work along with the 7.1. I have since droped the two back speakers, thinking maybe I'll try the presence speakers again.

On most Yamaha receivers, the presence speakers and the rear surrounds share the same amps. The fronts and backs cannot play at the same time. The receiver's processing decides which will be used at any given time depending on the source material.

This is not the case with the new Onkyos, which makes them true 9.1 receivers (provided you don't use the Zone 2 feature).

Loves2Watch · 08-31-2009, 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Marlowe

Would it make sense at this price point to consider separates instead of a beefy receiver like one of these Onkyos?

That is debatable. There are two camps, one which believes receivers do just as good a job and the other which believes separates are superior. These days, I agree with the former and receivers like these are the reason why.

Remember, although Integra receivers can be purchased and installed by anyone, they are marketed towards custom installers and with that being the case you won't find them at discounted prices.

Peter Marlowe · 08-31-2009, 09:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loves2Watch

That is debatable. There are two camps, one which believes receivers do just as good a job and the other which believes separates are superior. These days, I agree with the former and receivers like these are the reason why.

Well, I was aware of the entire beat-to-a-pulp boxing match that was the "separates vs. receivers" main event and have unfortunately been involved in many of those countless "beat down" threads that didn't seem to lead anywhere; as you clarified in your second sentence in the above paragraph, I was looking to get people's personal views on whether these Onkyos are worth considering over separates at that point in the ballgame.

Quote:

Remember, although Integra receivers can be purchased and installed by anyone, they are marketed towards custom installers and with that being the case you won't find them at discounted prices.

Indeed; they pretty much cornered the entire custom install market in the affordable category -- interestingly enough, most of their small offerings of gear (relatively) are near chassis clones of the Onkyo equipment -- the CD/DVD changer, their receivers, etc.

08-30-2009, 11:20 AM	#33
caliberconst. waylin rules Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 229	Can someone tell me the difference between Onkyo's PLIIz, and yamahas presence speakers. Yamaha has been doing these presence speakers for while. I think what Yamaha's Presence speakers just matrix the front speakers to accomplish this, so is this what PLIIz does since there is no discs that actually have PLIIz. Also these height speakers seem like they would be nice for drama/comedy movies that dont use the surrounds verry much. __________________ Panasonic 50x1 Toshiba Hd-A2 PS3 Denon 557 Comcast dchx3400 hd dvr Yamaha RX-V1400 7.1 Center Polk cs1 Fronts Polk R-300 Surrounds Polk R-150 10" ENERGY esw-10

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08-30-2009, 09:52 PM	#39
JohninTenn High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 595	If they are up to date with HDMI 1.3's Where are the new 1.4's?