What's The Lowest Price a BD Player Will See This Year?

dsskid · 09-09-2008, 10:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HD Goofnut

I agree with you there. My PC is about 4-5 years old, but a few years ago I added extra RAM and a suped up video card. After I did that it does everything I need it to and I just don't see a need to purchase a new desktop. It is the same with BD, which was why I was waiting for an affordable 2.0+ player that I knew would be upgradable, which is exactly why I went with the PS3 for $299 with the Wal-Mart giftcard sale in June. I was going to spend a $100 easy at Wal-Mart anyway so it just made logical sense.

Smart choice.

09-09-2008, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dsskid

This is very similar to buying a computer. Technology advances so quickly, it is practically outdated by the time you walk out the door. But you buy it because it fits your needs at the time. If you constantly waited for the latest and greatest, you'd never make a purchase.

BD players that you buy today will play BDs, which is what you purchased it for. If you are looking off to the distant future for 3D, that's fine too, you will just have to wait, or if you want to enjoy BD in the meantime, come Holiday season, buy a discounted Funai BD to tide you over until that time.

Actually that's pretty much what i did. I got a BD drive for my pc to tide me over, until there is a BD standalone that meets my expectations. (This might be the Oppo btw, depends if it can be made region free without hassle and if they don't fall off the wagon with pricing).

While waiting for the BD player of my dreams

to be released, i have bought some 80 BD's i can enjoy to the fullest with my temp solution. The rather small investment i needed to make to get into the game has given me several times its cost in ROI with the great entertainment i got.

PFC5 · 09-09-2008, 10:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikopol

Imo if the prices don't fall soon, Blu-ray will keep growing the way it has done so far. Dropping prices would accelerate the growth imo.

If the BDA adds another profile, then those interested in having real 3D would have to buy new players, if the current players cannot be updated.

I disagree. If the studios do not lower prices, I think the (rate of) growth will slow down in time as the number of people who WILL pay the much higher prices run out like when a well has a finite number of gallons of water/oil.

Each price point has a finite number of people in that pricing group, so it cannot go on forever with the same rate of growth because that group will become saturated. Even IF the price drops they would eventually reach a saturation point that basically includes everyone and SD DVD is a perfect example of this.

Now if the create a new Profile for 3D (as "speculated"), there will be a lot of unhappy campers IMO, but clearly many will just buy new players that were already the early adopters. I will likely wait a year until I decide what they do with this before I buy any more BD players myself.

dsskid · 09-09-2008, 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikopol

Actually that's pretty much what i did. I got a BD drive for my pc to tide me over, until there is a BD standalone that meets my expectations. (This might be the Oppo btw, depends if it can be made region free without hassle and if they don't fall off the wagon with pricing).

While waiting for the BD player of my dreams

to be released, i have bought some 80 BD's i can enjoy to the fullest with my temp solution. The rather small investment i needed to make to get into the game has given me several times its cost in ROI with the great entertainment i got.

So you have your PC hooked up to your HD display? Makes perfect sense, but my wife would've given me a hard time about it. She didn't want the computer in the living room.

ack_bak · 09-09-2008, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PFC5

Now if the create a new Profile for 3D (as "speculated"), there will be a lot of unhappy campers IMO, but clearly many will just buy new players that were already the early adopters. I will likely wait a year until I decide what they do with this before I buy any more BD players myself.

I really do not see why people should be unhappy. 3D support would be an entirely new feature. Since 1997 I have purchased:
- My first DVD player the year they came out (paid more than my HD-A2 and PS3 combined, and this is not factoring for inflation!)
- DVD player that supported DTS and had an optical out
- DVD player that supported progressive scan
- DVD player that had Clear Play
- Upconverting DVD player that supported DIVX

That is five separate purchases over a nine year period and each player offered new features which the old player could not be upgraded to via a firmware update. I was not upset. I wanted the features so I bought a new player. I expect Blu-Ray to be similar.

09-09-2008, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PFC5

I disagree. If the studios do not lower prices, I think the (rate of) growth will slow down in time as the number of people who WILL pay the much higher prices run out like when a well has a finite number of gallons of water/oil.

Each price point has a finite number of people in that pricing group, so it cannot go on forever with the same rate of growth because that group will become saturated. Even IF the price drops they would eventually reach a saturation point that basically includes everyone and SD DVD is a perfect example of this.

Now if the create a new Profile for 3D (as "speculated"), there will be a lot of unhappy campers IMO, but clearly many will just buy new players that were already the early adopters. I will likely wait a year until I decide what they do with this before I buy any more BD players myself.

I responded to a post, that asked about the effects of prices not dropping "soon". Imo at the most, "soon" is one, maybe two years.

See, i think after the end of the format war, we'll see the growth rates increasing for a few years, even at the current software MSRP price points. I don't think we are even close to the point, where the current MSRP prices face a saturated market. Once the studios know from their experience with dvd, that the limit has been reached, they'll drop the prices (or the retailers do).

Imo it would be better for BD, if software prices would fall sooner. However, i think there is a viable market even for the higher priced software and i fail to see any immediate urgency here.

PFC5 · 09-09-2008, 11:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ack_bak

I really do not see why people should be unhappy. 3D support would be an entirely new feature. Since 1997 I have purchased:
- My first DVD player the year they came out (paid more than my HD-A2 and PS3 combined, and this is not factoring for inflation!)
- DVD player that supported DTS and had an optical out
- DVD player that supported progressive scan
- DVD player that had Clear Play
- Upconverting DVD player that supported DIVX

That is five separate purchases over a nine year period and each player offered new features which the old player could not be upgraded to via a firmware update. I was not upset. I wanted the features so I bought a new player. I expect Blu-Ray to be similar.

That puts you in the second "class" of buyer called an early adopter though like I said. I sure do think many will be upset about it, but as you stated things do evolve, and did for SD DVD also.

I actually think 3D would be a big leap for BD to do and they should do it sooner rather than later as this could be a big selling point IMO.

Chris Gerhard · 09-09-2008, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kamspy

Bmore is after me?

*runs*

And me? Where can we hide?

Chris

Bravestime · 09-09-2008, 11:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ack_bak

I really do not see why people should be unhappy. 3D support would be an entirely new feature. Since 1997 I have purchased:
- My first DVD player the year they came out (paid more than my HD-A2 and PS3 combined, and this is not factoring for inflation!)
- DVD player that supported DTS and had an optical out
- DVD player that supported progressive scan
- DVD player that had Clear Play
- Upconverting DVD player that supported DIVX

That is five separate purchases over a nine year period and each player offered new features which the old player could not be upgraded to via a firmware update. I was not upset. I wanted the features so I bought a new player. I expect Blu-Ray to be similar.

I completely agree here. All elctronics transition to be better state. This alot of times requires another and separate purchase, as you mentioned. The consumer has been conditioned by this. Every few years seems like something better comes out and what you have becomes obsolete, nothing new. This does not, however, mean that your current device no longer works. I don't see people becoming mad over a new addition to Blu-ray.

hatt · 09-09-2008, 02:35 PM

Looks like I'm safe from bmore's witch hunt.

As for adding profiles and features, go for it. As long as your current player will play the future "profile whatever" discs the way your player was intended to play it, so what. "Whaaaaaaaa, I bought this player 3 years ago and now it doesn't do this new super fancy stuff the new players do. BD sucks!"

ack_bak · 09-09-2008, 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hatt

L "Whaaaaaaaa, I bought this player 3 years ago and now it doesn't do this new super fancy stuff the new players do. BD sucks!"

And did they feel the same way about DVD? When they were "forced" to upgrade to a player that could decode DTS? What about a progressive scan player? What about a player that could properly play DVD+R/RW and DVD-/RW discs? What about a player that would upscale? What about a player that could handle DIVX?

What happens if the DVD forum integrates downloads? Are they going to be up in arms and demand a firmware update and call all existing players "obsolete" or are they going to praise DVD as a great evolving format? What about SRT? Can I add a firmware update to my existing DVD players to get that feature? What about XDE? How dare Toshiba push a new technology that makes all other DVD players "obsolete"...

I have one word for you.. Hypocrite..

kamspy · 09-09-2008, 02:55 PM

It seems the only thing the BDA is being guilty of is explaining upgrade path. Keeping their mouths shut about it like Toshiba did back then would have saved them a lot of bad press.

Had DVD launched with multiple 'profiles', the same arguments would have been made.

Profile 1.0- No optical, no dts, no progressive scan, iffy dual layer support

Profile 1.1- 480p output, dts, dual layer is non-issue.

Profile 1.2- Player supports writable DVD media, which uncannily always beared the DVD logo!

Profile 1.3- Component output upscaling.

Profile 1.4- HDMI and DivX

Profile 2.0- XDE

Profile 2.1- ?????

Oh man. VCD is good enough.

Bravestime · 09-09-2008, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kamspy

It seems the only thing the BDA is being guilty of is explaining upgrade path. Keeping their mouths shut about it like Toshiba did back then would have saved them a lot of bad press.

Had DVD launched with multiple 'profiles', the same arguments would have been made.

Profile 1.0- No optical, no dts, no progressive scan, iffy dual layer support

Profile 1.1- 480p output, dts, dual layer is non-issue.

Profile 1.2- Player supports writable DVD media, which uncannily always beared the DVD logo!

Profile 1.3- Component output upscaling.

Profile 1.4- HDMI and DivX

Profile 2.0- XDE

Profile 2.1- ?????

Oh man. VCD is good enough.

I believe your right. Seems like BD was only letting the public know the future plans for blu-ray players, and it turns out to be a fiasco. They should have kept their mouth shut, like you said.

hatt · 09-09-2008, 03:11 PM

I can't believe some people. I hear great opposition to this rumored(or not?) profile 3.0 audio stuff. Let me see, my PS3 would likely easily be updated(and if it isn't I'm out what exactly?) to such a thing and then I would have the OPTION to listen to HiRez music discs. And I'm mad about it.

kamspy · 09-09-2008, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hatt

I can't believe some people. I hear great opposition to this rumored(or not?) profile 3.0 audio stuff. Let me see, my PS3 would likely easily be updated(and if it isn't I'm out what exactly?) to such a thing and then I would have the OPTION to listen to HiRez music discs. And I'm mad about it.

Hell yeah. I'm flaming pissed my Toshiba DVD player I bought in 97 won't do dts 6.1 discrete at 1.5mbps, chokes on most dual layers, is limited to 480i and won't play any writable DVD media!

Why didn't they just announce it before they launched the thing!

It's not like I EVER PLANNED ON BUYING ANOTHER ONE. Lord knows I only had one CD Player, on VHS Player and one Cassette Player. Why on Earth should I expect to need more than one BD Player?

View Poll Results: How Low Will A BD Player Go This Holiday?
$99 One Day/Weekend Sale for Funai's.	3	6.25%
$99 One Day/Weekend Sale on 1.0 Players	4	8.33%
$149 One Day/Weekend Sale for Funai's	18	37.50%
$149 One Day/Weekend Sale for 1.0 Players	8	16.67%
No Player Will Go Below $199 At Any Point in the Year (not counting refurbs)	8	16.67%
Free With a HDTV Purchase at One B&M Store	0	0%
Free With a HDTV Purchase at Many B&M Stores	3	6.25%
Free With a HDTV Purchase at Nearly Every BD Retailer	0	0%
Free With a HDTV Purchase at most B&M and IDs	2	4.17%
All Player Will Skyrocket to Above $1k Due to Insane Demand	2	4.17%
Voters: 48. You may not vote on this poll

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09-09-2008, 02:35 PM	#175
hatt HD Elitist Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: FL Age: 37 Posts: 6,294	Looks like I'm safe from bmore's witch hunt. As for adding profiles and features, go for it. As long as your current player will play the future "profile whatever" discs the way your player was intended to play it, so what. "Whaaaaaaaa, I bought this player 3 years ago and now it doesn't do this new super fancy stuff the new players do. BD sucks!"

09-09-2008, 02:55 PM	#177
kamspy Brewers lol Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 21,943	It seems the only thing the BDA is being guilty of is explaining upgrade path. Keeping their mouths shut about it like Toshiba did back then would have saved them a lot of bad press. Had DVD launched with multiple 'profiles', the same arguments would have been made. Profile 1.0- No optical, no dts, no progressive scan, iffy dual layer support Profile 1.1- 480p output, dts, dual layer is non-issue. Profile 1.2- Player supports writable DVD media, which uncannily always beared the DVD logo! Profile 1.3- Component output upscaling. Profile 1.4- HDMI and DivX Profile 2.0- XDE Profile 2.1- ????? Oh man. VCD is good enough.

09-09-2008, 03:11 PM	#179
hatt HD Elitist Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: FL Age: 37 Posts: 6,294	I can't believe some people. I hear great opposition to this rumored(or not?) profile 3.0 audio stuff. Let me see, my PS3 would likely easily be updated(and if it isn't I'm out what exactly?) to such a thing and then I would have the OPTION to listen to HiRez music discs. And I'm mad about it.