Toshiba's XDE DVD players won't hurt Blu-ray Disc

Super XP · 08-30-2008, 05:09 PM

BD players need to drop in price well bellow $200 or people will not buy into the format. J6P is the target audience which will make or break BD.

scsa · 08-30-2008, 08:48 PM

yeah because a lot of people aren't buying BD players now yeah they are still buying them at 299 and 350 there are a lot of people buying blu-ray players now.

Super XP · 08-31-2008, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scsa

yeah because a lot of people aren't buying BD players now yeah they are still buying them at 299 and 350 there are a lot of people buying blu-ray players now.

Yes many people are buying Blu-Ray now, I am talking about J6P which are not buying Blu-Ray now. People now that are buying Blu-Ray are in the 100,000's where as J6P are in the 100's of Millions.

I am just saying if they can drop prices bellow $200 the BD format will floorish. Right now BD is relying on the PS3 for movie sales. IMO.

hatt · 08-31-2008, 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bravestime

Thing to remember about BD movie prices is that having a BD player doesn't lock you in to buy ONLY BD movies.

You didn't see the "DVD player with BD capability"

If anyone has listened to the Rush Limbaugh show you have heard Rush say "for those of you in Rio Linda" <then a simplified explanation of the comment> We need this for HDF. When bringing up a BD player you have to say "for those at HDF, a DVD player with BD capability."

ack_bak · 08-31-2008, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super XP

Yes many people are buying Blu-Ray now, I am talking about J6P which are not buying Blu-Ray now. People now that are buying Blu-Ray are in the 100,000's where as J6P are in the 100's of Millions.

I am just saying if they can drop prices bellow $200 the BD format will floorish. Right now BD is relying on the PS3 for movie sales. IMO.

And they will drop BD below $200 at some point. We are getting closer and closer. But it is not a race to the bottom. Blu-Ray will follow the same pricing cycle that the majority of technologies follow. It is quite simple really.

MikeRox · 08-31-2008, 02:17 PM

Didn't Warner Bros say BDs biggest problem atm was that PS3 owners WEREN'T pulling their weight with regards to movie purchases XP? If PS3 movie sales were as WB wanted, BD would probably be about 15% marketshare now.

Deja Vu · 09-01-2008, 08:01 AM

The price of the movies is what is holding BD back - the studios are greedy and want to milk BD for all it's worth. I bought into BD when catalogue titles were regularly on sale - two for one! I haven't seen this locally since the format war ended and I haven't bought any BDs since, although I have bought a ton of HD DVDs for about $9.00 each including taxes and shipping.

The XDE isn't going to hurt BD. Now an SRT player for $150.00, that lived up to the hype, might have. Anyone hoping Toshiba might pull a rabbit out of a hat needs a reality check. There were more opportunities with HD DVD to do something innovative and bold and it didn't happen. The XDE is just a small band aide to help stop the DVD bleeding. DVD needs a transfusion - being an SRT player for a low price. I don't think Toshiba has the balls or even the technical expertise to pull this off.

Chris Gerhard · 09-01-2008, 08:21 AM

The hype regarding XDE having an impact on Blu-ray should officially die with the objective reviews just not starting to come in. It isn't an Oppo Digital DVD player killer, much less Blu-ray killer, based on what I am reading now. It is a good budget DVD player and one that some market segment might prefer to other methods of DVD playback, nothing more, nothing less.

Chris

Super XP · 09-01-2008, 11:38 AM

XDE is a great up-converter with great features that will sharpen the PQ. They seem to do a better job than most up-converters that cost a lot more. Reviews by individuals that have the XDE are positive.

What does XDE have to do with Blu-Ray and what does Blu-Ray have to do with XDE? Absolutely NOTHING!!!!!
Who caused this HYPE? Blu-Ray FanBoyz.

ack_bak · 09-01-2008, 03:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super XP

XDE is a great up-converter with great features that will sharpen the PQ. They seem to do a better job than most up-converters that cost a lot more. Reviews by individuals that have the XDE are positive.

What does XDE have to do with Blu-Ray and what does Blu-Ray have to do with XDE? Absolutely NOTHING!!!!!
Who caused this HYPE? Blu-Ray FanBoyz.

No. The hype was caused by all this talk of SRT based Toshiba players. You yourself made several posts stating that the XDE had a cell processor in it. While the XDE does appear to be a good upscaling player, it clearly is not close to HDM. Everybody seems to agree on that. Should we keep discussing XDE? Probably not. It is not HDM, and I don't really see XDE taking away sales of too many BD players. It is not exactly cheap @$149. Especially when you can get good upscaling players for half the price.

**PFC5** · 09-01-2008, 03:10 PM

What "good" upscalers can you get for half the price?

ack_bak · 09-01-2008, 03:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PFC5

What "good" upscalers can you get for half the price?

I have recommended going the HD DVD player route via Ebay to several folks looking for good upscaling players. Used A2's and A3's are going for $40-50 and new one's in the $60-70 range. A30's and A35 can be found for great deals as well.

Philips makes a decent upscaler for about $60-70 (the DVP5982) and Sony and Panasonic have good upscalers in the $70-90 range as well. Are they as good as an Oppo or XDE? Probably not. But if somebody is not that picky about PQ anyway why pay twice as much for something that they may not notice a difference from? If somebody is picky about PQ, I would recommend they go Blu-Ray anyway.

hatt · 09-01-2008, 03:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PFC5

What "good" upscalers can you get for half the price?

Are you saying the $75 upscalers are no good? This certainly goes against the grain of what many commonly promote around here. Aren't you one of the many proclaiming a $400 BD player is dreadfully expensive? And now, what do you have to spend to get a good upscaler? What about when new and current BD players are commonly $300(this month)? I would certainly think a BD player with upscaler included is worth a pretty good premium over a DVD player.

**PFC5** · 09-01-2008, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ack_bak

I have recommended going the HD DVD player route via Ebay to several folks looking for good upscaling players. Used A2's and A3's are going for $40-50 and new one's in the $60-70 range. A30's and A35 can be found for great deals as well.

Philips makes a decent upscaler for about $60-70 (the DVP5982) and Sony and Panasonic have good upscalers in the $70-90 range as well. Are they as good as an Oppo or XDE? Probably not. But if somebody is not that picky about PQ anyway why pay twice as much for something that they may not notice a difference from? If somebody is picky about PQ, I would recommend they go Blu-Ray anyway.

I have been searching on eBay for well over a month and cannot find such deals on HD DVD players you have found. By the time the auction ends and you pay S/H, you are looking at $90.00+ on most of the used HD DVD players beginning with the A20/A30. I have not checked out the A2 since both my large HDTVs accept 24Fps so I want that capability at this point.

The prices jump pretty high in the last 5-10 minutes of the auctions and some decent ones listed I have put in my watch and they are averaging at least $70.00+ BEFORE shipping for A20s. Some of the players are broken and those are the ones that usually sell for cheap but who wants a broken one? I already have a couple of those.

I think there are various stages of buyers, and those who want it cheap would not look at the XDE because of price, but they won't look at Oppo and especially not at a BD player either at current prices. There are some who are winning to spend a little more and those people have made Oppo and a few other mfg a lot of money I imagine.

My opinion is that there are a few price points that run something like this:

1. Cheapest they can get and PQ doesn't matter much if at all. They just want to play the movie. (must be under $50.00 price)

2. Those who realize that the PQ of players are quite varying in PQ, and they are willing to pay more for the better quality but not too much more. (must be under $100.00 price)

3. Those that want very good PQ but price is still a concern. (must be under $200.00 price) This category will quickly be taken over by BD players as they reach this price point IMO.

4. Those with a large SD DVD collection and must have the best PQ available but price is still a concern so they get a high quality SD DVD player that also plays SACD/DVD-Audio. (must be under $300.00 price)

5. Those who want excellent movie playback and sound. This was the Oppo 983H market that must be diminishing because of BD player prices dropping. (must be under $350-400.00 price) This is the current meat of the BD players being bought now.

6. Those who want the best and money doesn't matter. They want it all and will pay Pioneer or Denon BD player prices to get it. Many of these types also have separate VPs already. (I wish I could be one of these people.

)

I believe as the price drops, the larger the market is for such a player, and each above market diminishes by a multiple factor as you move into each level above the prior level.

Super XP · 09-01-2008, 04:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ack_bak

No. The hype was caused by all this talk of SRT based Toshiba players. You yourself made several posts stating that the XDE had a cell processor in it. While the XDE does appear to be a good upscaling player, it clearly is not close to HDM. Everybody seems to agree on that. Should we keep discussing XDE? Probably not. It is not HDM, and I don't really see XDE taking away sales of too many BD players. It is not exactly cheap @$149. Especially when you can get good upscaling players for half the price.

I already presented an e-mail I got from the Inquirer which stated that the XDE was based on the CELL. Is this true? I don't know this is what I got via e-mail. So no I was not saying this the Inquirer was.

I did a Print Screen of the e-mail so nobody would think I was BS'ing.

08-30-2008, 05:09 PM	#16
Super XP Star Trek: The Movie! Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Toronto, ON. Canada Posts: 5,776	BD players need to drop in price well bellow $200 or people will not buy into the format. J6P is the target audience which will make or break BD. __________________ Toshiba Regza 46" HDTV (46RF350U) LCD 1080p/24p Toshiba HD-A35 / HD-A3 / XD-E500 LG GGC-H20L Super Multi / PC Drive Onkyo TX-SR605 7.1 TrueHD/DTS HD MA Precision Acoustics™ 8Ch. Hi Def Loudspeaker Series DVD's = 200 = 130 = 10

08-30-2008, 08:48 PM	#17
scsa High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,107	yeah because a lot of people aren't buying BD players now yeah they are still buying them at 299 and 350 there are a lot of people buying blu-ray players now. __________________ BLU-RAY Movies (27) Donnie Darko, Twister, Me Myself and Irene, Austin Powers 1, Austin Powers 2, Austin Powers 3, Friday the 13th, Halloween 1980, Halloween (2007), Smallville season 7, Freddy Vs Jason,Iron man, Transformers, Sarah Connor Chronicles. Independence Day, and Tropic Thunder,Die Hard, Die Harder, Die Hard with a Vengeance, Die hard 4,The Dark Knight, the matrix, The Matrix 2, The matrix 3, Spiderman, Spiderman 2, Spiderman 3. [/b][/color] [/color][/b]

08-31-2008, 02:17 PM	#21
MikeRox Blu Blu Skies! :D Join Date: May 2007 Location: Huddersfield, United Kingdom Posts: 12,417	Didn't Warner Bros say BDs biggest problem atm was that PS3 owners WEREN'T pulling their weight with regards to movie purchases XP? If PS3 movie sales were as WB wanted, BD would probably be about 15% marketshare now. __________________ REGION B 4TW! Latest HD additions - I Love You Man - 17 Again - Born on the 4th of July - Paul Blart: Mall Cop - Monsters, Inc. HD Movies - Um... Lost count >_< bout 250 Latest Gaming Additions - Mirrors Edge - Scene It BOS - Wartech: Senko No Ronde - Lego Indiana Jones/Kung Fu Panda 2 pack - Silent Hill

09-01-2008, 11:38 AM	#24
Super XP Star Trek: The Movie! Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Toronto, ON. Canada Posts: 5,776	XDE is a great up-converter with great features that will sharpen the PQ. They seem to do a better job than most up-converters that cost a lot more. Reviews by individuals that have the XDE are positive. What does XDE have to do with Blu-Ray and what does Blu-Ray have to do with XDE? Absolutely NOTHING!!!!! Who caused this HYPE? Blu-Ray FanBoyz. __________________ Toshiba Regza 46" HDTV (46RF350U) LCD 1080p/24p Toshiba HD-A35 / HD-A3 / XD-E500 LG GGC-H20L Super Multi / PC Drive Onkyo TX-SR605 7.1 TrueHD/DTS HD MA Precision Acoustics™ 8Ch. Hi Def Loudspeaker Series DVD's = 200 = 130 = 10

09-01-2008, 03:10 PM	#26
PFC5 Super Moderator Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 28,420	What "good" upscalers can you get for half the price? __________________ Denon AVR-887 Klipsch RP-5 Pwred Towers (mains) (525 watts peak each 12"Subs) All Klipsch RC-25(ctr),(2)SS1(surr),(2)SS1(rearSurr) Toshiba (2)HD-A20,PS3,BD35 For SACD/DVD-A Samsung HD-841 Panny 50pz80u plasma SETTINGS RCA HD50LPW162 50"DLP w/HD2+ SA 3250HD 47" LCD+Yamaha5790+HD-A1(bedroom) Harmony 680 + (2) 670s (amazing remote/support) Game room with Onkyo receiver & B&W Speakers The_Cable_Game Take the high ground and be happier

09-01-2008, 08:01 AM	#22
Deja Vu We Are Right (WAR) ! Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Great White North Posts: 612	The price of the movies is what is holding BD back - the studios are greedy and want to milk BD for all it's worth. I bought into BD when catalogue titles were regularly on sale - two for one! I haven't seen this locally since the format war ended and I haven't bought any BDs since, although I have bought a ton of HD DVDs for about $9.00 each including taxes and shipping. The XDE isn't going to hurt BD. Now an SRT player for $150.00, that lived up to the hype, might have. Anyone hoping Toshiba might pull a rabbit out of a hat needs a reality check. There were more opportunities with HD DVD to do something innovative and bold and it didn't happen. The XDE is just a small band aide to help stop the DVD bleeding. DVD needs a transfusion - being an SRT player for a low price. I don't think Toshiba has the balls or even the technical expertise to pull this off.

09-01-2008, 08:21 AM	#23
Chris Gerhard High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 8,211	The hype regarding XDE having an impact on Blu-ray should officially die with the objective reviews just not starting to come in. It isn't an Oppo Digital DVD player killer, much less Blu-ray killer, based on what I am reading now. It is a good budget DVD player and one that some market segment might prefer to other methods of DVD playback, nothing more, nothing less. Chris

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