Blu Ray craps on customers

Alpha1 · 01-16-2008, 11:05 AM

How long before we see Profile 2.1, 3.0, 3.5 and onwards. I wouldn't be surprised at all.

This market shouldn't be subjected to what happens in the Computer industry IMO - it simply doesn't need it.

Oliver

Super XP · 01-16-2008, 11:10 AM

Great FACTUAL Article. We need a lot more of these to make sure they get hammered into people’s heads before they decide on a Hi Def format purchase.

Super XP · 01-16-2008, 11:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bravestime

I agree future customers of blu-ray should be educated to the different profile players.

On the other side, DO you not feel also important to educate the HD-DVD customers that buying a HD-DVD player at this time is a higher risk than blu-ray and as of May majority of the studios will be supporting blu-ray?

Might be a good idea for both sides to be educated.

No, HD DVD is not at high risk. People rather buy a $130 HD DVD player vs. a $500 BD player. Price is king and with price comes the studios.

Dr. Jones · 01-16-2008, 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super XP

No, HD DVD is not at high risk. People rather buy a $130 HD DVD player vs. a $500 BD player. Price is king and with price comes the studios.

I have to agree that HD DVD is not a high risk at $130.00, you can't even get a good upconverter for that price in most cases. It's a no brainer. With the movie deal the player is $30.00 (if you consider the 5 movies coming in at $20.00 a piece).

phearcat · 01-16-2008, 11:20 AM

I have checked out many BR players in retail places and its damn near impossible to see what profile the player is, its no where on the box.

I think the only safe choice in buying BR at this time is the PS3. There is a panny model comming out w/ 2.0 but its not on the market quite yet.

Bravestime · 01-16-2008, 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Jones

I have to agree that HD DVD is not a high risk at $130.00, you can't even get a good upconverter for that price in most cases. It's a no brainer. With the movie deal the player is $30.00 (if you consider the 5 movies coming in at $20.00 a piece).

People buying a HD-DVD aren't buying a upconverter, they're buying a HD player!

unotis · 01-16-2008, 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Changeling

...that early adopters of THAT had to rebuy because their first players couldn't use disc features like seamless branching, for instance.

The very first HD-DVD players weren't "ready" either. This sort of thing is the price an early adopter pays. It's not new.

Yes they were, they had all the necessary profiles already and just needed some early firmware updates to iron out some early software glitches.

There is a huge difference between having everything in place and just needing some software updates and not having finished the final specs, rushing the unfinished product onto the market and because of this rush to market not including the necessary hardware inside the players to never being able to take advantage of future features announced by the BDA.

If you don't care about the future features or not is your personal choice not everyones.

Do you see the difference?

Nikopol · 01-16-2008, 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Super XP

No, HD DVD is not at high risk. People rather buy a $130 HD DVD player vs. a $500 BD player. Price is king and with price comes the studios.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr. Jones

I have to agree that HD DVD is not a high risk at $130.00, you can't even get a good upconverter for that price in most cases. It's a no brainer. With the movie deal the player is $30.00 (if you consider the 5 movies coming in at $20.00 a piece).

depends on how you define "high risk" imo....

if the most important reason to buy a HighDef player is to be able to buy HiDef movies in the future, i would say it is a pretty high risk a buyer of a HD DVD player will have a rather limited selection of HiDef software, come may 2008.

KEEBS1984 · 01-16-2008, 11:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Changeling

...that early adopters of THAT had to rebuy because their first players couldn't use disc features like seamless branching, for instance.

The very first HD-DVD players weren't "ready" either. This sort of thing is the price an early adopter pays. It's not new.

Are you serious?

Is this guy serious?

The Toshiba A1 player will continue to be able to play ALL HD DVD movies with ALL of the features for as long as that machine lives. 1.0 Blu-ray players can't, won't, will never be able to do that. . .

Why can't get that?

crazyal · 01-16-2008, 11:59 AM

I thought the only 1.1 BD players were the PS3, the Panny 30, and the LG DF 200, are there any others? I think this will just get worse for the BDA. Not so much because of the problem but because bad news gets a life of it's own. Some how we have moved from information in news to what sells the best or gets the most attention.

"Blu-Ray craps on customers" will get a lot more attention than "New features may not be useable on older gen Blu-Ray players." Using a quote from someone who should be saying how great the format is another way to get viewers. But it doesn't make the article any less factual.

Face it the Blu-Ray format was developed for the PS3. The hardware may have come from burners in Japan but clearly the SA players are out of their element. Sure as new more powerful players come out the problem will become a thing of the past but the bad taste in peoples mouths for an upgrade that most don't think is needed (SD DVD to HDM) will not. The B&Ms will not talk about it but it will come up between friends, co-workers, forums, and any other place people go to find information.

Super XP · 01-16-2008, 12:05 PM

I think people forget the FACT "ALL" HD DVD players in the world (New & Old) have the necessary hardware, just only requiring a simple firmware update to further unleash the power of new innovative features that the HD DVD group may want to enable.

Blu-Ray players are missing key hardware components and there for no firmware update can fix that.

Both HD DVD & BD are completely different. Why on earth would people defend Blu-Ray for their stupidity to just screw the customer in the end? Where the heck is the logic in that?

Sure the article seems to favour HD DVD over Blu-Ray, but at least he speaks the Truth presenting Factual information. Not like all the Blu-Ray related BS articles about Bu-Ray being superior, Paramount going Blu etc nonsense which is completely based on baseless speculation & rumours conjured up by the BDA to try & seize HD DVD’s massive momentum etc.

tomes · 01-16-2008, 12:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by unotis

I'd say more because there really is only one 1.1 player available right now (Panasonic BD30K) and they have been really pushing the out going 1.0 players lately.

I would estimate that probably 95% of Blu-Ray players are 1.0, unless you are including PS3s then maybe 80%, if they've all received the firmware updates that is (which I doubt they all have).

?????????????????????????????????????????????????? ??

Millions of PS3's have been sold, and all of them are firmware upgradeable to 1.1 (2.0 coming in a few days)

That means that probably 80%+ of all Blu-Ray playback hardware is capable of utilizing 1.1 titles to the fullest.

Agreed that it is not ideal that maybe 500K players are unable to take full advantage of the 1.1 benefits, but again, looking ahead, that will be a very small percentage once HDM reaches into the sales of millions of SALs.

Still, ALL players can play the main feature of a 1.1 disc. Also, many people are not interested in the extra features. (Myself being one of them, and I'm a huge movie-fan, w/more than 700 movies in my collection). I think HDDVD fans are overblowing this issue (and I think Blu-Ray fans are downplaying it too much).

HDDVD is the more mature format as of now.

gameguru1360 · 01-16-2008, 12:15 PM

some people just don't care about the other features, they only care about the quality of the main movie. Some coworkers of mine could care less of web enabled widgets like for Transformers. All they care about is if the movie plays and doesn't freeze and has superior quality.

But I have read about this before. For Profile 1.0 and 1.1, even with the latest firmware won't upgrade them to 2.0. For profile 2.0 and bd live, they'll have to shell out another $400+ for another blu-ray player.

Super XP · 01-16-2008, 12:25 PM

HD DVD is not over blowing the Blu-Ray problem.
Before you release a format to the public it should have complete specifications so that they won't run into problems later on.
It makes more sense why the DVD Forum rejected Sony’s Blu-Ray technology and went with Toshiba’s HD DVD.

To have a format that cannot take full advantage of a movie in all aspects is completely ridiculous. People are going to pay for a feature rich Blu-Ray disc but will not be able to harness those features which in turn are a waste of their money.

Price is king period. I now also don’t thing Warner will go Blu on June 1, 2008. I now don’t see that happening let alone FOX sticking around with Blu.

The BDA took a chance in asking Warner to announce exclusiveness at the time they did. BDA was hoping for a negative chain reaction for HD DVD and all they did is fuel the HD DVD format even further into its already accelerating momentum.

Changeling · 01-16-2008, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gameguru1360

some people just don't care about the other features, they only care about the quality of the main movie. Some coworkers of mine could care less of web enabled widgets like for Transformers. All they care about is if the movie plays and doesn't freeze and has superior quality.

Agreed there. I don't know too many people that want to "play" with a movie in the way that all these added profiles will allow. They want to watch the movie. Period.

01-16-2008, 11:10 AM	#32
Super XP Star Trek: The Movie! Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Toronto, ON. Canada Posts: 5,776	Great FACTUAL Article. We need a lot more of these to make sure they get hammered into people’s heads before they decide on a Hi Def format purchase. __________________ Toshiba Regza 46" HDTV (46RF350U) LCD 1080p/24p Toshiba HD-A35 / HD-A3 / XD-E500 LG GGC-H20L Super Multi / PC Drive Onkyo TX-SR605 7.1 TrueHD/DTS HD MA Precision Acoustics™ 8Ch. Hi Def Loudspeaker Series DVD's = 200 = 130 = 10

01-16-2008, 11:20 AM	#35
phearcat Me So HD Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: The OC Age: 39 Posts: 698	I have checked out many BR players in retail places and its damn near impossible to see what profile the player is, its no where on the box. I think the only safe choice in buying BR at this time is the PS3. There is a panny model comming out w/ 2.0 but its not on the market quite yet. __________________ 50" Pioneer Plamsa pdp-5070hd HDTV XBox 360 Elite (HDMI) w/HD-DVD XBL: Phear Cat Nintendo Wii HD DVD: 41

01-16-2008, 11:59 AM	#40
crazyal Smarter than the ave bear Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 3,312	I thought the only 1.1 BD players were the PS3, the Panny 30, and the LG DF 200, are there any others? I think this will just get worse for the BDA. Not so much because of the problem but because bad news gets a life of it's own. Some how we have moved from information in news to what sells the best or gets the most attention. "Blu-Ray craps on customers" will get a lot more attention than "New features may not be useable on older gen Blu-Ray players." Using a quote from someone who should be saying how great the format is another way to get viewers. But it doesn't make the article any less factual. Face it the Blu-Ray format was developed for the PS3. The hardware may have come from burners in Japan but clearly the SA players are out of their element. Sure as new more powerful players come out the problem will become a thing of the past but the bad taste in peoples mouths for an upgrade that most don't think is needed (SD DVD to HDM) will not. The B&Ms will not talk about it but it will come up between friends, co-workers, forums, and any other place people go to find information. __________________ Please don't feed the Unicorns

01-16-2008, 12:05 PM	#41
Super XP Star Trek: The Movie! Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Toronto, ON. Canada Posts: 5,776	I think people forget the FACT "ALL" HD DVD players in the world (New & Old) have the necessary hardware, just only requiring a simple firmware update to further unleash the power of new innovative features that the HD DVD group may want to enable. Blu-Ray players are missing key hardware components and there for no firmware update can fix that. Both HD DVD & BD are completely different. Why on earth would people defend Blu-Ray for their stupidity to just screw the customer in the end? Where the heck is the logic in that? Sure the article seems to favour HD DVD over Blu-Ray, but at least he speaks the Truth presenting Factual information. Not like all the Blu-Ray related BS articles about Bu-Ray being superior, Paramount going Blu etc nonsense which is completely based on baseless speculation & rumours conjured up by the BDA to try & seize HD DVD’s massive momentum etc. __________________ Toshiba Regza 46" HDTV (46RF350U) LCD 1080p/24p Toshiba HD-A35 / HD-A3 / XD-E500 LG GGC-H20L Super Multi / PC Drive Onkyo TX-SR605 7.1 TrueHD/DTS HD MA Precision Acoustics™ 8Ch. Hi Def Loudspeaker Series DVD's = 200 = 130 = 10

01-16-2008, 12:15 PM	#43
gameguru1360 High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 625	some people just don't care about the other features, they only care about the quality of the main movie. Some coworkers of mine could care less of web enabled widgets like for Transformers. All they care about is if the movie plays and doesn't freeze and has superior quality. But I have read about this before. For Profile 1.0 and 1.1, even with the latest firmware won't upgrade them to 2.0. For profile 2.0 and bd live, they'll have to shell out another $400+ for another blu-ray player. __________________ "What I really need is a woman who loves me for my money but doesn't understand math."

01-16-2008, 11:05 AM	#31
Alpha1 High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 284	How long before we see Profile 2.1, 3.0, 3.5 and onwards. I wouldn't be surprised at all. This market shouldn't be subjected to what happens in the Computer industry IMO - it simply doesn't need it. Oliver

01-16-2008, 12:25 PM	#44
Super XP Star Trek: The Movie! Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Toronto, ON. Canada Posts: 5,776	HD DVD is not over blowing the Blu-Ray problem. Before you release a format to the public it should have complete specifications so that they won't run into problems later on. It makes more sense why the DVD Forum rejected Sony’s Blu-Ray technology and went with Toshiba’s HD DVD. To have a format that cannot take full advantage of a movie in all aspects is completely ridiculous. People are going to pay for a feature rich Blu-Ray disc but will not be able to harness those features which in turn are a waste of their money. Price is king period. I now also don’t thing Warner will go Blu on June 1, 2008. I now don’t see that happening let alone FOX sticking around with Blu. The BDA took a chance in asking Warner to announce exclusiveness at the time they did. BDA was hoping for a negative chain reaction for HD DVD and all they did is fuel the HD DVD format even further into its already accelerating momentum. __________________ Toshiba Regza 46" HDTV (46RF350U) LCD 1080p/24p Toshiba HD-A35 / HD-A3 / XD-E500 LG GGC-H20L Super Multi / PC Drive Onkyo TX-SR605 7.1 TrueHD/DTS HD MA Precision Acoustics™ 8Ch. Hi Def Loudspeaker Series DVD's = 200 = 130 = 10

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