HD DVD players

EJ08 · 05-18-2006, 09:44 AM

What will a decent HD DVD player run you? I'm new to this stuff so I'm hoping a forum like this can help me. Is a Denon 1920 considered a HD DVD player? It has a HDMI connection and I've read some good reviews on this DVD player....thoughts? Thanks

BobY · 05-18-2006, 10:23 AM

No, there are currently only two HD DVD players on the market, both from Toshiba: the low end HD-A1 (selling around $500) and high end HD-AX1 (selling around $800).

These are the first true HD players and use HD media. Upscaling DVD players are not HD, they only simulate HD by interpolating lower resolution sources to HD.

EJ08 · 05-18-2006, 10:37 AM

Thanks Boby.....

What's your opinion of those upconversion type DVD players like Denon for example. I'm a big Denon guy. Thanks.

BobY · 05-18-2006, 10:59 AM

I like Denon, too.

But I wouldn't pay more money for a player just to get upconversion, as any HD display you're going to need to display the upscaled player output will also upscale conventional DVD producing the same results. Depending on the DSP algorithms, a particular model player might do a better job than a particular model display, but that's entirely determined by the given player and the given display...

**PFC5** · 05-18-2006, 12:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobY

No, there are currently only two HD DVD players on the market, both from Toshiba: the low end HD-A1 (selling around $500) and high end HD-AX1 (selling around $800).

These are the first true HD players and use HD media. Upscaling DVD players are not HD, they only simulate HD by interpolating lower resolution sources to HD.

Actually, RCA/Thompson is coming out with a HD-DVD player next week @ Walmart & Circuit City for $500.00 too. Some have stated that it is a rebadged Toshiba HD-A1, but it has some additional specs not on the HD-A1 which makes me believe it is not a exact duplicate of the HD-A1 and might have a couple of extra things in it. It also has a different remote, that MUST be better than the Toshiba remote given what I have read. Here is a link to the RCA spec sheet:

http://www.rcaaudiovideo.com/NR/rdon...000_Prelim.pdf

This spec sheet says that it will have a RS-232 port on it which only the more expensive XA1 Toshiba model has. Of course it does say "preliminary" in the PDF name.

throwback559 · 05-19-2006, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PFC5

Actually, RCA/Thompson is coming out with a HD-DVD player next week @ Walmart & Circuit City for $500.00 too. Some have stated that it is a rebadged Toshiba HD-A1, but it has some additional specs not on the HD-A1 which makes me believe it is not a exact duplicate of the HD-A1 and might have a couple of extra things in it. It also has a different remote, that MUST be better than the Toshiba remote given what I have read. Here is a link to the RCA spec sheet:

http://www.rcaaudiovideo.com/NR/rdon...000_Prelim.pdf

This spec sheet says that it will have a RS-232 port on it which only the more expensive XA1 Toshiba model has. Of course it does say "preliminary" in the PDF name.

which is better the RCA or Toshiba I can get 10% off at Wal Mart

borromini · 05-19-2006, 06:01 AM

They're identical except for the brand name.

Cornbread · 05-19-2006, 08:13 AM

The Denon 3910 I believe is an absolutely awesome upscaling DVD player but it cost $3000. If you are rich, that is an option, but if not you would be better off getting an HD-DVD player at this point because it will also upscale our old legacy DVDs.

BobY · 05-19-2006, 09:27 AM

I suspect both the HD-A1 and the HD-AX1 use the same main board and the only real differences between the two are certain components aren't populated on the HD-A1 main board (trivially reducing the feature set and cost) *and* Toshiba is probably eating more margin on the HD-A1 (or selling it at a loss).

RCA could have their own flavor by populating some of the features (like the RS-232 port) that were left off of the HD-A1. Or it could just be innacurate preliminary info. If Toshiba really wants to convince people that someone else is making HD DVD players, they should have put a little more effort into the RCA--the front panel layout and display are identical. Clearly it's the same guts with the front panel marginally re-styled by RCA (rectangular buttons instead of round). It's probably built in the Toshiba factory on the same production line as the HD-A1/HD-AX-1.

**PFC5** · 05-19-2006, 10:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cornbread

The Denon 3910 I believe is an absolutely awesome upscaling DVD player but it cost $3000. If you are rich, that is an option, but if not you would be better off getting an HD-DVD player at this point because it will also upscale our old legacy DVDs.

I think you are thinking about the 5910 aren't you? I thought the 3910 cost about $2200.00 & the 5910 cost about $3700.00.

**PFC5** · 05-19-2006, 10:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BobY

I suspect both the HD-A1 and the HD-AX1 use the same main board and the only real differences between the two are certain components aren't populated on the HD-A1 main board (trivially reducing the feature set and cost) *and* Toshiba is probably eating more margin on the HD-A1 (or selling it at a loss).

RCA could have their own flavor by populating some of the features (like the RS-232 port) that were left off of the HD-A1. Or it could just be innacurate preliminary info. If Toshiba really wants to convince people that someone else is making HD DVD players, they should have put a little more effort into the RCA--the front panel layout and display are identical. Clearly it's the same guts with the front panel marginally re-styled by RCA (rectangular buttons instead of round). It's probably built in the Toshiba factory on the same production line as the HD-A1/HD-AX-1.

Your right! I never thought that they could have the same MB woth the connections there for all features and just populate the ones for that model.

It might have different firmware too, since it says BTB on HDMI in the specs for the RCA but it could be an error too!

BobY · 05-20-2006, 12:18 AM

I'm sure they will have different firmware if for no other reason than to fix any bugs found by Toshiba's unpaid beta testers..err..initial customers

.

It's too bad the info from RCA on a product that will be in stores next week is sketchy and not up-to-date

. This is an interesting marketing strategy. Toshiba is allowing a "competitor" to sell an HD-A1 with additional features for $100 less than theirs. Perhaps the HD-A1 was just to get something out there quickly at a lower price and Toshiba will discontniue it soon after the RCA product hits so they can concentrate on the higher margin HD-AX1. RCA can afford to operate at lower margin since they probably didn't spend a cent to develop, design or manufacture "their" player and have no costs to amortize.

I'm thinking at this point Toshiba isn't so much targeting customers for HD DVD, but rather aiming to convince the studios that HD DVD is out there in the market, from multiple manufacturers and they're selling all they can make. If the studios who are married to Blu-Ray come to the conclusion that HD DVD is an already established format that is gaining momentum, they may dump support for Blu-Ray, or more likely throw support behind HD DVD as well--after all, those are just "Hollywood marriages" of convenience. If the studios think they are missing an opportunity to make money they won't think twice about "cheating" on Sony...

borromini · 05-20-2006, 07:47 AM

The studios aren't even close to thinking that HD-DVD is establishing itself as the defacto standard...it's just too damn early. Your suggestion may gain some credence if say Sony announced that BD players will be delayed 'til the 2007 holiday season. It would have to be that kind of a huge disaster for HD-DVD to get the break needed.

Otherwise if Sony stays on track with the current release date, it will be a couple of years before the studios make a move because you may have by then a clear direction on sales/purchasing patterns regarding high-def DVD players and titles. You also need that time for an increase in the % of HDTV owners in this market.

**PFC5** · 05-20-2006, 01:41 PM

Stores are selling the RCA at the same $500.00 price as the HD-A1, not $100.00 lower.

They do not have costs to "amortize" but they do have licensing fees to pay to Toshiba for every unit made I imagine. It is a case of "6 of one, half dozen of another" I think here. Now Toshiba could be thinking; "we already paid the R&D price, so we can lower the licensing to recover that R&D over a longer period to help promote the format", but that is pure speculation.

I really like the "Hollywood marriages of convenience" & "they won't think twice about "cheating" on Sony" remarks. Doesn't that describe follywood to a tee? Even down to their commitments to REAL marriages.

borromini · 05-20-2006, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PFC5

...I really like the "Hollywood marriages of convenience" & "they won't think twice about "cheating" on Sony" remarks. Doesn't that describe follywood to a tee? Even down to their commitments to REAL marriages.

You mean reel marriages.

05-18-2006, 09:44 AM	#1
EJ08 High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 30	HD DVD players What will a decent HD DVD player run you? I'm new to this stuff so I'm hoping a forum like this can help me. Is a Denon 1920 considered a HD DVD player? It has a HDMI connection and I've read some good reviews on this DVD player....thoughts? Thanks

05-19-2006, 06:01 AM	#7
borromini HT Frontiersman Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Northern California Posts: 9,811	They're identical except for the brand name. __________________ "I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"

05-20-2006, 12:18 AM	#12
BobY What's all this, then?... Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,197	I'm sure they will have different firmware if for no other reason than to fix any bugs found by Toshiba's unpaid beta testers..err..initial customers. It's too bad the info from RCA on a product that will be in stores next week is sketchy and not up-to-date. This is an interesting marketing strategy. Toshiba is allowing a "competitor" to sell an HD-A1 with additional features for $100 less than theirs. Perhaps the HD-A1 was just to get something out there quickly at a lower price and Toshiba will discontniue it soon after the RCA product hits so they can concentrate on the higher margin HD-AX1. RCA can afford to operate at lower margin since they probably didn't spend a cent to develop, design or manufacture "their" player and have no costs to amortize. I'm thinking at this point Toshiba isn't so much targeting customers for HD DVD, but rather aiming to convince the studios that HD DVD is out there in the market, from multiple manufacturers and they're selling all they can make. If the studios who are married to Blu-Ray come to the conclusion that HD DVD is an already established format that is gaining momentum, they may dump support for Blu-Ray, or more likely throw support behind HD DVD as well--after all, those are just "Hollywood marriages" of convenience. If the studios think they are missing an opportunity to make money they won't think twice about "cheating" on Sony...

05-20-2006, 07:47 AM	#13
borromini HT Frontiersman Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Northern California Posts: 9,811	The studios aren't even close to thinking that HD-DVD is establishing itself as the defacto standard...it's just too damn early. Your suggestion may gain some credence if say Sony announced that BD players will be delayed 'til the 2007 holiday season. It would have to be that kind of a huge disaster for HD-DVD to get the break needed. Otherwise if Sony stays on track with the current release date, it will be a couple of years before the studios make a move because you may have by then a clear direction on sales/purchasing patterns regarding high-def DVD players and titles. You also need that time for an increase in the % of HDTV owners in this market. __________________ "I'd rather have a bottle in front of me than a frontal lobotomy"

05-20-2006, 01:41 PM	#14
PFC5 Super Moderator Join Date: May 2005 Posts: 28,057	Stores are selling the RCA at the same $500.00 price as the HD-A1, not $100.00 lower. They do not have costs to "amortize" but they do have licensing fees to pay to Toshiba for every unit made I imagine. It is a case of "6 of one, half dozen of another" I think here. Now Toshiba could be thinking; "we already paid the R&D price, so we can lower the licensing to recover that R&D over a longer period to help promote the format", but that is pure speculation. I really like the "Hollywood marriages of convenience" & "they won't think twice about "cheating" on Sony" remarks. Doesn't that describe follywood to a tee? Even down to their commitments to REAL marriages. __________________ Denon AVR-887 Klipsch RP-5 Pwred Towers (mains) (525 watts peak each 12"Subs) All Klipsch RC-25(ctr),(2)SS1(surr),(2)SS1(rearSurr) Toshiba (2)HD-A20,PS3,BD35 For SACD/DVD-A Samsung HD-841 Panny 50pz80u plasma SETTINGS RCA HD50LPW162 50"DLP w/HD2+ SA 3250HD 47" LCD+Yamaha5790+HD-A1(bedroom) Harmony 680 + (2) 670s (amazing remote/support) Game room with Onkyo receiver & B&W Speakers The_Cable_Game Take the high ground and be happier

05-18-2006, 10:23 AM	#2
BobY What's all this, then?... Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,197	No, there are currently only two HD DVD players on the market, both from Toshiba: the low end HD-A1 (selling around $500) and high end HD-AX1 (selling around $800). These are the first true HD players and use HD media. Upscaling DVD players are not HD, they only simulate HD by interpolating lower resolution sources to HD.

05-18-2006, 10:37 AM	#3
EJ08 High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 30	Thanks Boby..... What's your opinion of those upconversion type DVD players like Denon for example. I'm a big Denon guy. Thanks.

05-18-2006, 10:59 AM	#4
BobY What's all this, then?... Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,197	I like Denon, too. But I wouldn't pay more money for a player just to get upconversion, as any HD display you're going to need to display the upscaled player output will also upscale conventional DVD producing the same results. Depending on the DSP algorithms, a particular model player might do a better job than a particular model display, but that's entirely determined by the given player and the given display...

05-19-2006, 08:13 AM	#8
Cornbread High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Oct 2005 Posts: 265	The Denon 3910 I believe is an absolutely awesome upscaling DVD player but it cost $3000. If you are rich, that is an option, but if not you would be better off getting an HD-DVD player at this point because it will also upscale our old legacy DVDs.

05-19-2006, 09:27 AM	#9
BobY What's all this, then?... Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 6,197	I suspect both the HD-A1 and the HD-AX1 use the same main board and the only real differences between the two are certain components aren't populated on the HD-A1 main board (trivially reducing the feature set and cost) and Toshiba is probably eating more margin on the HD-A1 (or selling it at a loss). RCA could have their own flavor by populating some of the features (like the RS-232 port) that were left off of the HD-A1. Or it could just be innacurate preliminary info. If Toshiba really wants to convince people that someone else is making HD DVD players, they should have put a little more effort into the RCA--the front panel layout and display are identical. Clearly it's the same guts with the front panel marginally re-styled by RCA (rectangular buttons instead of round). It's probably built in the Toshiba factory on the same production line as the HD-A1/HD-AX-1.