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Does anyone care about 4KBD?

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Old 10-16-2014, 05:55 PM   #1
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Default Does anyone care about 4KBD?

I've been absent from this forum for, well many years. I remember how we were all pretty jazzed about not only Blu-ray, but HD DVD as well. I created the Tier Threads at the AVS Forum, which are still going strong (once AVS stole them from me and gave me the boot). So many of us speculated all day about what the world would be like when our favorite films debuted in sparkling 1080p.

I am pretty excited about 4K, (or UHD as it is often marketed), but I feel like the only one. Even Blu-ray's champion Bill Hunt is pretty ho-hum about it.

I realize there isn't much to report or discuss just yet, but there isn't even much discussion anywhere about it.

Just wanted to see where you guys' heads are at. Are you excited? Like, at all? Or has Blu-ray scratched that itch and you just don't care to rebuy everything?
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Old 10-16-2014, 09:37 PM   #2
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I'll be excited when it becomes reality. The reason I'm not excited now is that I don't see any sign of support for the studios. But if/when that happens, then yeah, I'll be on board for 4K.
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Old 10-17-2014, 08:58 AM   #3
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The only drawback to 4K systems is that to be appreciated, it requires Large panel 70" plus) and close-up viewing (4-5") to effective see the difference.
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Old 10-17-2014, 11:08 AM   #4
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The only drawback to 4K systems is that to be appreciated, it requires Large panel 70" plus) and close-up viewing (4-5") to effective see the difference.
That's true and that's why I don't see the studios being at all enthusiastic about it. They are looking towards digital and the 4K market will be competing with Blu-ray, which is a relatively small and (now) shrinking market anyway. DVD customers certainly won't care for 4K and many who do (finally) move on from DVD bypass Blu-ray and go to digital. So basically the market will be a niche of a niche: too tiny for the studios to care about.
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Old 10-17-2014, 11:46 AM   #5
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Providers have enough trouble with bandwidth for HD, let alone UHD.
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Old 10-17-2014, 11:47 AM   #6
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The only drawback to 4K systems is that to be appreciated, it requires Large panel 70" plus) and close-up viewing (4-5") to effective see the difference.
I have heard this argument for a decade lobbed against 1080p. "The human eye can't tell the difference between 720p and 1080p from normal viewing distances". That's BS but I don't want to debate that. True or not, 720p sets are pretty rare now.

I guess I have super-vision because the difference between 1080p and 2160p is pretty obvious to me. Unless " normal viewing distance" is like 15 feet, I don't see how it would be a problem for most people.
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Old 10-17-2014, 02:14 PM   #7
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I have heard this argument for a decade lobbed against 1080p. "The human eye can't tell the difference between 720p and 1080p from normal viewing distances". That's BS but I don't want to debate that. True or not, 720p sets are pretty rare now.

I guess I have super-vision because the difference between 1080p and 2160p is pretty obvious to me. Unless " normal viewing distance" is like 15 feet, I don't see how I would be a problem for most people.
There are still plenty of 720p sets being sold - mostly 2nd and third tier but there are a lot still out there. As far as 'debating' stuff - optics and anatomy make that pretty elementary. Resolving power and distances can easily be calculated and mapped regardless of what you choose to believe. I would like for my next projector to be 4k but prices will need to fall dramatically for that to happen. In stores looking at mid 50-65 inch UHD displays can be mind blowing but only when right up on them (never will I be watching from a ~3ft or less distance. The biggest drawback though will ultimately be that optical disc unfortunately is a dying media and bandwidth issues and low adoption rates will hinder 4k streaming.
Video games could really expand the market if they find an easier way to get around the 30fps cap that HDMI is limiting ATM.
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Old 10-17-2014, 04:24 PM   #8
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There are still plenty of 720p sets being sold - mostly 2nd and third tier but there are a lot still out there. As far as 'debating' stuff - optics and anatomy make that pretty elementary. Resolving power and distances can easily be calculated and mapped regardless of what you choose to believe. I would like for my next projector to be 4k but prices will need to fall dramatically for that to happen. In stores looking at mid 50-65 inch UHD displays can be mind blowing but only when right up on them (never will I be watching from a ~3ft or less distance. The biggest drawback though will ultimately be that optical disc unfortunately is a dying media and bandwidth issues and low adoption rates will hinder 4k streaming.
Video games could really expand the market if they find an easier way to get around the 30fps cap that HDMI is limiting ATM.
The fact is that I sit 7' from my 58", so I can tell 720p from 1080p quite easily. Just like I can tell 1080p from 2160p quite easily. It's pretty elementary. So you can post whatever chart you want to, I can tell the difference, especially on a 65", which is what I plan on getting. Now if other people want to sit 20' away and complain how they can't see the difference, that's their problem.

Also HDMI 2.0, which the latest gen of 4KTVs supports, is NOT limited to 30fps.
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Old 10-17-2014, 05:11 PM   #9
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regardless of that none of the TVs that I've had the fortune of seeing that are 4k accept greater than 30 frames per second over HDMI . with your size screens and distance I don't doubt you can see the difference but at standard viewing distances which most people sit at or beyond is another matter. I work in vision and optics everyday and I'm pretty comfortable in knowing what the limitations of human vision are. I would love it for 4k to become cheap and mainstream but it just ain't gonna happen
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Old 10-17-2014, 06:25 PM   #10
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Quote:
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The fact is that I sit 7' from my 58", so I can tell 720p from 1080p quite easily. Just like I can tell 1080p from 2160p quite easily. It's pretty elementary. So you can post whatever chart you want to, I can tell the difference, especially on a 65", which is what I plan on getting. Now if other people want to sit 20' away and complain how they can't see the difference, that's their problem.

Also HDMI 2.0, which the latest gen of 4KTVs supports, is NOT limited to 30fps.
7 feet from a 58" it will be easy for anybody tell 1080p from 720p. You don't need 70+ for 4K but anything under 55" will not be big enough, unless it's used as a monitor or you sit real close.

I have a 65" 4K TV and I sit about 6 feet away. So I can easily tell the difference between 1080p and 4K. But most people sit 8-12 feet away, and for that distance you need at least an 80" screen to notice any benefit in 4K resolution (assuming an average distance of 10 feet and 20/20 vision).

If 4K Blu-ray comes to pass, it will need more than resolution enhancements to become successful with the average consumer. Higher frame rates, dynamic range, and improved color space are all enhancements which could be appreciated from any viewing distance.
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Old 10-19-2014, 09:27 AM   #11
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I'll be excited when it becomes reality. The reason I'm not excited now is that I don't see any sign of support for the studios. But if/when that happens, then yeah, I'll be on board for 4K.
I'm sure the retailers are just lining up to carry niche niche niche discs in their ever growing room for discs.

That's sarcasm, because retailers barely carry discs right now.

Online-only will be the way to buy these discs.
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Old 10-20-2014, 12:41 PM   #12
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I'm sure the retailers are just lining up to carry niche niche niche discs in their ever growing room for discs.

That's sarcasm, because retailers barely carry discs right now.

Online-only will be the way to buy these discs.
There you go over-exaggerating again. Wal-Mart, Target, and Best Buy all dedicate a lot of space to CD, DVD, and BD.
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Old 10-20-2014, 02:30 PM   #13
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There you go over-exaggerating again. Wal-Mart, Target, and Best Buy all dedicate a lot of space to CD, DVD, and BD.
Where I live they still carry a good bit but less than half the space of what they used to - especially at my local best buy.
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Old 10-20-2014, 02:58 PM   #14
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Where I live they still carry a good bit but less than half the space of what they used to - especially at my local best buy.
Which makes sense since all three of the stores do much more business online now.
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Old 10-20-2014, 03:06 PM   #15
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I prefer optical discs (blu-ray) but mostly get from local exchange store 2nd hand for dirt cheap or amazon. Some 'buys' from redbox overstock as well
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