Bars, Bars and More Bars

JMS · 03-18-2005, 07:52 AM

04Roadking · 03-19-2005, 07:18 AM

Hello everyone, this is my first post but I have been reading alot of interesting info from this forum. Here goes my experience with bars on my Hitachi 51swx20b rear projection crt tv. Had this tv hooked up to TWC's dvr hd stb, don't remember whitch model number of the stb but with the tv connected with component hook ups, to the tv's input one, the only picture you could get that wasn't HD had bars on the screen. Could not change from black to grey you only had black.
Being new to HD tv's didnt know this would be detrimental to my tv. After about 18 months I started noticing when an HD program came on I could still see the line on the screen where the bars were. I guess I was lucky that I sprung for the extended warranty that I almost never buy ! That waranty paid 930.00 $ to replace all three of the CRT's in my tv. I now have my tv back after being at the shop for 6 weeks. I am now subscribing with Voom and am glad that the stb has minimal channels with the bars. Any how, just wanted to warn any other novices out there to limit your black bar time or you may be sorry. I am also interested in these professional calibrations of the inputs of my tv and also was interested in the tuning dvd's I've read about on your forum,can these be purchased at a local AV outlet or online only, any info would be appreciated, I know my tv was banged around a good bit by these so called delivery guys that came back with my tv, thats why I am interested in this info.
Thanks for any help.

**rbinck** · 03-19-2005, 07:45 AM

There is a forum on ISF professional setup here: ISF Calibration

Most TVs these days do not have mechanical adjustments anymore. They are settings in a digital memory, so the delivery guys would not be able to change them. But there are a few dealing with focus mainly that could be "bumped" out of adjustment.

04Roadking · 03-19-2005, 04:33 PM

Thanks for geeting back to me, I have found a link on this site that directed me to some local calibraters. Also my tv has the magic focus function on it , is this a gimic or does it work ? Don't seem to notice much difference after using it.

maicaw · 04-10-2005, 02:17 AM

Might be a good time to mention again for the DIYers there are lots of adjustments that can be made to improve the display if you are careful --- access the service menu using special sequences on the remote or pushing a hidden button the back of the set -- I watched a service tech mess up my XBR convergence and the dealer exchanged the set - the next time I tweaked it myself and seemed to meet the criteria of the Avia dvd - not for everyone but here's the link --http://myweb.accessus.net/~090/how2adj.html

yeah2004 · 06-08-2005, 10:24 PM

ok guys, I have a quick question. I turned off the 4:3 conversion on my rear projector widescreen TV because it was annoying to switch back to 4:3 after watching HD channels. My question is....are the black bars I have now that much worse than the grey ones? The person at Circuit City said the grey bars help the screen from burning in, but for some strange reason, the picture quality is actually better for SD channels. I have a dilemma...either have better picture quality or risk having those black bars burn an image into my screen.

I really enjoy this forum. I am new to the whole HD technology, and this site has answered a lot of my questions.

Thanks in advance

RSawdey · 06-09-2005, 10:28 AM

Make & model of TV please... and any STB you're using.

Blue_Tech · 06-15-2005, 12:08 AM

Quote:

ok guys, I have a quick question. I turned off the 4:3 conversion on my rear projector widescreen TV because it was annoying to switch back to 4:3 after watching HD channels. My question is....are the black bars I have now that much worse than the grey ones? The person at Circuit City said the grey bars help the screen from burning in, but for some strange reason, the picture quality is actually better for SD channels. I have a dilemma...either have better picture quality or risk having those black bars burn an image into my screen.

Here's my thinking... Burn-in is the aging of the phophor coating on the screen. If the bars are black, those spaces are unused and NOT aging, meanwhile, the rest of the screen is aging. Thus, giving us a darker picture in the middle and a brighter picture at the edges as time goes on.

If we use the gray bars instead, we can attempt to make the entire screen age at roughly the same rate... minimizing the burn-in to a much higher degree.

RSawdey · 06-15-2005, 05:09 PM

You've got it nailed Blue Tech...

njt · 08-07-2005, 02:57 PM

Are certain types (i.e., Plasma, Rear Proj. LCD, etc.) of sets more suceptable to this "uneven aging" issue? I'm curious, as years of watching letterbox dvd on a 4:3 CRT set never caused issues.

I see the Sony KD-34XBR960 CRT uses black bars. I assume it wouldn't be a risk?

RSawdey · 08-08-2005, 06:12 PM

CRT RPTV worst, Plasma next, direct view CRT least problem...

njt · 08-09-2005, 11:17 AM

Ok thanks for the info. I am finally going HD this month and have been going back and forth between the Sony 34" XBR CRT and the Sony 42" Rear Projection LCD. I was shocked at how distracting the grey Window box bars were on the RPLCDs when viewing SD programs. I think (based on years of ignoring black letterbox bars on a 4:3) that I can live with SD window boxing better if the bars are black.

PS. I'm new to site, but thankful for the weath of info here.

ja2935 · 08-09-2005, 01:01 PM

Better still would be to get used to watching 4:3 stretched to fill the screen. I know some people find this annoying but it depends on the particular TV's capabilities. Mine happens to be quite good but I have no experience with the Sony version. I can also stretch the HD channels to get rid of the 'broadcast' black bars when they have 4:3 programming - not all TVs have this HD capability.

If you are considering a 34" CRT there are good makes out there other than Sony.

Mike Wolf · 08-10-2005, 03:25 PM

Although I probably already know the answer, i want to see if im right.

My Panasonic Tau CT-27HL15 has an IMAGE SHIFT function that the manual ( and the tv itself ) recommend be left on to prevent images being retained onto the screen. Since its a 4:3 HDTV, when it displays 1080i high def images it automatically switches to 16:9 mode and i cant undo it. My question is, will this IMAGE SHIFT function prevent the burn in on my expensive tv? I watch high def programming 80% of the time and standard def programs the other percentage, so that the whole screen gets a work out. I hope yous can give me the answer i think i have.

RSawdey · 08-10-2005, 05:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by njt

I was shocked at how distracting the grey Window box bars were on the RPLCDs when viewing SD programs. I think (based on years of ignoring black letterbox bars on a 4:3) that I can live with SD window boxing better if the bars are black.

Since LCD can't burn in, there is no reason to use gray bars... hopefully you can change their color.

03-18-2005, 07:52 AM	#16
JMS I'm gettin' all pixelated Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Columbus,OH Posts: 191	Click Me!

03-19-2005, 07:18 AM	#17
04Roadking Hd, my bike and tv! Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Irmo, South Carolina Posts: 7	Hello everyone, this is my first post but I have been reading alot of interesting info from this forum. Here goes my experience with bars on my Hitachi 51swx20b rear projection crt tv. Had this tv hooked up to TWC's dvr hd stb, don't remember whitch model number of the stb but with the tv connected with component hook ups, to the tv's input one, the only picture you could get that wasn't HD had bars on the screen. Could not change from black to grey you only had black. Being new to HD tv's didnt know this would be detrimental to my tv. After about 18 months I started noticing when an HD program came on I could still see the line on the screen where the bars were. I guess I was lucky that I sprung for the extended warranty that I almost never buy ! That waranty paid 930.00 $ to replace all three of the CRT's in my tv. I now have my tv back after being at the shop for 6 weeks. I am now subscribing with Voom and am glad that the stb has minimal channels with the bars. Any how, just wanted to warn any other novices out there to limit your black bar time or you may be sorry. I am also interested in these professional calibrations of the inputs of my tv and also was interested in the tuning dvd's I've read about on your forum,can these be purchased at a local AV outlet or online only, any info would be appreciated, I know my tv was banged around a good bit by these so called delivery guys that came back with my tv, thats why I am interested in this info. Thanks for any help. Last edited by 04Roadking; 03-19-2005 at 07:27 AM.

08-07-2005, 02:57 PM	#25
njt Resident Noob Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Westminster, CO Posts: 62	Are certain types (i.e., Plasma, Rear Proj. LCD, etc.) of sets more suceptable to this "uneven aging" issue? I'm curious, as years of watching letterbox dvd on a 4:3 CRT set never caused issues. I see the Sony KD-34XBR960 CRT uses black bars. I assume it wouldn't be a risk? Last edited by njt; 08-07-2005 at 03:07 PM.

08-09-2005, 01:01 PM	#28
ja2935 High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 1,034	Better still would be to get used to watching 4:3 stretched to fill the screen. I know some people find this annoying but it depends on the particular TV's capabilities. Mine happens to be quite good but I have no experience with the Sony version. I can also stretch the HD channels to get rid of the 'broadcast' black bars when they have 4:3 programming - not all TVs have this HD capability. If you are considering a 34" CRT there are good makes out there other than Sony. __________________ Toshiba 34HF84 Comcast Motorola DCT 3416 (all digital), Component/Fiber Optic Toshiba SD4900 (Region Free), Component/Digital Coax Toshiba HD-A2, HDMI/Fiber Optic Yamaha YHT-160 Home Theater System

08-10-2005, 03:25 PM	#29
Mike Wolf Associate Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Toms River, New Jersey Posts: 309	Although I probably already know the answer, i want to see if im right. My Panasonic Tau CT-27HL15 has an IMAGE SHIFT function that the manual ( and the tv itself ) recommend be left on to prevent images being retained onto the screen. Since its a 4:3 HDTV, when it displays 1080i high def images it automatically switches to 16:9 mode and i cant undo it. My question is, will this IMAGE SHIFT function prevent the burn in on my expensive tv? I watch high def programming 80% of the time and standard def programs the other percentage, so that the whole screen gets a work out. I hope yous can give me the answer i think i have. __________________ Panasonic CT-27HL15 Direct view Tau HDTV Monitor Kenwood VR-715 A/V Surround Receiver Kenwood SW-07HT Subwoofer Kenwood KS- 207HT Speaker System Panasonic DMR-E30S DVD Video Recorder Scientific Atlanta Explorer 8300HD DVR via Comcast Opinions expressed are my own and do not necessarily represent those of my employer or its associate companies.

03-19-2005, 07:45 AM	#18
rbinck Super Moderator Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Houston, Texas Posts: 10,612	There is a forum on ISF professional setup here: ISF Calibration Most TVs these days do not have mechanical adjustments anymore. They are settings in a digital memory, so the delivery guys would not be able to change them. But there are a few dealing with focus mainly that could be "bumped" out of adjustment.

03-19-2005, 04:33 PM	#19
04Roadking Hd, my bike and tv! Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Irmo, South Carolina Posts: 7	Thanks for geeting back to me, I have found a link on this site that directed me to some local calibraters. Also my tv has the magic focus function on it , is this a gimic or does it work ? Don't seem to notice much difference after using it.

04-10-2005, 02:17 AM	#20
maicaw Crabtree's Bludgeon Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,003	Might be a good time to mention again for the DIYers there are lots of adjustments that can be made to improve the display if you are careful --- access the service menu using special sequences on the remote or pushing a hidden button the back of the set -- I watched a service tech mess up my XBR convergence and the dealer exchanged the set - the next time I tweaked it myself and seemed to meet the criteria of the Avia dvd - not for everyone but here's the link --http://myweb.accessus.net/~090/how2adj.html

06-08-2005, 10:24 PM	#21
yeah2004 What is HD? Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 1	ok guys, I have a quick question. I turned off the 4:3 conversion on my rear projector widescreen TV because it was annoying to switch back to 4:3 after watching HD channels. My question is....are the black bars I have now that much worse than the grey ones? The person at Circuit City said the grey bars help the screen from burning in, but for some strange reason, the picture quality is actually better for SD channels. I have a dilemma...either have better picture quality or risk having those black bars burn an image into my screen. I really enjoy this forum. I am new to the whole HD technology, and this site has answered a lot of my questions. Thanks in advance

06-09-2005, 10:28 AM	#22
RSawdey Mr. Wizard Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ferndale, Michigan Age: 60 Posts: 5,981	Make & model of TV please... and any STB you're using.

06-15-2005, 05:09 PM	#24
RSawdey Mr. Wizard Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ferndale, Michigan Age: 60 Posts: 5,981	You've got it nailed Blue Tech...

08-08-2005, 06:12 PM	#26
RSawdey Mr. Wizard Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ferndale, Michigan Age: 60 Posts: 5,981	CRT RPTV worst, Plasma next, direct view CRT least problem...

08-09-2005, 11:17 AM	#27
njt Resident Noob Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Westminster, CO Posts: 62	Ok thanks for the info. I am finally going HD this month and have been going back and forth between the Sony 34" XBR CRT and the Sony 42" Rear Projection LCD. I was shocked at how distracting the grey Window box bars were on the RPLCDs when viewing SD programs. I think (based on years of ignoring black letterbox bars on a 4:3) that I can live with SD window boxing better if the bars are black. PS. I'm new to site, but thankful for the weath of info here.

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Email this Page
Display Modes
Linear Mode Switch to Hybrid Mode Switch to Threaded Mode