Calibration Disk - equipment required

ALEXIVOL · 08-13-2009, 10:16 AM

I have the Avia and another brand of calibration disk... I have 3 HDTV'S that I want to calibrate prior to the start of the NFL season... But none of these TV's are connected to a DVD player. I have the following questions... (1) will most inexpensive DVD players available on the market work OK to do this calibration and (2) is the DVD connection to the HDTV using HDMI a must or will the Red Green Blue cable connection work OK?

Loves2Watch · 08-13-2009, 10:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ALEXIVOL

I have the Avia and another brand of calibration disk... I have 3 HDTV'S that I want to calibrate prior to the start of the NFL season... But none of these TV's are connected to a DVD player. I have the following questions... (1) will most inexpensive DVD players available on the market work OK to do this calibration and (2) is the DVD connection to the HDTV using HDMI a must or will the Red Green Blue cable connection work OK?

You should calibrate each and every input as they are independent of each other so you would want to do this - calibrate using component (red, green blue) each component input on your TV, then calibrate each HDMI input. That way, whatever you connect to any of your inputs will be good to go.

A regular DVD player with both component and HDMI outputs would be what you need to begin your calibration. In the future, If you do get a Blu-ray player (or HD DVD) if so inclined, you will want to do the calibration all over again with a HD calibration disc made by either of the manufacturers you noted.

Did that answer your question?

Scottnot · 08-13-2009, 12:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loves2Watch

In the future, If you do get a Blu-ray player (or HD DVD) if so inclined, you will want to do the calibration all over again with a HD calibration disc made by either of the manufacturers you noted.

In the future, you may wish to do the calibration all over again with a HD calibration disc,
but the difference will be minimal at best and most likely not visually perceptible.

Loves2Watch · 08-13-2009, 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scottnot

In the future, you may wish to do the calibration all over again with a HD calibration disc,
but the difference will be minimal at best and most likely not visually perceptible.

According to you as it is known that the SD DVD calibration disc is not capable of making some adjustments on HD TV's.

Please don't poison my answers with your incorrect opinions

Scottnot · 08-13-2009, 01:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loves2Watch

According to you as it is known that the SD DVD calibration disc is not capable of making some adjustments on HD TV's.

Tell us oh wise one, exactly which adjustments is the SD DVD incapable of making?
Hint: it has to do with "color space", but does not diminish the correctness of my reply.

If what you say is correct, I'm sure the OP would like to know as well.

Quote:

Please don't poison my answers with your incorrect opinions

Instead of getting all huffy, why not post an informative reply for the benefit of the OP?

dd716ted · 08-17-2009, 07:17 PM

Is a new special HD disk (Avia or other brand) needed to calibrate an HD TV or will the one that I have had for several years work?

Scottnot · 08-18-2009, 09:42 AM

The one that you already have will almost certainly work just fine.

Why that is the case can be a little confusing however.

Quote:

Another potential problem is color decoding. SD and HD video uses two different standards because HD provides a wider color space. This means HD has a slightly deeper green, red and blue primary than SD provides. When HDMI uses the expected YCbCr encoding it must also use the correct color space based on whether the source is HD, ITU Rec. 709, or SD, ITU Rec. 601. For HD only sources such as satellite and cable receivers this presents a problem for SD that is being converted to HD scan rates such as 720P and 1080I. For DVD players it is a problem because when the player is set for 480I or 480P the display will use SD color space and when it is set for 720P or 1080I the display will use HD color space. On one hand this would seem correct as it is following the specifications. In reality you will get the wrong color. The only way to correct this error is for the display to provide a manual selection of SD or HD color space which is not common.

Improper color space selection results in improper color saturation and tint. Will you notice? Hard to say as the perception will be viewer dependent without a reference point but if you are making comparisons of products this is critical to your evaluation.
Source: http://www.hdtvmagazine.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5317

IMO, it doesn't matter whether you use the SD disc or the HD disc to calibrate your HDTV, primarily because there is no such thing a "perfect" calibration and as the citation above suggests, perception will be viewer dependent without a reference point.
Summary; there may be a difference, but it is very unlikely that you will notice it.

Loves2Watch · 08-18-2009, 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dd716ted

Is a new special HD disk (Avia or other brand) needed to calibrate an HD TV or will the one that I have had for several years work?

Yes you can use it but if you do add a Blu-ray disc player, it may be worth the investment of a new HD calibration disc to make sure your colors are correct.

Lee Stewart · 08-18-2009, 07:44 PM

A guys . . .

Both SD and HD have the same "color space" which is 24 bit RGB - which means they will both have the same gray scale (256 steps) and the same number of colors (16.7M)

The difference (601 versus 709) is that HD is more accurate in rendering colors. Red will be red, not orangish red.

And that is why it is preferred to use a HD encoded calibration disk.

Scottnot · 08-19-2009, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lee Stewart

The difference (601 versus 709) is that HD is more accurate in rendering colors. Red will be red, not orangish red.

Right . . . sorta . . . but there's more to it than that:

First thing would be to check an in-depth review of your particular television; many do not even meet 601 color space requirement,
and very few meet 709 requirements; so they may not even be able to produce the red that 601 calls for let alone that for 709.

Then:

Quote:

Ideally, conversions between HD and SD formats would take into account the different primaries of the systems being used. If such a conversion were performed, color bars on a master tape would no longer be correct in the destination format. For post production facilities, color bars would need to be relaid onto the new tape so that the tape will pass quality control checks. For post houses to perform this color space conversion would be a liability. If they forget to redo the color bars (user error happens), then their tape will not pass quality control (the first thing they check for is that the color bars line up) and they can even potentially lose a client for their screwup. And there is little benefit for them to do these color space conversions correctly- honestly, nobody will notice. They have little incentive to perform ideal color space conversions (if they even know about it).

From: http://www.glennchan.info/articles/t...olor-space.htm
It should be noted that several other sources mimic this exact message.

So there are several issues:

What exactly is the format of the source material; for example, an orginal program may have been produced with equipment using 601, but sent as HD programing -- with or without reformating of color space.
How capable is your television of displaying either 601 or 709?
Does your DVD player and/or your TV know what the colorspace is of the source material; does it properly reformat if necessary -
I don't think any are capable of doing this "on the fly".

If the differences were readily apparent to a normal viewer, this could be a problem, but the sources that I have checked all suggest that they are not . . . and, once again, the differences encountered in production, mastering and broadcasting will be greater than those encountered between 601 and 709.

thesaint · 08-29-2009, 11:53 AM

where can we get the disk from?

Loves2Watch · 08-29-2009, 07:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thesaint

where can we get the disk from?

www.amazon.com

jstrazz · 08-31-2009, 10:12 AM

Which calibration disks works best?

Loves2Watch · 08-31-2009, 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jstrazz

Which calibration disks works best?

Avia, DVE and my new favorite Spears and Munsil (which is the easiest for newcomers).

You can purchase it here - http://www.amazon.com/Spears-Munsil-.../dp/B001UM29OC

08-13-2009, 10:16 AM	#1
ALEXIVOL No Life without iPod Join Date: May 2007 Location: Long Beach, CA Posts: 45	Calibration Disk - equipment required I have the Avia and another brand of calibration disk... I have 3 HDTV'S that I want to calibrate prior to the start of the NFL season... But none of these TV's are connected to a DVD player. I have the following questions... (1) will most inexpensive DVD players available on the market work OK to do this calibration and (2) is the DVD connection to the HDTV using HDMI a must or will the Red Green Blue cable connection work OK?

08-17-2009, 07:17 PM	#6
dd716ted Oakland Raiders Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Washington State Posts: 152	Now I am Confussed.. Is a new special HD disk (Avia or other brand) needed to calibrate an HD TV or will the one that I have had for several years work? __________________ LG 37LC2D 37" LCD Flat Panel TV Samsung HP-S4253 42" Plasma Flat Panel TV Toshiba 32" LCD HD TV Samsung 50" Plasma PN50A650 HDTV 1- DTV H-20 Receiver (HDMI) 1- DTV HR-22 (HDMI) 1- DTV HR-20 (HDMI) 1- DTV HR-21 (HDMI) RCA RDT-170 Home Theater System Sony HCTC100 Sound Bar System 3 -Logitech "659" Harmony Remotes Nintendo Wii

Similar Threads to Calibration Disk - equipment required
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Is Calibration Really Needed on a Top of the Line Set?	jyafink	HDTV Calibration	14	10-06-2008 09:18 PM
Ok about to order a calibration disc, need feedback	Emperorr	Flat-Panel TVs	10	03-13-2008 08:49 PM
ISF Calibration around London Ontario	DSNY FN	HDTV Calibration	7	09-14-2007 06:53 PM
Calibration Disk	slcsnkman	HDTV Calibration	10	07-07-2005 05:22 PM
Calibration Disk	slcsnkman	HDTV Calibration	0	06-28-2005 10:29 AM

08-18-2009, 07:44 PM	#9
Lee Stewart Behold - the future! Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Albuquerque, NM Age: 58 Posts: 25,188	A guys . . . Both SD and HD have the same "color space" which is 24 bit RGB - which means they will both have the same gray scale (256 steps) and the same number of colors (16.7M) The difference (601 versus 709) is that HD is more accurate in rendering colors. Red will be red, not orangish red. And that is why it is preferred to use a HD encoded calibration disk.

08-29-2009, 11:53 AM	#11
thesaint My plasma is High Def. Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 7	where can we get the disk from?

08-31-2009, 10:12 AM	#13
jstrazz I love my Samsung HD Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 34	Which calibration disks works best?