Xbox 360: Worst of RROD Behind Us

Lee Stewart · 02-18-2009, 12:11 PM

Xbox 360: Worst of RROD Behind Us

Quote:

Aaron Greenberg gives the good news.

18 Feb 2009

Aaron Greenberg (group product manager for Xbox and Xbox Live) has friends who have had their Xbox 360s fixed recently. How his friends feel about this is unclear. He speaks about this in a recent interview regarding Xbox 360 repair processes. We'll get back to the friends. Right now, it's good news on repairs, says Aaron.

"We're seeing great performance of the (Xbox 360) current systems, so we're really happy with the way they've been performing."

That's great news - it would appear that the Jasper-based 360s are, according to Aaron working out. Or maybe not Jasper? Aaron says of the improved repair processe, "It's very quick, and they may upgrade your system with the latest technology. So that works really well." Okay, so he can't oversee all (any) of the repairs so he can't be certain that all consumers get upgrades. Fair enough.

So, what of his friends? "From friends that have had [repairs] done as of late..." and? "I can tell you from our own internal staff that we're seeing very strong performance from a quality standpoint."

Can we take a breath there? Aaron can say that his own staff can tell him that his own company is "seeing a very strong performance from a quality standpoint"? Let's continue with this monumental gush of raw business-speak.

"What it comes down to is isolating and figuring out the issue (of faults with Xbox 360s), fixing the issue, and the more that we can fix the issue, and know it's fixed, then we're good going forward."

We'll translate, "Once we've worked out how to fix faults so they stay fixed then faults will be fixed."

Apparently being able to fix faults that have been found is an achievement rather than a basic working principle. However, Aaron is able to declare that, "We've put the worst behind us on this, but we know there are a few lagging systems, and so we want to take those and make it right."

As for his friends, well, we still don't know if they're happy.

http://news.spong.com/article/17193/...2181110&cb=806

pearl-drum-man · 02-18-2009, 09:33 PM

Should be getting mine back from the RRoD fix tomorrow. Will be interesting to see if it is upgraded to the Jasper.

pearl-drum-man · 02-19-2009, 06:50 PM

Got it back, no upgrades.

Will hook it up tomorrow and see how it goes, the shipping box was beat up pretty good. I think it fell off the UPS truck and the driver kicked it all the way up the drive-way to my door-step.

Then back to finishing God of War 2 so I can get back to the 360.

8ch-DeeorDie · 02-19-2009, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pearl-drum-man

Got it back, no upgrades.

Will hook it up tomorrow and see how it goes, the shipping box was beat up pretty good. I think it fell off the UPS truck and the driver kicked it all the way up the drive-way to my door-step.

Then back to finishing God of War 2 so I can get back to the 360.

My wife and I bought the Xenon version(no HDMI) 360 premium for our son in December 06. After almost a year it RROD only 3 days after he got Halo 3, so we sent it in.

It took almost exactly one month, but when we did get it back, it had the new heat sink installed. It has been perfect ever since( and we play the crap out of it: Madden, Halo 3, COD, GTA4...)

I don't pretend to be 100% sure that it will never RROD again, but we have until Dec. 09 for free fix.

And if it does go out, we may just get a new Jasper Arcade and swap the HDD.

pearl-drum-man · 02-21-2009, 03:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 8ch-DeeorDie

My wife and I bought the Xenon version(no HDMI) 360 premium for our son in December 06. After almost a year it RROD only 3 days after he got Halo 3, so we sent it in.

It took almost exactly one month, but when we did get it back, it had the new heat sink installed. It has been perfect ever since( and we play the crap out of it: Madden, Halo 3, COD, GTA4...)

I don't pretend to be 100% sure that it will never RROD again, but we have until Dec. 09 for free fix.

And if it does go out, we may just get a new Jasper Arcade and swap the HDD.

Got mine back and got it up and running. I'm doing a bit of a torture test on it now, and it will be getting a lot of gameplay short-term as well. I have some catching up to do, and the wife has been suffering from Scene-it withdrawal.

ChaosMan1014 · 02-21-2009, 07:12 PM

Given that the RROD is a general failure fault it may be hard for MS to pick out the exact problem when a box comes in, especially since there aren't LED's or a speaker on the board to indicate in some form or another which specific part failed. I imagine that the techs repairing them don't have a lot of time to spend on each box scrutinizing every step of the repair so they probably address what is thought to be the main fault, the CPU/GPU heat sinks (plus the thermal grease they use is crappy and acts more of an thermal insulator than a conductor). I was lucky enough a few weeks back that the box I was working on hadn't been extensively damaged.m My friend did the right thing and left it alone instead of doing the towel trick (Xbox thermal damage intensifier). We spent about two hours scrutinizing every step and *knock on wood* it's been running smooth and cool since.

railven · 02-22-2009, 05:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChaosMan1014

Given that the RROD is a general failure fault it may be hard for MS to pick out the exact problem when a box comes in, especially since there aren't LED's or a speaker on the board to indicate in some form or another which specific part failed. I imagine that the techs repairing them don't have a lot of time to spend on each box scrutinizing every step of the repair so they probably address what is thought to be the main fault, the CPU/GPU heat sinks (plus the thermal grease they use is crappy and acts more of an thermal insulator than a conductor). I was lucky enough a few weeks back that the box I was working on hadn't been extensively damaged.m My friend did the right thing and left it alone instead of doing the towel trick (Xbox thermal damage intensifier). We spent about two hours scrutinizing every step and *knock on wood* it's been running smooth and cool since.

How can a thermal paste/pad be a conductor of heat? That sounds impossible. Haha.

I've always wanted to rip my PS3/360 open and redo the inside. Use some good thermal paste (arctic silver), lap the heatsinks down to a mirrored polish, replace them if they aren't copper with copper ones (if possible, I'm sure it is), and then replace the fans with low dB high CFM ones for the 360 and probable bore a larger hole for the PS3, seems like it can take an 80mm easy or even a 92mm.

But those are just ideas, my days of modding cases are long gone...I'm too old for that now.

ChaosMan1014 · 02-22-2009, 07:47 AM

Thermal conductivity simply means it transfers heat from source to sink at some rate of efficiently which is inversely proportional to the area over which is heat is being applied. You want that property in a thermal paste/pad. It also serves to fill in any scratches on your hot surface (CPU) and your cool surface (heat sink) removing any hot points on the hot surface. This is why, typically you only find heat paste applied in very thin layers. The way MS applies their paste (at least in the case I worked on) was that they globbed on so much that it would have actually impeded that transfer of heat. The phrase "too much of a good thing" applies here. It would have had to be extremely efficient for that much paste to still conduct heat from source to the sink as at a certain thickness the and something deep down tells me that MS isn't about to invest in when they have to make thousands of Xbox 360s every day.

hidefman30 · 02-22-2009, 08:00 AM

I purchased my 360 at launch. Luckily for me a I decided to trade it in after a year for a new PS3. Then I learned all about rrod, and all the revisions made to the hardware over the following years. PS3 was nice but I learned how much better Xbox 360 was after you don't have one for a while. I purchased a Jasper Pro 360 in December of 2009! Runs quieter, cooler, and hopefully forever. So glad I view this website allot. I almost got a Falcon Elite instead, but someone from here pointed me to an even newer revision of the console.

railven · 02-22-2009, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChaosMan1014

Thermal conductivity simply means it transfers heat from source to sink at some rate of efficiently which is inversely proportional to the area over which is heat is being applied. You want that property in a thermal paste/pad. It also serves to fill in any scratches on your hot surface (CPU) and your cool surface (heat sink) removing any hot points on the hot surface. This is why, typically you only find heat paste applied in very thin layers. The way MS applies their paste (at least in the case I worked on) was that they globbed on so much that it would have actually impeded that transfer of heat. The phrase "too much of a good thing" applies here. It would have had to be extremely efficient for that much paste to still conduct heat from source to the sink as at a certain thickness the and something deep down tells me that MS isn't about to invest in when they have to make thousands of Xbox 360s every day.

Talk about a brain fart! my apologies, haha what i meant to ask was "insulator" not conductor.

but you explained how it was insulating. since i havent torn apart my hardware im not aware of how much paste they used. most oem manufacturers use a tad more than is needed in my opinion. the pads on AMD heatsinks is way too thick for my liking - which is why i dont buy AMD ohhh! haha.

ChaosMan1014 · 02-22-2009, 08:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by railven

Talk about a brain fart! my apologies, haha what i meant to ask was "insulator" not conductor.

but you explained how it was insulating. since i havent torn apart my hardware im not aware of how much paste they used. most oem manufacturers use a tad more than is needed in my opinion. the pads on AMD heatsinks is way too thick for my liking - which is why i dont buy AMD ohhh! haha.

No worries. I agree with you on the pads. I buy AMD but I don't use their heat sinks. I usually buy a aftermarket sink so I can overclock higher on air and not have to result to water cooling.

**kamspy** · 02-22-2009, 01:59 PM

So far so good with my new elite.

Though it does sound like a helicopter even when the disc drive isn't spinning.

Shame MS couldn't cough up the extra 3 cents for better fan bearings.

pearl-drum-man · 02-22-2009, 08:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kamspy

So far so good with my new elite.

Though it does sound like a helicopter even when the disc drive isn't spinning.

Shame MS couldn't cough up the extra 3 cents for better fan bearings.

My "new" 360 seems to be quieter than my 2006 model. Not a Falcon or a Jasper.

gameguru1360 · 02-24-2009, 04:36 PM

well I just got a 2nd xbox360, arcade version from the liquidation sale of circuit city and it gave me the 3 RROD only from downloading game content! I'm going to have this local guy fix it which he can also add an XCM fan near the gpu rather than sending it into MS. I can't go back to circuit crappy and exchange it for another one since it's "all sales final"!!

I wanted a 2nd x360 console so that when a friend comes over and plays GOW2, he doesn't have to complain about doing the split screen on my tv.

jusHD · 02-24-2009, 06:21 PM

The sad thing is as consumers we have accepted a product this defective. I dont understand how people take this and continue to support this by buying more systems and tolerating having a helicopter in their home. What message does this send? Its basically being raped and saying okay rape me again I will support you while you do it (I guess as guys that wouldnt be bad unless its another guy which this is like). But really if your car broke all the time like that or your TV or fridge or tv service provider always went out for weeks would you take that also? Considering the economy how well built is the next xbox going to be now that M$ knows they can bend everyone over like that?

02-18-2009, 09:33 PM	#2
pearl-drum-man Lean, mean, drum machine Join Date: May 2007 Location: Northeast Ohio Posts: 744	Should be getting mine back from the RRoD fix tomorrow. Will be interesting to see if it is upgraded to the Jasper. __________________ Samsung 32" LCD LN-S3238D Toshiba HD D2 Yamaha YHT-390BL 5.1 HTiB Samsung DVD-VR375 DVD recorder/VCR Xbox 360

02-19-2009, 06:50 PM	#3
pearl-drum-man Lean, mean, drum machine Join Date: May 2007 Location: Northeast Ohio Posts: 744	Got it back, no upgrades. Will hook it up tomorrow and see how it goes, the shipping box was beat up pretty good. I think it fell off the UPS truck and the driver kicked it all the way up the drive-way to my door-step. Then back to finishing God of War 2 so I can get back to the 360. __________________ Samsung 32" LCD LN-S3238D Toshiba HD D2 Yamaha YHT-390BL 5.1 HTiB Samsung DVD-VR375 DVD recorder/VCR Xbox 360

02-21-2009, 07:12 PM	#6
ChaosMan1014 Scrumdidlyumptious Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 949	Given that the RROD is a general failure fault it may be hard for MS to pick out the exact problem when a box comes in, especially since there aren't LED's or a speaker on the board to indicate in some form or another which specific part failed. I imagine that the techs repairing them don't have a lot of time to spend on each box scrutinizing every step of the repair so they probably address what is thought to be the main fault, the CPU/GPU heat sinks (plus the thermal grease they use is crappy and acts more of an thermal insulator than a conductor). I was lucky enough a few weeks back that the box I was working on hadn't been extensively damaged.m My friend did the right thing and left it alone instead of doing the towel trick (Xbox thermal damage intensifier). We spent about two hours scrutinizing every step and knock on wood it's been running smooth and cool since. __________________ PSN ID: LordVierge Currently Playing: InFamous If only we could develop a real Katamari... It would be the ultimate globe conquering tool!

02-22-2009, 07:47 AM	#8
ChaosMan1014 Scrumdidlyumptious Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts: 949	Thermal conductivity simply means it transfers heat from source to sink at some rate of efficiently which is inversely proportional to the area over which is heat is being applied. You want that property in a thermal paste/pad. It also serves to fill in any scratches on your hot surface (CPU) and your cool surface (heat sink) removing any hot points on the hot surface. This is why, typically you only find heat paste applied in very thin layers. The way MS applies their paste (at least in the case I worked on) was that they globbed on so much that it would have actually impeded that transfer of heat. The phrase "too much of a good thing" applies here. It would have had to be extremely efficient for that much paste to still conduct heat from source to the sink as at a certain thickness the and something deep down tells me that MS isn't about to invest in when they have to make thousands of Xbox 360s every day. __________________ PSN ID: LordVierge Currently Playing: InFamous If only we could develop a real Katamari... It would be the ultimate globe conquering tool!

02-22-2009, 08:00 AM	#9
hidefman30 High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Nov 2004 Posts: 735	I purchased my 360 at launch. Luckily for me a I decided to trade it in after a year for a new PS3. Then I learned all about rrod, and all the revisions made to the hardware over the following years. PS3 was nice but I learned how much better Xbox 360 was after you don't have one for a while. I purchased a Jasper Pro 360 in December of 2009! Runs quieter, cooler, and hopefully forever. So glad I view this website allot. I almost got a Falcon Elite instead, but someone from here pointed me to an even newer revision of the console. __________________ 55" Hitachi Plasma Sony Dvd Carousel Sony Reciever JBL Speakers Velodyne Sub Xbox 360 PS3 Last edited by hidefman30; 02-22-2009 at 08:03 AM.

02-22-2009, 01:59 PM	#12
kamspy ʎdsɯɐʞ Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: CLASSIFIED Assassin Mod Posts: 14,695	So far so good with my new elite. Though it does sound like a helicopter even when the disc drive isn't spinning. Shame MS couldn't cough up the extra 3 cents for better fan bearings.

02-24-2009, 04:36 PM	#14
gameguru1360 High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Pasadena, CA Posts: 780	well I just got a 2nd xbox360, arcade version from the liquidation sale of circuit city and it gave me the 3 RROD only from downloading game content! I'm going to have this local guy fix it which he can also add an XCM fan near the gpu rather than sending it into MS. I can't go back to circuit crappy and exchange it for another one since it's "all sales final"!! I wanted a 2nd x360 console so that when a friend comes over and plays GOW2, he doesn't have to complain about doing the split screen on my tv. __________________ "What I really need is a woman who loves me for my money but doesn't understand math."

02-24-2009, 06:21 PM	#15
jusHD HD pimp Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Corpus Christi Posts: 1,100	The sad thing is as consumers we have accepted a product this defective. I dont understand how people take this and continue to support this by buying more systems and tolerating having a helicopter in their home. What message does this send? Its basically being raped and saying okay rape me again I will support you while you do it (I guess as guys that wouldnt be bad unless its another guy which this is like). But really if your car broke all the time like that or your TV or fridge or tv service provider always went out for weeks would you take that also? Considering the economy how well built is the next xbox going to be now that M$ knows they can bend everyone over like that?

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