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60 hz vs. 120hz Sony Bravia

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Old 09-03-2010, 08:39 AM   #1
How can anyone watch standard def?
 

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Default 60 hz vs. 120hz Sony Bravia

I'm sure somewhere this has been discussed and answered, although I can't find it.
So here goes. First lets get the formalities out of the way.

I'm Looking at the Sony Bravia KDL-40EX500 to replace my , now dead, 27" Philips CRT.
It will be in my living room about 10 feet from the couch.
I watch 75% movies and 25% tv which is mainly PBS in the morning for the kids and some baseball at night.
I will not have a computer connected to the display.
I will be getting a Blu-Ray player and plan on only watching HDTV channels .

Now to the question.
This model has a 120hz refresh rate, Motionflow and CineMotion.
Motionflow has 3 settings: Off, Standard and High.
CineMotion has: Auto1, Auto 2 or Auto.
The manual reads: "Provides improved picture movement and reduces picture blur and graininess for filmbased
content. Select Auto 1 for standard use, or Auto 2 or Auto to represent original film-based content as is."

This goes to the "Soap Opera Effect".
If I turn off Motionflow and use Auto for CineMotion does this get rid of the "Soap Opera Effect"?
Is the 120 hz always on regardless of the Motionflow and CineMotion settings?
If my Blu-Ray player and display are set to 1080p/24 am I seeing the movie the way it was intened to be watched ( no 120hz effect)?
If I get a 60hz HDTV does this eliminate the "Soap Opera Effect" ?

I know that's a lot of questions. I may have left out some info so please be easy on me.
ANY info would be GREATLY appreciated.
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Old 09-03-2010, 10:21 AM   #2
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First I have to ask why you have not considered a plasma since your uses would seem ideal for plasma?

For 120Hz displays it is ALWAYS at 120Hz. Not sure but maybe a Sony owner can answer better or correct me if I am wrong, but I believe if you turn off motion flow that should get rid of the Soap Opera Effect. You will still possibly have some motion issues as this is normal with LCDs which are about 2,000x slower with pixel response (time for a pixel to change state/color) compared to plasmas, but some notice this more than others.

At a 10' distance you would likely want a 54-58' display to fully see the 1080p resolution at that distance. Will people be sitting at various angles? If so this is an area where LCDs is still much weaker than plasmas as well. People sitting at angles will not see as good a picture as those in the center position. Some Sony LCDs actually have been known to get a bluish tinge in the picture when you move off angle. I cannot remember if this model you are looking at does this though.

Hope this helps!
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Old 09-03-2010, 11:51 AM   #3
How can anyone watch standard def?
 

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Originally Posted by PFC5 View Post
First I have to ask why you have not considered a plasma since your uses would seem ideal for plasma?

For 120Hz displays it is ALWAYS at 120Hz. Not sure but maybe a Sony owner can answer better or correct me if I am wrong, but I believe if you turn off motion flow that should get rid of the Soap Opera Effect. You will still possibly have some motion issues as this is normal with LCDs which are about 2,000x slower with pixel response (time for a pixel to change state/color) compared to plasmas, but some notice this more than others.

At a 10' distance you would likely want a 54-58' display to fully see the 1080p resolution at that distance. Will people be sitting at various angles? If so this is an area where LCDs is still much weaker than plasmas as well. People sitting at angles will not see as good a picture as those in the center position. Some Sony LCDs actually have been known to get a bluish tinge in the picture when you move off angle. I cannot remember if this model you are looking at does this though.

Hope this helps!
I have considered getting a plasma (Panasonic TC-P42S2). It was my first choice , honestly. After 3 trips to Best Buy tweaking each display (much to the dismay of the employees I'm sure). Going through every setting on each set. I came to the realization that I liked the Sony better. I thought the Panasonic looked awful. Greenish gray tint to it.
Now, I know what you're thinking. No one's home will EVER be that bright. Well a friend of mine has an LG plasma (50") and at his house I thought the same thing. Looked washed out, greyish tint to it. No real detail. (He btw is a video engineer so it's been tweaked).

I even brought him to Best Buy with me and HE was saying to buy the Sony. My concern was/is, I love to watch movies and I don't want any artificial looks or such on my screen.

A 54" display or larger is WAAAAY out of the question. I just don't have the space/room for such a thing.

No one will be sitting off to the sides in my living room. I have a 8' couch directly opposite the entertainment center . So angle isn't an issue.

As far as Motionflow/CineMotion goes, I down loaded the manual and it tells you nothing about them.

If there are any Sony Bravia owners out there I would appreciate your input on this.
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Old 09-03-2010, 12:36 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kodos3000 View Post
I have considered getting a plasma (Panasonic TC-P42S2). It was my first choice , honestly. After 3 trips to Best Buy tweaking each display (much to the dismay of the employees I'm sure). Going through every setting on each set. I came to the realization that I liked the Sony better. I thought the Panasonic looked awful. Greenish gray tint to it.
Now, I know what you're thinking. No one's home will EVER be that bright. Well a friend of mine has an LG plasma (50") and at his house I thought the same thing. Looked washed out, greyish tint to it. No real detail. (He btw is a video engineer so it's been tweaked).

I even brought him to Best Buy with me and HE was saying to buy the Sony. My concern was/is, I love to watch movies and I don't want any artificial looks or such on my screen.

A 54" display or larger is WAAAAY out of the question. I just don't have the space/room for such a thing.

No one will be sitting off to the sides in my living room. I have a 8' couch directly opposite the entertainment center . So angle isn't an issue.

As far as Motionflow/CineMotion goes, I down loaded the manual and it tells you nothing about them.

If there are any Sony Bravia owners out there I would appreciate your input on this.
Quote:
Motionflow
Enhances the smoothness of picture movement and to reduce blur

High.........Provides smoother picture movement for film based content

Standard..Provides smooth picture movement. Use this setting for standard use.

Off...........Use this setting when the High and Standard settings result in video artifacts such as ghosting.


Cinemotion
Automatically detects film based content and applies an inverse 3-2 pull-down process and a motion estimation engine to improve film content and de-interlacing performance.

Auto 1..Applies an inverse 3-2 pull-down along with mostion estimation to obtain the smoothest picture quality and reduces artifacts of moving images. Select for Standard use.

Auto 2..Applies only the inverse 3-2 pull-down process. Picture movement will be similar to original film.

Off........Turns off Cinemotion.
- Sony Reference Book
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Old 09-03-2010, 03:33 PM   #5
How can anyone watch standard def?
 

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Thank you dsskid,

a few questions, if you don't mind.

1: are you a Bravia owner? If so what settings do you use ?

2: If I understand correctly, If I set Auto 2 with motionflow off this will give me the original picture with no additives ( so to speak ) and eliminate the "soap opera effect"?
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Old 09-03-2010, 06:09 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kodos3000 View Post
Thank you dsskid,

a few questions, if you don't mind.

1: are you a Bravia owner? If so what settings do you use ?

2: If I understand correctly, If I set Auto 2 with motionflow off this will give me the original picture with no additives ( so to speak ) and eliminate the "soap opera effect"?
You're very welcome.
Yes, I own a KDL-46Z5100.
I utilize Auto 2 for Motionflow, and Standard for Cinemotion. I find that this combination seems to minimize the soap opera effect, and works best for my display.
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Professional reviews of displays are an excellent tool, but the final decision should come from using your own eyes.




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