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Horizontal Lines & Ghosting on Samsung LN-T4661F

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Old 04-22-2010, 08:21 AM   #1
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Default Horizontal Lines & Ghosting on Samsung LN-T4661F

Regarding a 2 year old Samsung LN-T4661F 46" LCD TV:
Starting a couple of weeks ago, three horizontal lines dividing the screen into four equal bands appear when the TV is turned on. The lines are barely visible on the left side of the screen and become more defined to the right. Along with the lines there is also ghosting that becomes more pronounced from left to right. This used to last only a minute or two at startup, but has now progressed to 15 minutes before the lines and ghosting disappear. Once they disappear, the picture is perfect. If the TV is left off for a couple of hours the lines will return.

Any ideas?
Thanks
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Old 04-22-2010, 01:31 PM   #2
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As a guess it is likely a video processing board issue. Not sure which one though.
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Old 05-13-2010, 12:22 PM   #3
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Horizontal Lines Through Display

Issue seems to be a problem on more than one occasion.
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Old 02-27-2011, 02:03 PM   #4
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Default Tab Bonding Issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cavette View Post
Regarding a 2 year old Samsung LN-T4661F 46" LCD TV:
Starting a couple of weeks ago, three horizontal lines dividing the screen into four equal bands appear when the TV is turned on. The lines are barely visible on the left side of the screen and become more defined to the right. Along with the lines there is also ghosting that becomes more pronounced from left to right. This used to last only a minute or two at startup, but has now progressed to 15 minutes before the lines and ghosting disappear. Once they disappear, the picture is perfect. If the TV is left off for a couple of hours the lines will return.

Any ideas?
Thanks
I too have had this problem with the very same model, it is most often improperly diagnosed as a t-con board issue by most who just want to provide an answer for the sake of there own ego at various forums. This is a manufacturing defect. I have been dealing with Samsung for over a month now and have been offered a replacement model of lesser quality(LN40C650L1F) at a prorated cost of $300.00 to me which I have not accepted as of yet. My TV began having this issue almost exactly 1 year beyond warranty period. Typically it will only happen when TV is cold(if temp in room falls to approx. 68 deg or lower). When cold due to naturally occurring shrinkage as with anything, the tab bonding contacts to the screen are broken and therefore gives you 3 thin horizontal lines across separating the screen into four quadrants vertically and blurry details of everything including channel info, menu info, etc. It goes away after several minutes of warm up time, as the unit warms up expansion of the panel resumes and contact through the defective tab bond is made and picture is back to normal. A quick test to determine this is if you gently squeeze the bezel(frame) around the panel at the top left corner approx. 2 to 4 inches from the corner(this is where the defective tab is located for this particular problem) the problem will go away until the unit is turned off and has ample time to cool off again. When you squeeze you are effectively forcing the tab bonding back together and contact again is made. Another way to diagnose would be to turn your thermostat in house up above 72 degrees or so and wait a few hours for the TV to acclimate to the temp(expand) .This is why if left alone for a few minutes to warm up the problem disappears. Consequently people who keep there homes on the warm side, say above 70 deg. don't often see this problem, but the more heat-cool cycles the units go through the more likely this problem will rear up its ugly head.I believe this defect will pop up eventually on all samsungs produced with the same tab bonding method or materials that were used for however long they were manufactured that way. Naturally everything moves(expands and contracts) through heat-cool cycles but proper engineering methods or materials should prevent something like this from happening for at least, lets say 10 years, the average life expectancy one would expect to get out of a $1500.00 or more purchase depending on screen size. Common sense would dictate larger screens would be more prone to this problem due to more movement and smaller less prone. Unfortunately there are numerous tab bonds all across the top of the screen(panel) and different ones affect different functions of the operation of the set, therefore there may be many other various problems people may be experiencing with there samsungs due to a failure of one of these tab bonds. They are often erroneously diagnosed as circuit board failures due to laziness on the part of the tech. I would recommend to anyone experiencing intermittent or any problems to gently squeeze all along the top of the bezel to locate a defective tab bond. As for dealing with Samsung, all I can say is good luck, it is difficult to reach their corporate office and even more difficult to get a resolution. I would gladly join in any class action lawsuit if brought about as the one regarding their capacitor issue disappeared once they sought to start addressing the issue and this was only after an absurd amount of complaints to the NJ BBB and consumer affairs websites. I think they realize that they have a huge problem with most models manufactured in the last 3-4 years(primarily due to using cheaper components as a cost reduction/profit boosting solution) and as with any large corp., are not willing to issue any recall as it is cheaper to just deal with angry customers on a case by case basis, very unfortunate for them as their sales will suffer terribly because most people research on the web before making major purchases in today,s world and thank god for that.
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Old 04-29-2011, 02:15 PM   #5
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Default Definitely a bad panel

Quote:
Originally Posted by standup4uright View Post
A quick test to determine this is if you gently squeeze the bezel(frame) around the panel at the top left corner approx. 2 to 4 inches from the corner(this is where the defective tab is located for this particular problem) the problem will go away until the unit is turned off and has ample time to cool off again.

Yes, definitely an LCD screen manufacturing defect. The screen on my 2 year old 52" Samsung LCD TV started having image problems on ALL inputs... When turned on, the video was segmented (3 faint horizontal lines) with a much darker area near the center of the screen. Most times the display would show one of the following: serious ghosting, clouding/hasing, poor refresh, image retention, or double-image in vertical direction (vertical and stretched vertical) on the left hand side.

As noted above by "standup4uright", if the TV is still assembled, squeezing the bezel front-to-back at the top of the LCD can fix or show the problem although if the TV is disassembled you can squeeze the metal bezel top-to-bottom instead.

With the back off the TV, to locate the fault I GENTLY pushed a plastic credit card (read: INSULATING) into the slit between the metal frames at the top of the LCD. It corrected or distorted the image each time (specifically top right, viewed from rear). This had the same effect as squeezing the bezel at the top of the LCD, but a little more specific by applying pressure to the hidden wafer circuit boards.

This is how I fixed my problem:

As viewed from the rear: Tcon = top center, power supply = bottom center, IR button panel = lower left, AV signal board = lower right.

You can do these in whatever order you prefer, but this is generally how to do it:

1) Remove base.
2) Remove back of TV.
3) Remove bottom speakers.
4) Remove metallic shielding "tape" at top of the t-con shield (DO NOT REMOVE T-CONN BOARD).
5) Detach connector at bottom left for the capacitive touch button panel.
6) Remove IR circuit board and long cable to AV signal board (you can re-attach later to turn on or test the tv).
7) Remove plastic decorative bezel from front of TV (several silver screws).
8) Lay the TV on it's back (the 4 wall mounting stand-offs were perfect to keep the TV flat on my large table...).
9) Completely disassemble the TV screen by removing the front metal LCD frame (just a bunch of phillips screws).

This exposes the wafer thin printed circuit boards at the top of the screen to which 16 individual LCD screen traces are bonded...

One or more of these lcd ribbon-cable-to-circuit-board connections has become detached (most likely the top left viewed from front)...Since these cannot be soldered by conventional means, we can "repair" the TV by applying constant pressure to keep the connection "bonded". Since there is about 3/8" space between the metal bezel and the printed circuit boards, I cut foam pieces to apply the pressure. The foam should retain their flexibility even with the relatively high heat from the screen backlight...

10) Cut 16 FOAM pieces (approx 1/2" x 1/2" x 2") from weatherstripping FOAM (or water pipe insulating FOAM if you have).
11) Cut 16 double-sided tape (1/2" x 2") and affix to one side of each foam piece.
12) Place each of the 16 sticky foam pieces on top of the printed circuit boards where the LCD traces are bonded together.
13) Re-assemble the metal frame to the LCD (from the top first, to squish the foam pieces and then apply downward pressure to fit at the bottom).
14) Replace all the screws for the metal frame.
15) Re-attach the IR button panel cable, plastic decorative bezel, speakers, and anything else you removed.
16) Test TV.

Remember, the foam pieces apply downward pressure to the LCD_ribbon_cable/LCD_circuit_board "bonded" junctions. Without it, any of the bonded connections can fail since they are ALL subjected to their own mechanical stresses right from day one at the factory (they are installed with a slight curve that puts a slight force on the bond)

In truth, you don't need to install all 16 foam pieces... On my TV, only the one leftmost bonded connection was intermittent (viewed from the front) but I installed all 16 of them in case more of them fail. Also, you don't even need double-sided tape but it sure does make the job easier if the foamies stay where you put them...

With the right tools and patience, this job can be accomplished in less than 2 hours practically for free.

My TV seems to be working properly for now... Sure beats having a broken TV, or spending lots of money on repairs or a new TV.

Good luck with your repairs. Post back with your success stories...
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Old 07-27-2011, 06:03 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unspun01 View Post
Yes, definitely an LCD screen manufacturing defect. The screen on my 2 year old 52" Samsung LCD TV started having image problems on ALL inputs... When turned on, the video was segmented (3 faint horizontal lines) with a much darker area near the center of the screen. Most times the display would show one of the following: serious ghosting, clouding/hasing, poor refresh, image retention, or double-image in vertical direction (vertical and stretched vertical) on the left hand side.

As noted above by "standup4uright", if the TV is still assembled, squeezing the bezel front-to-back at the top of the LCD can fix or show the problem although if the TV is disassembled you can squeeze the metal bezel top-to-bottom instead.

With the back off the TV, to locate the fault I GENTLY pushed a plastic credit card (read: INSULATING) into the slit between the metal frames at the top of the LCD. It corrected or distorted the image each time (specifically top right, viewed from rear). This had the same effect as squeezing the bezel at the top of the LCD, but a little more specific by applying pressure to the hidden wafer circuit boards.

This is how I fixed my problem:

As viewed from the rear: Tcon = top center, power supply = bottom center, IR button panel = lower left, AV signal board = lower right.

You can do these in whatever order you prefer, but this is generally how to do it:

1) Remove base.
2) Remove back of TV.
3) Remove bottom speakers.
4) Remove metallic shielding "tape" at top of the t-con shield (DO NOT REMOVE T-CONN BOARD).
5) Detach connector at bottom left for the capacitive touch button panel.
6) Remove IR circuit board and long cable to AV signal board (you can re-attach later to turn on or test the tv).
7) Remove plastic decorative bezel from front of TV (several silver screws).
8) Lay the TV on it's back (the 4 wall mounting stand-offs were perfect to keep the TV flat on my large table...).
9) Completely disassemble the TV screen by removing the front metal LCD frame (just a bunch of phillips screws).

This exposes the wafer thin printed circuit boards at the top of the screen to which 16 individual LCD screen traces are bonded...

One or more of these lcd ribbon-cable-to-circuit-board connections has become detached (most likely the top left viewed from front)...Since these cannot be soldered by conventional means, we can "repair" the TV by applying constant pressure to keep the connection "bonded". Since there is about 3/8" space between the metal bezel and the printed circuit boards, I cut foam pieces to apply the pressure. The foam should retain their flexibility even with the relatively high heat from the screen backlight...

10) Cut 16 FOAM pieces (approx 1/2" x 1/2" x 2") from weatherstripping FOAM (or water pipe insulating FOAM if you have).
11) Cut 16 double-sided tape (1/2" x 2") and affix to one side of each foam piece.
12) Place each of the 16 sticky foam pieces on top of the printed circuit boards where the LCD traces are bonded together.
13) Re-assemble the metal frame to the LCD (from the top first, to squish the foam pieces and then apply downward pressure to fit at the bottom).
14) Replace all the screws for the metal frame.
15) Re-attach the IR button panel cable, plastic decorative bezel, speakers, and anything else you removed.
16) Test TV.

Remember, the foam pieces apply downward pressure to the LCD_ribbon_cable/LCD_circuit_board "bonded" junctions. Without it, any of the bonded connections can fail since they are ALL subjected to their own mechanical stresses right from day one at the factory (they are installed with a slight curve that puts a slight force on the bond)

In truth, you don't need to install all 16 foam pieces... On my TV, only the one leftmost bonded connection was intermittent (viewed from the front) but I installed all 16 of them in case more of them fail. Also, you don't even need double-sided tape but it sure does make the job easier if the foamies stay where you put them...

With the right tools and patience, this job can be accomplished in less than 2 hours practically for free.

My TV seems to be working properly for now... Sure beats having a broken TV, or spending lots of money on repairs or a new TV.

Good luck with your repairs. Post back with your success stories...
My Samsung 40LCD TV was having problems with 3 horizonal lines going across the screen and dividing the screen into 4 equal sections. It happend mostly when it was cold, but would flicker in and out when the TV was warmed up.
So I used the method describe above - I also added the foam tape to the sensors on the sides. It worked great!!! Thanks a ton for the advice - the internet really can be useful sometimes - I let you know in a few days if the foam catches on fire from the heat
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Old 12-31-2011, 03:53 PM   #7
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This worked like a charm for my 3 year old Samsung LN46A650! Easy to do if you follow the step by step instructions.
At first the lines and strange ghosting would last a few minutes and then disappear, then the time it was weird got longer and longer over 6 months. I was up to 35 minutes yesterday. I was about to pick up a new TV on the after Christmas sales but now I don't need to.

I love the picture on this TV!

Thanks very much for the great fix!
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Old 01-03-2012, 06:25 PM   #8
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A great big thank you to all the posters in this thread. I have been afflicted with this problem as well with my two year old LN52A650. I was getting very frustrated as the "warm up" time had progressed to 20 minutes or so. I finally found this thread and on new years day decided to dig in and see if I could fix it. 2 1/2 hours later and a $1.99 investment in water pipe insulation, the job was done. It has been 100% on every power up since. Thanks again! Ken
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Old 01-11-2012, 11:31 PM   #9
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Default What gives Samsung?

I am pretty sure I have the same TAB problem discussed here and on other forums. Half my screen will be 'darkened' when I first turn on the TV and is taking longer and longer to warm up. This only started after we moved to our new house on Dec 1 of last year. This house is a little cooler (we live in Canada and the house is older less insulated) than our previous house and never experienced this until the move.

Does anyone think this could be because of the move (inadvertent knock to the TV during transit) or do you think it is because of the manufacturer defect.

I must say this is pretty lame of Samsung to not catch this or fix as it seems these kinda issues could have been resolved with them applying this foam during manufacturing.

Thanks so much for this post, hopefully it saves me a repair bill! If this works I think we all owe unspun01 a beer!!
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Old 01-14-2012, 04:04 PM   #10
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I have a 17" long x 2 pixel wide horizontal line starting from the right side of the screen progressing to the left. The thin line starts about 3.5" above the bottom of the screen. The line color is black against color or white against black.

Anyone with this same problem? I have a samsung LNT4061FX/XAA
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Old 02-26-2012, 01:23 AM   #11
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I went through the steps (couldn't be clearer by the way) but it still did not work. I still have the lines even though I applied the foam. I did notice that there were four tabs going down the sides, but they did not seem to be bonded to any sort of circuit. Should I try it again and also apply an extra eight strips (four on each side)?

Should I just buy a Sony? :P
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Old 03-03-2012, 09:13 PM   #12
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I can confirm that unspun01's fix worked for my LN-T4661F. Thanks! The left side of my screen would be dark, segmented, and ghosted until the TV warmed up for about 1/2 hour. On my 46" TV, there was only about 1/8" clearance between the ribbon cable and the metal frame around the panel. I used double stick foam tape to apply pressure to the ribbon cable.

Attached is a photo of the top of the TV with the tape applied and a close up of one of the ribbon cables.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Tape.jpg (100.8 KB, 689 views)
File Type: jpg Tape1.jpg (77.6 KB, 661 views)
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Old 03-23-2012, 05:18 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unspun01 View Post
Yes, definitely an LCD screen manufacturing defect. The screen on my 2 year old 52" Samsung LCD TV started having image problems on ALL inputs... When turned on, the video was segmented (3 faint horizontal lines) with a much darker area near the center of the screen. Most times the display would show one of the following: serious ghosting, clouding/hasing, poor refresh, image retention, or double-image in vertical direction (vertical and stretched vertical) on the left hand side.

As noted above by "standup4uright", if the TV is still assembled, squeezing the bezel front-to-back at the top of the LCD can fix or show the problem although if the TV is disassembled you can squeeze the metal bezel top-to-bottom instead.

With the back off the TV, to locate the fault I GENTLY pushed a plastic credit card (read: INSULATING) into the slit between the metal frames at the top of the LCD. It corrected or distorted the image each time (specifically top right, viewed from rear). This had the same effect as squeezing the bezel at the top of the LCD, but a little more specific by applying pressure to the hidden wafer circuit boards.

This is how I fixed my problem:

As viewed from the rear: Tcon = top center, power supply = bottom center, IR button panel = lower left, AV signal board = lower right.

You can do these in whatever order you prefer, but this is generally how to do it:

1) Remove base.
2) Remove back of TV.
3) Remove bottom speakers.
4) Remove metallic shielding "tape" at top of the t-con shield (DO NOT REMOVE T-CONN BOARD).
5) Detach connector at bottom left for the capacitive touch button panel.
6) Remove IR circuit board and long cable to AV signal board (you can re-attach later to turn on or test the tv).
7) Remove plastic decorative bezel from front of TV (several silver screws).
8) Lay the TV on it's back (the 4 wall mounting stand-offs were perfect to keep the TV flat on my large table...).
9) Completely disassemble the TV screen by removing the front metal LCD frame (just a bunch of phillips screws).

This exposes the wafer thin printed circuit boards at the top of the screen to which 16 individual LCD screen traces are bonded...

One or more of these lcd ribbon-cable-to-circuit-board connections has become detached (most likely the top left viewed from front)...Since these cannot be soldered by conventional means, we can "repair" the TV by applying constant pressure to keep the connection "bonded". Since there is about 3/8" space between the metal bezel and the printed circuit boards, I cut foam pieces to apply the pressure. The foam should retain their flexibility even with the relatively high heat from the screen backlight...

10) Cut 16 FOAM pieces (approx 1/2" x 1/2" x 2") from weatherstripping FOAM (or water pipe insulating FOAM if you have).
11) Cut 16 double-sided tape (1/2" x 2") and affix to one side of each foam piece.
12) Place each of the 16 sticky foam pieces on top of the printed circuit boards where the LCD traces are bonded together.
13) Re-assemble the metal frame to the LCD (from the top first, to squish the foam pieces and then apply downward pressure to fit at the bottom).
14) Replace all the screws for the metal frame.
15) Re-attach the IR button panel cable, plastic decorative bezel, speakers, and anything else you removed.
16) Test TV.

Remember, the foam pieces apply downward pressure to the LCD_ribbon_cable/LCD_circuit_board "bonded" junctions. Without it, any of the bonded connections can fail since they are ALL subjected to their own mechanical stresses right from day one at the factory (they are installed with a slight curve that puts a slight force on the bond)

In truth, you don't need to install all 16 foam pieces... On my TV, only the one leftmost bonded connection was intermittent (viewed from the front) but I installed all 16 of them in case more of them fail. Also, you don't even need double-sided tape but it sure does make the job easier if the foamies stay where you put them...

With the right tools and patience, this job can be accomplished in less than 2 hours practically for free.

My TV seems to be working properly for now... Sure beats having a broken TV, or spending lots of money on repairs or a new TV.

Good luck with your repairs. Post back with your success stories...
Well i thankyou,how great is the internet!!

i have the Samsung LE40A6561A(SERIES 6)
i have disconected the power & inputs,undone the 19 screws whilst the tv was upright,take the back off,then on the top left there were two ribbon connectors,one horizontal,one vertical overlapping,i have used a strong tape to secure these down & after two weeks of constant horizontal lines...hey presto... they have gone
the back is still off the tv as i have only just repaired it & the lines came back faint once & a little tap sent them packing so may need further tampering(bodging)
What i have noticed is the very top left of the bezel , when pressed in the lines appear,so i might not bother putting the screw back there & will prob screw the back on as i have the tv turned on-will have to disconect briefly to do this
cannot believe some sticky tape has cured this problem...the roll only cost 59p & ive used approx 0.2% of it,so samsung could of saved a lot of trouble for approx 0.1p
I hope this helps somebody out there & i will update on progress
happy viewing
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Old 04-04-2012, 09:03 AM   #14
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update... the tape:-although it works, when the tv warms up the tape expands so the strips slightly come away from the back of the tv leaving the equal lines again,since ive still got the back cover from the tv off i just rub over the tape i secured the strips with & the lines go again,i will have to look into packing the gap between the back cover & the strips with something more permanent than tape...
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:06 PM   #15
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Default tab bond fix

Thank you all very much, I was about to throw my 40" Samsung away when I found your detailed fix, I followed your simple clear instructions and the TV is a good as new!
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