HDTV with very large screens

mstar · 04-25-2005, 04:37 PM

I am totally amazed by the quality of HDTV.
I am using a sanyo Z3 LCD HD projector. so my picture is 2.80 meters wide. And that's where HDTV really shines, I have friends with regular CRT HDTV, so much smaller. Although very beautiful, it's really with a very big screen that HDTV is awesome.

from expressvu I use 1080i which is better for most channels. however, the 6100 receiver's built in scaler is not very good. So when the source is 720p (for instance with ABC HD), I switch the receiver to that mode. it makes a real difference when the screen is that big (otherwise picture is a bit blurred).

anyway, I knew I would love HDTV, but this is much better than I expected actually.

I can't wait for expressvu to deliver a PVR for HD material. it's really frustrating when I visit a videotron friend with his HD PVR !!
I already have an expressvu PVR but for SD TV obviously. Can't wait. well, I'll have to anyway..

rockhard · 04-30-2005, 09:40 AM

You state you have a screen that is 2.80 meteres wide which equates to 9 feet . If that is true then you must be seeing a fairly dim picture and noticeable SDE ( screen door effect ) due to the 800 ANSI lumens and 720P resolution .

I owned a Z2 model and the biggest recomended screen was 92" diag or 6.5 feet wide in a blacked out light controlled basement .
You could try a hi-gain Da-Lite screen with a gain of 3.0 to go mabey to a 100" but still have SDE at optimum seating distance of 1.5 times screen width .

I traded my Z2 for a 1200 ANSI lumens Hitachi TX-100 displayed on a 110" diag Da-Lite HCCV ( hi-contrast cine vision ) screen .

I am waiting for the next gen EPSON 1080P D5 LCD panels to come this fall . The higher resolution of 1080P fill factor will allow bigger picture with virtually no SDE . The newer panels will have much improved CR ( contrast ratio ) around 9000:1 with use of dynamic iris control . This will also allow a seating position ratio much closer at 1.25 times screen width thereby putting you in the optimum optical range of your eyes for maximum preception of the full 1080P resolution .

http://www.epson.co.jp/e/newsroom/news_2004_10_18.htm

mstar · 05-01-2005, 07:21 AM

Rockhard, my screen is exactly 110 inches wide, in 16/9 ratio obviously. The picture is not dim at all, of course I use a dedicated room totally dark. I use even the lamp eco mode.
Sure, the picture could stand to be brighter, that's a fact. However, I want the very big screen experience. And the only problem I have with that size is when I watch non HD material. upscaled to that size, SDTV is pretty ugly. Still I like that better than watching a small TV, but I admit you get a blurred contrastless picture in SDTV.

In HDTV, it's fantastic and I stand by my comment.
No screendoor effect with Z3 in that size by the way.

I am totally with you on the contrast issue. I used to have a Barco CRT projector. LCD looks so washed out in comparison. My Barco was too old and could not handle HDTV, but I miss its contrast.

1080p panels will be a great improvement if they increase contrast above 5000:1. Of course, I'd take whatever above that, 10000:1 or more would be really great. I like the way you think when it comes to these new panels and seating setup.

bigcat · 05-01-2005, 06:39 PM

mstar,

I have the 6100 as well. I've had it for few days only. Is there a way to know the picture source format? whether it is 480, 720 or 1081? It seems you can only configure the receiver for one fixed setting, so I have it set at 1081i, but I'd dont like the upconversion either. The D* HD receiver has something called "Native" to show the pic using original resolution.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mstar

from expressvu I use 1080i which is better for most channels. however, the 6100 receiver's built in scaler is not very good. So when the source is 720p (for instance with ABC HD), I switch the receiver to that mode. it makes a real difference when the screen is that big (otherwise picture is a bit blurred).

mstar · 05-03-2005, 03:45 PM

I could not find anyway to get this information..
really a pity. I hope they upgrade their software at one point to display the source's resolution. and I also wish for an easier way to switch between modes.
if only there was a mode to display 'native' as you put it. would be great. our projectors could easily switch. I realize many HD users have CRT and maybe they don't switch that easily.

I have no idea where to make suggestions to bell.. but if noone does it, well, we can't blame them either..

mfabien · 05-04-2005, 04:37 AM

Mstar,

There seems to be a contradiction between your opening post and # 5. You first stated that you could switch from 1080i to 720p in # 1 and in # 5 you say: "I could not find anyway to get this information..
really a pity. I hope they upgrade their software at one point to display the source's resolution. and I also wish for an easier way to switch between modes.
if only there was a mode to display 'native' as you put it. would be great."

I had the BEV 6000HD (EchoStar) receiver at one time and don't recall that the unit could upconvert or downconvert the format. I can do that with my cable DVR but it serves no purpose because an HDTV, and I suspect an HD projector, has the ability to convert to it's native resolution more efficiently.

My favorite setting for Picture Format, with my the cable DVR, is "Pass-Through" which automatically changes the DVR format to the format transmitted: 720p, for PBS, ABC and FOX and to 1080i for the others. If I select a SD channel, it changes the DVR format to 480i. For HD, my CRT RPTV displays 1080i and for SD 480i. If I press the "Stretch or Zoom" button on the remote, I get a momentary tag on the screen which tells me what format is being transmitted.

In passing, in April 2004 I didn't wait for BEV to introduce their announced DVR (Dish 921), said to come for July 2004, instead I switched to Videotron cable at that moment and purchased the SA8000HD and been happy ever since. And I often read posts from BEV users who are hopping to get a DVR...one day!...one year later.

mstar · 05-04-2005, 10:32 AM

mfabien, it seems I was not clear enough.

with the 6100HD, you can switch the output mode from 1080i, 720p or 480p (in HD mode).
it takes several clicks on the remote though, and I am complaining about that.

what the unit does not tell you is the source's mode (1080i or 720p). so I have to guess or know by default (ABC and Fox are always 720p as far as I know). So depending on the channel, I manually switch.

the 6100HD can upconvert (or downconvert) on its own : 720p to 1080i for instance. BUT this process is not handled well by the 6100HD. My Z3 projector is much better when downconverting 1080i to 720p than bell's unit (Z3 can only display 720p !).
another way to say it : the 6100HD does not pass through. you must select one mode (1080i, 720p or 480p). that's a pity since it's internal scaler is below average.

yes, I am in the lot, I wish I could get a DVR. my brother in law has one HD DVR (well I do have a SD DVR). it's great. maybe one day and we will have to pay a lot for it I bet.
I am a long time videotron's user, but now in the country, my only option is sat tv, no cable provider here

can't have it all.

mfabien · 05-04-2005, 01:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mstar

mfabien, it seems I was not clear enough.

with the 6100HD, you can switch the output mode from 1080i, 720p or 480p (in HD mode).
it takes several clicks on the remote though, and I am complaining about that.
...

If your receiver upconverts 480i into 480p, it is still SD. Of course EDTV displays in 480p, and I do have a small Sharp Aquos set, but that is not HD.

mstar · 05-05-2005, 06:03 AM

mfabien, I was not talking about upconvert but downconvert.
the HD Mode has 3 output selections I mentioned : 1080i, 720p and 480p.
I am using a Z3 HD projector and I select 1080i or 720p depending on the program because the 6100 is not passthrough.
----------------
Sanyo Z3 HD projector, Bell 6100HD, 110" wide screen

04-25-2005, 04:37 PM	#1
mstar HD rules. Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 15	HDTV with very large screens I am totally amazed by the quality of HDTV. I am using a sanyo Z3 LCD HD projector. so my picture is 2.80 meters wide. And that's where HDTV really shines, I have friends with regular CRT HDTV, so much smaller. Although very beautiful, it's really with a very big screen that HDTV is awesome. from expressvu I use 1080i which is better for most channels. however, the 6100 receiver's built in scaler is not very good. So when the source is 720p (for instance with ABC HD), I switch the receiver to that mode. it makes a real difference when the screen is that big (otherwise picture is a bit blurred). anyway, I knew I would love HDTV, but this is much better than I expected actually. I can't wait for expressvu to deliver a PVR for HD material. it's really frustrating when I visit a videotron friend with his HD PVR !! I already have an expressvu PVR but for SD TV obviously. Can't wait. well, I'll have to anyway..

04-30-2005, 09:40 AM	#2
rockhard REAL HDTV is 1080P Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Great White North Posts: 69	Sanyo Z3 HDTV You state you have a screen that is 2.80 meteres wide which equates to 9 feet . If that is true then you must be seeing a fairly dim picture and noticeable SDE ( screen door effect ) due to the 800 ANSI lumens and 720P resolution . I owned a Z2 model and the biggest recomended screen was 92" diag or 6.5 feet wide in a blacked out light controlled basement . You could try a hi-gain Da-Lite screen with a gain of 3.0 to go mabey to a 100" but still have SDE at optimum seating distance of 1.5 times screen width . I traded my Z2 for a 1200 ANSI lumens Hitachi TX-100 displayed on a 110" diag Da-Lite HCCV ( hi-contrast cine vision ) screen . I am waiting for the next gen EPSON 1080P D5 LCD panels to come this fall . The higher resolution of 1080P fill factor will allow bigger picture with virtually no SDE . The newer panels will have much improved CR ( contrast ratio ) around 9000:1 with use of dynamic iris control . This will also allow a seating position ratio much closer at 1.25 times screen width thereby putting you in the optimum optical range of your eyes for maximum preception of the full 1080P resolution . http://www.epson.co.jp/e/newsroom/news_2004_10_18.htm

05-04-2005, 04:37 AM	#6
mfabien High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Montreal Posts: 1,087	Mstar, There seems to be a contradiction between your opening post and # 5. You first stated that you could switch from 1080i to 720p in # 1 and in # 5 you say: "I could not find anyway to get this information.. really a pity. I hope they upgrade their software at one point to display the source's resolution. and I also wish for an easier way to switch between modes. if only there was a mode to display 'native' as you put it. would be great." I had the BEV 6000HD (EchoStar) receiver at one time and don't recall that the unit could upconvert or downconvert the format. I can do that with my cable DVR but it serves no purpose because an HDTV, and I suspect an HD projector, has the ability to convert to it's native resolution more efficiently. My favorite setting for Picture Format, with my the cable DVR, is "Pass-Through" which automatically changes the DVR format to the format transmitted: 720p, for PBS, ABC and FOX and to 1080i for the others. If I select a SD channel, it changes the DVR format to 480i. For HD, my CRT RPTV displays 1080i and for SD 480i. If I press the "Stretch or Zoom" button on the remote, I get a momentary tag on the screen which tells me what format is being transmitted. In passing, in April 2004 I didn't wait for BEV to introduce their announced DVR (Dish 921), said to come for July 2004, instead I switched to Videotron cable at that moment and purchased the SA8000HD and been happy ever since. And I often read posts from BEV users who are hopping to get a DVR...one day!...one year later. __________________ Samsung LN52B750, SA8300HD, Energy speakers, Yamaha RX-V540, SVS PB12-ISD, Harmony 880, HD-A1, BDP-1400, Oppo DV-970HD, Zektor HDS4.1 Last edited by mfabien; 05-04-2005 at 04:40 AM.

05-05-2005, 06:03 AM	#9
mstar HD rules. Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 15	mfabien, I was not talking about upconvert but downconvert. the HD Mode has 3 output selections I mentioned : 1080i, 720p and 480p. I am using a Z3 HD projector and I select 1080i or 720p depending on the program because the 6100 is not passthrough. ---------------- Sanyo Z3 HD projector, Bell 6100HD, 110" wide screen Last edited by mstar; 05-05-2005 at 06:07 AM.

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05-01-2005, 07:21 AM	#3
mstar HD rules. Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 15	Rockhard, my screen is exactly 110 inches wide, in 16/9 ratio obviously. The picture is not dim at all, of course I use a dedicated room totally dark. I use even the lamp eco mode. Sure, the picture could stand to be brighter, that's a fact. However, I want the very big screen experience. And the only problem I have with that size is when I watch non HD material. upscaled to that size, SDTV is pretty ugly. Still I like that better than watching a small TV, but I admit you get a blurred contrastless picture in SDTV. In HDTV, it's fantastic and I stand by my comment. No screendoor effect with Z3 in that size by the way. I am totally with you on the contrast issue. I used to have a Barco CRT projector. LCD looks so washed out in comparison. My Barco was too old and could not handle HDTV, but I miss its contrast. 1080p panels will be a great improvement if they increase contrast above 5000:1. Of course, I'd take whatever above that, 10000:1 or more would be really great. I like the way you think when it comes to these new panels and seating setup.

05-03-2005, 03:45 PM	#5
mstar HD rules. Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 15	I could not find anyway to get this information.. really a pity. I hope they upgrade their software at one point to display the source's resolution. and I also wish for an easier way to switch between modes. if only there was a mode to display 'native' as you put it. would be great. our projectors could easily switch. I realize many HD users have CRT and maybe they don't switch that easily. I have no idea where to make suggestions to bell.. but if noone does it, well, we can't blame them either..

05-04-2005, 10:32 AM	#7
mstar HD rules. Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 15	mfabien, it seems I was not clear enough. with the 6100HD, you can switch the output mode from 1080i, 720p or 480p (in HD mode). it takes several clicks on the remote though, and I am complaining about that. what the unit does not tell you is the source's mode (1080i or 720p). so I have to guess or know by default (ABC and Fox are always 720p as far as I know). So depending on the channel, I manually switch. the 6100HD can upconvert (or downconvert) on its own : 720p to 1080i for instance. BUT this process is not handled well by the 6100HD. My Z3 projector is much better when downconverting 1080i to 720p than bell's unit (Z3 can only display 720p !). another way to say it : the 6100HD does not pass through. you must select one mode (1080i, 720p or 480p). that's a pity since it's internal scaler is below average. yes, I am in the lot, I wish I could get a DVR. my brother in law has one HD DVR (well I do have a SD DVR). it's great. maybe one day and we will have to pay a lot for it I bet. I am a long time videotron's user, but now in the country, my only option is sat tv, no cable provider here can't have it all.