Frusterated with Star Choice

mike8855 · 05-20-2008, 09:18 AM

Hi
I am new to this forum and for that matter Satelite's in general.
However, I do have an Electronics Degree although removed from the active end of using it lately but ya sometimes I wonder how I have so much trouble piecing this altogether and I graduated with high honours? However, when it comes to star choice and the signals and how they are processed etc, and how and what causes the multiswithes to work appropriately, I have never been so frusterated in finding out information.

Ok first the problem that got me here...
I have had a couple of DSR 301's for years with not too much trouble although I should have known something was screwy when they came with DSR 400 Series manuals. Then one of them crapped out, Sat signal indicator kept going red all on its own blinking red /green non stop while the other Rx off the same single RG 6 line into the house from the 2-1 multiswitch was fine. The 2-1 multiswitch has both LNB 's A and B connected to the A and B inputs of course, but I was using only one RG 6 line into the house from which I split with proper RG 6 splitter to both RX's. ( this is called stacked?) So figured if one works the other doesn't must be Defective Rx right? - Ok no problem, get new one.
So picked up the new 505 figuring even though I am running CRT Sony Trinitron, one day when I get an HD TV, this High Def thing will come in handy, but at that point I didn't have an HD TV.
No problem, all is fine.
Getting a little closer to my problem now, I recently bought nice new Hitachi HD LCD TV, and tried to get it working.
All seems to work awsome, never saw a picture so nice. Went to check other RX, The old DSR 301, and low and behold found the red light off on the Sat signal indicator? Yes not working all of a sudden?
However stragely enough when I click on non HD channel on the 505 the 301 goes green and starts working ok?
Was told by star choice line coming into the house fine for two 301's but not for 505 and 301 and that the 505 needs its own RG line in from 2-1 multiswitch.
Ok brought in new line. Hooked it up. Low and behold same problem. In fact I think I couldn't even get both RX working together at all no matter what channel I was on. So I hooked it back on one RG line and split it again and its remains working but we can't see channels on 301 when 505 selects HD?
I even tried a new multiswitch with no luck?
Aside from hopefully finding a solution to getting this working, I would like to understand how the rx's select which LNB - as in how does that little multiswitch actually work anyways? Finding out how where Bin Laden is I think would be easier?
Is it possible the 505 and the 301 are just not compatible?
I am getting ready to use these crap motorola rx's as boat anchors! BTW their software runs so friggin slow, why is that? My brother in laws' Expressview is so much faster. When you change a channel it actually changes right away?
ANY IDEAS PLEASE HELP!
thank you
Thanks

bburke · 05-20-2008, 03:03 PM

what do you mean multiswitch?? Seems to me that my satellite has 4 female RG6 outlets on the dish. meanig you could run 4 seperate Rx's.

So why use a splitter at all? If you were trying to push an HD (huge bandwidth) and an SD (more bandwidth) signal through a single RG6 cable (before the spliter), it may be too much data! If the Rx's were hooked up to 2 different outputs the 2 Rx's should not affect on each other. In general, I would avoid any use of splitter. Cables are designed to be for 1 device generally, and unless you have proper amplification dont use them if you can.

It may have been the same problem with the 2 regular SD Rx's too?

Also, I would think that your speed would be increased with the reduced traffic.

Maybe your dish is different though- i got mine 2 months ago. but if it is the same, give it a shot, RG6 is cheap it will just be a pain running it if the splitter is inside.

Let me know how it turns out!

mike8855 · 05-21-2008, 12:27 PM

My system didn't come with a 4 port multi-switch only two. Meaning it has the LNB- A and LNB - B inputs then only TWO females RG6 outputs not 4 like yours.
However, it shouldn't matter if I only have two recievers anyways. I have already tried hooking them separately to the multi-switch with 2 completely different RG 6 cables runs to each RX.
Still doesn' work. As soon as the 505 HD Rx selects and HD channel and apparently somehow requests the multi- switch to switch the female RG6 output its connected to, to the LNB instead of LNB A, the other 301 Rx goes red and no signal is present.
To me it looks like a case of the Multi-switch not working correctly or this particular multi- switch is not compatible with the 505 Rx and the 301 Rx together. The other RG 6 female output should remain connected to LNB A but for some reason something is changing causeing it to lose its signal?
One would need to know how the Rx's works to request to the multi-switch to actually switch LNB's?

My guess is that the Rx outputs a Biase Dc voltage on the RG6 cable and depending on the Analog level of the Biase decides Which LNB, A or B is requested. The Rx downloaded map stored in mem, would check to see which LNB a particular channel is associated with and set the biase accordingly. Now its quite possible other technology's might be used other than a biase, such as pulse width modulation or Frequency shift Modulation but for the sake of argument lets say its a Dc biase onto the RG 6 that is detected in the multi-switch through a simple volatge divider, or similar, because the multi-switch to my knowledge (which is limited) is a passive device not an active one? It does not require any power to work and works off the power of the Rx and its Signal sent to it. Now the idea of a signal being sent, sound so sophisticated and all, and leads one to believe that is it digital but correct me if I am wrong but wouldn't it be just some simple circuit to make the switch?
The only thing I see wacked about my theory of trying to understand the multi-switch is this. In a stacked system where more than one Rx is connected to one RG 6 line, and assumingly one output of the multi-switch, how can each Rx view channels coming from different Satelites?
Which leads me to antother important step in understanding.
Does LNB A refer to Sat A and LNB B to B?

At this point I am guessing as to how the multi-switch actually works but the bottom line is I tried a new multiswitch , at least another 2 - 1 at the dish and it made no difference even with separate home runs to the Rx'?
I was even considering using both mutiswitches and splitting the LNB's to each.
Which leads me to the question can LNB outputs be spilt to feed more than one Multi-switch?
Also when you mentioned that with a independent line, and in theory more bandwidth for each Rx, that speed should increase. I agree that speed down the pipe could be faster, but how would that have anything to do with the speed in which the controlling software runs in the machine? I just think motorola builds crap quite honestly.
Agreed their usually rugged hardward but software and programig glitches are the norm it seems with Motorola.
Anyways still stumped?
I realize I have probable made this post extremely long and painful, but if you have read this far I think its fair to say you understand my level of frusteration and desire to know how it really works?

bburke · 05-21-2008, 05:21 PM

Well thats about as much help as I can give you I think, but good luck! I'm pretty sure that starchoice warrenties everything if you had it pro installed, maybe you could get a new dish out of it? Really its the last thing thats left to be changed! So before you start rerouting the multi switch maybe put in a phone call.

05-20-2008, 09:18 AM	#1
mike8855 What is HD? Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2	Frusterated with Star Choice Hi I am new to this forum and for that matter Satelite's in general. However, I do have an Electronics Degree although removed from the active end of using it lately but ya sometimes I wonder how I have so much trouble piecing this altogether and I graduated with high honours? However, when it comes to star choice and the signals and how they are processed etc, and how and what causes the multiswithes to work appropriately, I have never been so frusterated in finding out information. Ok first the problem that got me here... I have had a couple of DSR 301's for years with not too much trouble although I should have known something was screwy when they came with DSR 400 Series manuals. Then one of them crapped out, Sat signal indicator kept going red all on its own blinking red /green non stop while the other Rx off the same single RG 6 line into the house from the 2-1 multiswitch was fine. The 2-1 multiswitch has both LNB 's A and B connected to the A and B inputs of course, but I was using only one RG 6 line into the house from which I split with proper RG 6 splitter to both RX's. ( this is called stacked?) So figured if one works the other doesn't must be Defective Rx right? - Ok no problem, get new one. So picked up the new 505 figuring even though I am running CRT Sony Trinitron, one day when I get an HD TV, this High Def thing will come in handy, but at that point I didn't have an HD TV. No problem, all is fine. Getting a little closer to my problem now, I recently bought nice new Hitachi HD LCD TV, and tried to get it working. All seems to work awsome, never saw a picture so nice. Went to check other RX, The old DSR 301, and low and behold found the red light off on the Sat signal indicator? Yes not working all of a sudden? However stragely enough when I click on non HD channel on the 505 the 301 goes green and starts working ok? Was told by star choice line coming into the house fine for two 301's but not for 505 and 301 and that the 505 needs its own RG line in from 2-1 multiswitch. Ok brought in new line. Hooked it up. Low and behold same problem. In fact I think I couldn't even get both RX working together at all no matter what channel I was on. So I hooked it back on one RG line and split it again and its remains working but we can't see channels on 301 when 505 selects HD? I even tried a new multiswitch with no luck? Aside from hopefully finding a solution to getting this working, I would like to understand how the rx's select which LNB - as in how does that little multiswitch actually work anyways? Finding out how where Bin Laden is I think would be easier? Is it possible the 505 and the 301 are just not compatible? I am getting ready to use these crap motorola rx's as boat anchors! BTW their software runs so friggin slow, why is that? My brother in laws' Expressview is so much faster. When you change a channel it actually changes right away? ANY IDEAS PLEASE HELP! thank you Thanks

05-20-2008, 03:03 PM	#2
bburke My plasma is High Def. Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 8	what do you mean multiswitch?? Seems to me that my satellite has 4 female RG6 outlets on the dish. meanig you could run 4 seperate Rx's. So why use a splitter at all? If you were trying to push an HD (huge bandwidth) and an SD (more bandwidth) signal through a single RG6 cable (before the spliter), it may be too much data! If the Rx's were hooked up to 2 different outputs the 2 Rx's should not affect on each other. In general, I would avoid any use of splitter. Cables are designed to be for 1 device generally, and unless you have proper amplification dont use them if you can. It may have been the same problem with the 2 regular SD Rx's too? Also, I would think that your speed would be increased with the reduced traffic. Maybe your dish is different though- i got mine 2 months ago. but if it is the same, give it a shot, RG6 is cheap it will just be a pain running it if the splitter is inside. Let me know how it turns out! Last edited by bburke; 05-20-2008 at 03:07 PM. Reason: More info

05-21-2008, 12:27 PM	#3
mike8855 What is HD? Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2	Anyone techies out there that can explain how this really works? My system didn't come with a 4 port multi-switch only two. Meaning it has the LNB- A and LNB - B inputs then only TWO females RG6 outputs not 4 like yours. However, it shouldn't matter if I only have two recievers anyways. I have already tried hooking them separately to the multi-switch with 2 completely different RG 6 cables runs to each RX. Still doesn' work. As soon as the 505 HD Rx selects and HD channel and apparently somehow requests the multi- switch to switch the female RG6 output its connected to, to the LNB instead of LNB A, the other 301 Rx goes red and no signal is present. To me it looks like a case of the Multi-switch not working correctly or this particular multi- switch is not compatible with the 505 Rx and the 301 Rx together. The other RG 6 female output should remain connected to LNB A but for some reason something is changing causeing it to lose its signal? One would need to know how the Rx's works to request to the multi-switch to actually switch LNB's? My guess is that the Rx outputs a Biase Dc voltage on the RG6 cable and depending on the Analog level of the Biase decides Which LNB, A or B is requested. The Rx downloaded map stored in mem, would check to see which LNB a particular channel is associated with and set the biase accordingly. Now its quite possible other technology's might be used other than a biase, such as pulse width modulation or Frequency shift Modulation but for the sake of argument lets say its a Dc biase onto the RG 6 that is detected in the multi-switch through a simple volatge divider, or similar, because the multi-switch to my knowledge (which is limited) is a passive device not an active one? It does not require any power to work and works off the power of the Rx and its Signal sent to it. Now the idea of a signal being sent, sound so sophisticated and all, and leads one to believe that is it digital but correct me if I am wrong but wouldn't it be just some simple circuit to make the switch? The only thing I see wacked about my theory of trying to understand the multi-switch is this. In a stacked system where more than one Rx is connected to one RG 6 line, and assumingly one output of the multi-switch, how can each Rx view channels coming from different Satelites? Which leads me to antother important step in understanding. Does LNB A refer to Sat A and LNB B to B? At this point I am guessing as to how the multi-switch actually works but the bottom line is I tried a new multiswitch , at least another 2 - 1 at the dish and it made no difference even with separate home runs to the Rx'? I was even considering using both mutiswitches and splitting the LNB's to each. Which leads me to the question can LNB outputs be spilt to feed more than one Multi-switch? Also when you mentioned that with a independent line, and in theory more bandwidth for each Rx, that speed should increase. I agree that speed down the pipe could be faster, but how would that have anything to do with the speed in which the controlling software runs in the machine? I just think motorola builds crap quite honestly. Agreed their usually rugged hardward but software and programig glitches are the norm it seems with Motorola. Anyways still stumped? I realize I have probable made this post extremely long and painful, but if you have read this far I think its fair to say you understand my level of frusteration and desire to know how it really works?

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05-21-2008, 05:21 PM	#4
bburke My plasma is High Def. Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 8	Well thats about as much help as I can give you I think, but good luck! I'm pretty sure that starchoice warrenties everything if you had it pro installed, maybe you could get a new dish out of it? Really its the last thing thats left to be changed! So before you start rerouting the multi switch maybe put in a phone call.