High Def Forum - Your High Definition Community & High Definition Resource

Go Back   High Def Forum - Your High Definition Community & High Definition Resource > High Definition Programming Providers > Canadian Providers
Rules HDTV Forum Gallery LINK TO US! RSS - High Def Forum AddThis Feed Button AddThis Social Bookmark Button Groups

Canadian Providers Discuss and learn about Canadian High Definition Bell ExpressVu, Star Choice & Rogers Cable. RSS - Canadian Providers

Help! Shaw HD PVR Glitches

Reply
AddThis Social Bookmark Button
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-11-2005, 08:59 PM   #1
HD Rules!
 

Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 37
Default Help! Shaw HD PVR Glitches

I posted in the HD Lounge forum but I think it was the wrong place so I'm trying again to get help here.

I'm a long time Shaw customer in Winnipeg and have 3 standard boxes and 1 HD box. Last November I purchased the single tuner Motorola HD box from Shaw and love the increase in picture quality, both in HD and SD. But if I taped something in HD I couldn't fast forward through it or it would try to delete the program. Shaw said they knew about it - a software bug and they are working on it. 3 months later still not fixed. As well, on all types of channels the screen would suddenly go grey but the audio still worked. Turning off either the HD box or TV fixed it. Shaw had no answer.

Finally last week in frustration I made a fuss with Shaw and they agreed to replace the box with the new dual tuner model - for a small fee of course! This week I had one of the "specialists" here for 3 solid afternoons trying to get the box to work right. The picture would jump constantly, including the onscreen menus. The box would cycle itself off and on repeatedly for no reason. He checked signal strength, rebooted the box several times, and tried all manner of shenanigans to get things working.

In the end we found that by unhooking the DVI cable and using a component video hookup that things work OK. But the picture quality on all channels is certainly not as good. I have a 52" widescreen Hitachi TV and it shows every little grain and pixel without the DVI connection.

Best Buy is willing to give me a replacement DVI cable no sweat. It's a Monster DVI 400 cable and they have a lifetime warranty. But frankly I doubt that's the problem.

I read something about Firewire causing problems with the DVI cables and causing glitches. Is it possible this is the problem? And if it is, whose responsibility is it to fix the problem? The makers of the DVI cable or Shaw or Motorola?

I'm generally not unhappy with Shaw and their service has really been superior for me but I'm ticked that I've invested all this money in a HD setup that won't work.

Any help or suggestions would be GREATLY appreciated. Thx.
__________________
Life is short, eat your dessert first!
redito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2005, 09:32 AM   #2
don't mess with my HD
 
HDCowboy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 109
Default You mention

Firewire in your post... but you didn't say that you have or what you have the firewire connected to. Is the firewire (ilink) connected to a device?... also it's been documented that the DVI/HDMI connections are sometimes a problem... It's my understanding that Shaw does not support the firewire connectivity... you may have an issue with HDCP (copy protection) between the TV and the STB. This may be an issue with the TV set if the problem is persistant with two boxes now... can you persue warranty issues with the TV set? This may be the only option... Consider calling the centre you bought the TV from... and schedule service with them.... and ensure that the TV manufacturer doesn't wash their hands of DVI/HDMI connectivity issues....

Certainly try a new cable... it's a free first route to take....
Good luck...
__________________
"Be not the first by whom the new are tried, nor yet the last to lay the old aside."
Alexander Pope

Last edited by HDCowboy; 02-12-2005 at 09:34 AM.
HDCowboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2005, 09:41 AM   #3
don't mess with my HD
 
HDCowboy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 109
Default

try this as it may have an effect for you....
Not mentioned in the clip is that in addition to turning on the TV first... you must also select the input to which the HDCP compliant STB is connected (if it was not already selected)BEFORE turning on the STB when proper handshake protocol occurs, a message will flash on the screen of the 6412 like "du1". AFTER the message has appeared on the display of the STB you can THEN turn on the STB.

Good luck... let us know what happens...
Attached Images
File Type: gif untitled1.gif (6.3 KB, 742 views)
__________________
"Be not the first by whom the new are tried, nor yet the last to lay the old aside."
Alexander Pope

Last edited by HDCowboy; 02-12-2005 at 09:48 AM.
HDCowboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2005, 11:38 AM   #4
don't mess with my HD
 
HDCowboy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 109
Default Lastly....

I am curious as to the model # of the TV set...

How long ago did you buy it? or for how long have you had it?

There is a possibility that it is not HDCP compliant....

please post the model # and/or try the above...
__________________
"Be not the first by whom the new are tried, nor yet the last to lay the old aside."
Alexander Pope
HDCowboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2005, 04:41 PM   #5
HD Rules!
 

Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 37
Default

Thanks for the replies.

OK, the TV set is a Hitachi HDTV Model #516WX20 that I bought 2 years ago at Visions. My cousin works there and gave us a deal on the TV and the Onkyo receiver (model TXSR700), Onkyo DVD player and Athena speakers. The whole system is amazing for movies and we've had no issues with the DVD player or Receiver. Or the Onkyo CD player for that matter. I don't run everything through the Receiver because I didn't want to have to put it on all the time. I simply don't need to hear the news read through 6 speakers and 2 sub woofers.

The TV has a 6 year warranty on it and in fact, had a relay switch replaced last summer. When the TV tech was here (for several hours) he checked all aspects of the set and it was all fine. The Shaw tech did check and found it HDCP compliant.

When I turn the STB on I do get the du1 thing first and then the box turns on. I can turn both the TV and the STB on using the STB remote and we have it set so the TV goes on first and then the STB.

As for the Firewire, I'm not sure we have such a thing. Frankly I don't know enough about it but I started reading forums like this when the problems occurred and found several instances where people mentioned Firewire and problems associated with it. I thought maybe that's where my problem was. Is that even possible? Is there something I should look for to tell me if I have Firewire? And if there are known problems with the DVI connections maybe that's my problem after all.

The BB where I bought my DVI cable doesn't have any in stock yet so I haven't been able to trade cables yet. They expect some next week.

For now, I'm watching a lesser quality picture using the component video cables and there haven't been any glitches of any kind in 2 whole days! But I figure for all the money I've spent I should be able to have the better quality picture somehow.

Again, thanks for the replies. I'm trying to make sense of this stuff and any help is appreciated.
__________________
Life is short, eat your dessert first!
redito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2005, 04:44 PM   #6
HD Rules!
 

Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 37
Default

One more thing. The Shaw tech did re-boot the box. Even tried a "cold boot" which wipes all the software out and starts from zero. All the boxes got rebooted and reset by him at one time or another. As far as Shaw can tell, the boxes were starting up and reading the TV properly.
__________________
Life is short, eat your dessert first!
redito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2005, 05:52 PM   #7
don't mess with my HD
 
HDCowboy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 109
Default Ok

the only operational issue remaining is that you shut down the PVR first then the TV...

Also in the earlier post where you said it seemed to work then you tried it again and it didn't...

Did it work? like until you tried it again? or did it quit by itself?
have you tried the reverse shut down procedure yet?

keep in touch.
__________________
"Be not the first by whom the new are tried, nor yet the last to lay the old aside."
Alexander Pope
HDCowboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2005, 08:50 PM   #8
HD Rules!
 

Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 37
Default

We always shut down the PVR first, then the TV. Always have. We even do it that way on our non-HD boxes.

On the original single tuner box we had ongoing problems with the screen going grey at odd intervals but we did have small periods of time where the box seemed to work OK. When we switched to the dual tuner box the grey screen issue went away but the picture and menus would jump constantly. It would start anywhere from 15 minutes to an hour after turning things on. Turning the TV off didn't help but turning the box off seemed to reset things.

As well, the box would turn itself off and back on again repeatedly(resetting all menus and info) without any input from me. Fortunately much of this happened when the Shaw guy was here but they really know so little about HD that he was in over his head. And he's the "expert"!

He seems to think we are doing the right things and the either it's a DVI conflict or a software problem in the box. He mentioned Firewire briefly but it was when he was talking on the phone to another "expert" at Shaw to get more advice and he never specifically said anything to me.

He's supposed to check with their head office in Calgary to see if they can suggest anything but it's been my experience that the people who use the new technology are generally WAY more knowledgeable than those who are selling it. That's where you come in.

Again, thanks for your reply!
__________________
Life is short, eat your dessert first!
redito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-12-2005, 09:13 PM   #9
don't mess with my HD
 
HDCowboy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 109
Default

At this point... I'm stumped... I'm out... I've got nothing... I'm bringing nothing to the table....

many apologies...

I look forward to reading what the resolution is however....
__________________
"Be not the first by whom the new are tried, nor yet the last to lay the old aside."
Alexander Pope
HDCowboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2005, 07:59 AM   #10
High Definition is the definition of life.
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Montreal
Posts: 1,095
Default

Redito,

The Firewire is a IEEE 1394 output and, if present in your back panel, it is similar but larger than a USB port. It's presence is not relevant to your DVI/HDCP problem.

Some people have been able to resolve a DVI issue by simply reversing the DVI cable between the STB and the TV. Takes 30 second to try that out.
__________________
Samsung LN52B750, SA8300HD, Energy speakers, Yamaha RX-V540, SVS PB12-ISD, Harmony 880, HD-A1, BDP-1400, Oppo DV-970HD, Zektor HDS4.1
mfabien is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2005, 04:09 PM   #11
HD Rules!
 

Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 37
Default

Thanks mfabien - we actually did try that and it didn't make any difference.

And many thanks to you HDcowboy for trying.

At least now I know we've tried all the obvious things. Shaw is still working the problem and I'm still going to trade DVI cables.

After that...... who knows?

Thanks to all!
__________________
Life is short, eat your dessert first!
redito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-13-2005, 06:15 PM   #12
GKM
What is HD?
 

Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 4
Default DVI vs Component and the 6412

I am interested in the quality of the picture that you are now getting using component cables vs the pictue you got using DVI. I have a Motorola 6408 hooked to a Panasonic 50" LCD Rear Projection box with an HDMI connection. I also upgraded my player to the Panasonic S97 which also has HDMI and no DVI out.

Unitl I invest in a scaler or switcher to allow various signal formats to be brought together in one device that feeds my display with one pure digital format, I felt I would be connectin' and unconnectin'

So, I bought some gender bending cable to go DVI out from my PVR to HDMI into the Panasonic. The Shaw techies hooked it up originally with some fairly substantial component wiring.

The outcome - I can't see any difference in quality between the picture delivered via component out of the PVR and into component inputs on the TV and the one using DVI out of the PVR and into the HDMI input on the TV. Moreover, the picture qulity I get on a HD source (like PBS) is awsome (to my eyes) and compared to the same set in Futureshop.

And finally, I found that the DVI to HDMI link gave my set some troubles - it did flip to grey - and I found a setting on the Panasonic to correct for the situation - I think they noted - if the colours look all wrong - try this.

So, I'm in the situation of having my S97 hooked to the HDMI slot and my PVR drving the TV through robust component cables. The only thing I may try now is to have the lower Standard Broadcast channels be fet to the TV tuner directly - someone said that the tV's tuner could be better than the PVR's

I like the PVR - wish it had two tuners - and it's a little noisy. But hey - without involving my computer - and then we'll see it that firewire port has any capacity - it's the best way to capture that precious resource - HD SOURCE.

Last edited by GKM; 02-13-2005 at 06:17 PM.
GKM is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2005, 01:44 PM   #13
HD Rules!
 

Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 37
Default

I guess I could truthfully say that if I had never used the DVI cable I would be quite happy with the picture quality I'm getting now with component cables. But having had the DVI quality I'm spoiled. The difference on HD is minimal depending on the programming. But the difference on my digital channels is noticeable. Grainier, less clarity and definition - like that. Not a bad picture and certainly not unwatchable by any means, similar to what you'd see at FS or BB usually. But for all this $$ I should be able to have the best possible picture if I want it.

I'm glad someone else had the flip to grey problem. I could never solve it with any option on the TV but Shaw did say they had heard of a few instances although they never did offer a solution.

As for my PVR, I now have the dual tuner one and it's a treat! It's wonderful to be able to record something while watching something else without having to settle for lesser quality through a VCR. Mine does have a soft fan sound but I wouldn't call it noisy and unless I'm standing right by the box I really can't hear it at all.

Do you have any problems with the fast forward when you play back programs you recorded? We have several "time shifted" channels here (the west coast feeds actually) and if I record something off of them and play it back I can't use the fast forward button. If I do, the program stops and asks me if I want to delete the program. If I say no, it goes back to the menu and my only option is to start the program all over again. It affects some of the HD programming as well. Very annoying!
__________________
Life is short, eat your dessert first!
redito is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2005, 02:04 PM   #14
don't mess with my HD
 
HDCowboy's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Alberta, Canada
Posts: 109
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by redito
Do you have any problems with the fast forward when you play back programs you recorded? We have several "time shifted" channels here (the west coast feeds actually) and if I record something off of them and play it back I can't use the fast forward button. If I do, the program stops and asks me if I want to delete the program. If I say no, it goes back to the menu and my only option is to start the program all over again. It affects some of the HD programming as well. Very annoying!

No issues with the ffwd here in cowtown... sounds like you've got box issues there....
__________________
"Be not the first by whom the new are tried, nor yet the last to lay the old aside."
Alexander Pope
HDCowboy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-14-2005, 07:25 PM   #15
HD Rules!
 

Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Canada
Posts: 37
Default

Yeah, Shaw said it was something they'd heard from others with the PVR boxes - something about needing a software patch to fix it. And it applies to both single and dual tuner boxes. I just wondered if they were patronizing me or if there really were others out there with the same problem.
__________________
Life is short, eat your dessert first!
redito is offline   Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
Go Back   High Def Forum - Your High Definition Community & High Definition Resource > High Definition Programming Providers > Canadian Providers
AddThis Social Bookmark Button
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:28 PM.



Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2004 - 2008, High Def Forum