HDMI/Component problem

coop2034

Hi, new to the site and to HDTV.

I just purchased a Toshiba 52in DLP. It does not have a DVI input, just 1 HDMI input and 2 component inputs.

I live in NE Oklahoma and Cable One is our Cable Company. I just got the new Motorolla DVR HD Digital Cable box. As many of you know they only supply you with component cables, which is fine because the cable box only has component and DVI inputs and my DLP does not have DVI. I currently have the box connected to the TV with the component cables and I am impressed with the HD picture. I would buy a DVI to HDMI converter but I already bought the Toshiba DVD player that up converts the picture to near hi-def and it is connected to the TV with the HDMI cable. It looks great, but I am not sure if it really looks any better than it would with just a monster component cable.

To those experts, should I leave it as is, or would you reccomend that I purchase a DVI to HDMI converter to plug into my TV and use a component hook up from the DVD player to the TV???

I am happy with the current situation, but I think it could be a little bit better. Also would upgrading from the component cables that Cable One provided to a good set of Monster component cables improve the picture at all?

Thank you for your help and sorry if I did not word thist very well, I am not sure how else to explain it.

Runaround

I would leave it as is. If you hook up the DVD with component then it would no longer up convert to 720p or 1080i, whichever you are using.

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-Daniel
Hitachi 57F510, Onkyo TX-SR502 Reciever, Motorola DCT 6412 DVR, LG LGDVB418 DVD Player, Xbox 360, Logitech Harmony Remote 688,
Bose Acoustimass 5 Series III Speaker System, Bose VCS-10 Center Speaker, Bose 141 Bookshelf Speakers, Sony SA-WM250 Subwoofer

mfabien

In a few months, it will be essential for you to use the DVI output on your DVR because of HDCP content protocol consideration. You can buy a DVI to HDMI cable..there are many sources for this. Then connect digital audio to your a/v receiver, if you have one (or the red and white audio cables to your TV). The second reason to justify this concerns your DLP set...it displays a digitalized image. Using DVI/HDMI connection provides an uncompressed digital signal to your display with obvious results.

See: http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/DVI-hdmi_cables.html

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Cobra

Could you explain a bit more as to why (in a few months) it will be "essential" to utilize DVI cables on a DVR over HDCP issues.

mfabien

If a DVR has a DVI or HDMI output, HDCP in the DVR will want to see a handshake with the final device in the circuit which will be the display monitor. This will be of importance for programs or movies which will carry a broadcast flag. Broadcast flags are due to start in July.

Failure to have an HDCP connection between the DVR and the HDTV, with the presence of a flag, could cause the Component connection to produce a 480i format and therefore be seen as a SD program.

Those wishing to remain with Component for HD, by choice or because the HDTV does not carry a DVI or HDCP connection, the FCC has ruled that such equipment will not be penalized. Translation: if one wishes to receive HD, with Component after broadcast flags are effective, make sure to keep a STB which does not have a DVI or HDMI output (and therefore no HDCP). That would rule out any model of today's HD DVR's.

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Franko

mfabian
Thanks for that info. I have a simlar problem but am also confused. I currently am having problems between my Dish 811 HD receiver and my TV with DVI to HDMI connection and I assume its because of HDCP. I switched to component and it works fine. Meanwhile I use the HDMI connection on my TV to connect to the HDMI on my DVD. I would reverse it but the DVI to HDMI goes black after a while and I'm told it is HDCP causing it ( I assume the Dish 811 is not HDCP compliant but dont this for sure. My TV and DVD are so new that they must be HDCP compliant). So, are you saying I need to find a way to use the DVI to HDMI (satellite to TV) in a few months due to move by the FCC? Sorry but I guess this stuff goes over my head since I am new to HDTV. Thanks

coop2034

What does HDCP stand for?

Thanks for the replies...

So let me get this straight.


You are suggesting that in a few months because of something to do with the FCC rules that I should change my current set up to plugging in my Cablebox/DVR using the DVI to HDMI converter and plug that into my TV???

Should I buy some good Monster Component cables to use with my DVD player or is there any kind of connection that allows you to plug in 2 HDMI inputs at the same time? Kind of like a USB of Firewire input you put into your computer to allow you to have more inputs?

Sorry, I am new to the world of HD and just do not understand everything, but I appreciate your help.

One other question, I currently just have the red and white audio cables plugged into my TV for audio and it sounds fine, but what cables would you suggest for pure digital audio?

mfabien

There are issues, in some cases, with the conversion from DVI to HDMI. The Dish 811 is compliant so is your HDTV. But HDCP is quite new and complex. Some DVI devices are known to have problems making and maintaining communications with other devices. HDMI appears to be less of a problem. Electronic manufacturers are hard at work trying to make these connections interface without hassles. In most cases the resolution rests with STB (your case) and STB/DVR manufacturers because they have the ability to upgrade software via their service.

In other cases it could be the cabling with a DVI connection at one end and an HDMI at the other. May I suggest you e-mail the following support: http://www.ramelectronics.net/html/support.html and identify the devices in full and explain your experience.

__________________
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mfabien

HDCP = High-bandwidth Digital Content Protection. This is the protocol the FCC has mandated the broadcasters to use when a TV program or movie producer has requested a protection flag.

Keep in mind that the importance is to protect the communications between your STB/DVR device and your HDTV and to achieve this, you must use an HDCP compliant device, if your STB contains HDCP software. As for your DVD, the issue is strictly the use of a pure digital data transmission connection to a digital display monitor as opposed to a digital/analog connection (Component).

As for digital audio, your STB/DVR must have either an optical or a coaxial digital audio connection. Buy the appropriate cable and make the connection to your audio amplifier (Home Theater). If you don't have a HT, use the red and white audio cables to your TV.

__________________
Samsung LN52B750, SA8300HD, Energy speakers, Yamaha RX-V540, SVS PB12-ISD, Harmony 880, HD-A1, BDP-1400, Oppo DV-970HD, Zektor HDS4.1

mfabien

In a previous post in this thread, I discussed the importance of having a DVI or HDMI connection between the STB and the HDTV, when the STB carries an HDCP output (associated with DVI and HDMI). This requirement essentally concerns a STB/DVR equipped with such an output device. That is the meaning of the following paragraph:

"Does "broadcast flag" prevent digital copying?
No. The broadcast flag is only used to prevent unauthorized redistribution of copyrighted content, not prohibit digital copying. But copies made by future digital recorders that comply with the broadcast flag will not be playable on legacy playback devices and consumers will still be able to tape the digital broadcasts for traditional time-shifting uses with analog recorders such as VHS"

See: http://www.mpaa.org/Press/Broadcast_Flag_QA.htm
That was written in early 2004 when few DVR's were in existence and none with an active DVI output (many DVR's have yet to see their DVI output activated).


A legacy playback device is one that does not carry a digital input such as DVI or HDMI. Therefore, if your DVR is HDCP enabled, the HDTV must be HDCP enabled to receive the unencrypted digital signal. If the handshake is not carried out by the DVI or HDMI connections, then, in the case of a digital video recorder, a flag can cause the data to be encrypted or there is talk that HDCP may cause, in that instance, the Component analog connection to switch to 480i picture format thus giving you SD.

The reaon for this is simple, the DVR could be connected to a computer via some data transfer device, capable of HD quality, and from there reach the Internet.

__________________
Samsung LN52B750, SA8300HD, Energy speakers, Yamaha RX-V540, SVS PB12-ISD, Harmony 880, HD-A1, BDP-1400, Oppo DV-970HD, Zektor HDS4.1

Cobra

I need a drink . . .

mfabien

No DVI or HDMI input at your TV?

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Samsung LN52B750, SA8300HD, Energy speakers, Yamaha RX-V540, SVS PB12-ISD, Harmony 880, HD-A1, BDP-1400, Oppo DV-970HD, Zektor HDS4.1

Cobra

Have Component connection in one room and HDMI connections on two other displays in others. This all isn't much of an issue at all actually and will in all likelihood won't be very problematic for most as there are always work-arounds for such things.

This just seems like one more ridiculous issue to navigate around. I wish the industry would settle on what direction it wants to go in. Kind of like driving and constantly switching lanes. The industry just needs to pick a lane and relax. But watch within months "this" won't be an issue at all . . . there'll be three more. So I say . . . let's all pour a cold one and enjoy a good movie!

morty

Wait a minute so what you are saying is the directv hdtv tivo that my father just spent $1000 on wont work because his hdtv only has component video inputs? Please dont tell me this is true I talked him into buying it.

Cobra

It should be just fine. First of all the "Broadcast Flag" was only "agreed upon" by a consortium group who were only seeking to prevent the "redistribution" of their protected content. They are not seeking or intending to restrict your continued copying of programs for your own use. Prior to any implementation it must pass FCC Federal Legislation in order to be implemented and that may take years given the FCC's track record for such proposed changes.

Even if implemented it is only designed to restrict unauthorized "redistribution" of digital content, such as via the Internet over PC's through services like Kazza. It was not meant to restrict (nor will it restrict) your personal use for copying a program via your TiVO for your own subsequent playback and enjoyment.

Any personal restriction would violated the "Fair Use Doctrine" of the FCC. This is an issue that has been well tested ever since the first days of cassettes on through to VCR's and up to CD/DVD recorders to your TiVO. Like I said, everybody should just relax, pour a cold one and enjoy your equipment. You should be able to continue to time-shift your recorded programs for your own personal use for a very long time.