The New Pioneer with Dual HDMI Outs...Is This Worth a Look?

Peter Marlowe · 06-13-2009, 11:21 PM

Read a review in the recent Sound & Vision on the new Pioneer $2200 (approx.) Blu-ray deck, and this thing has DUAL HDMI 1.3a outs -- so it can actually separate audio and video streams and you no longer need to send video through a receiver (when using one cable)...

Is this an up and coming trend in next gen players? Taking the player's price out of the equation for a second -- would something like this be worth the consideration just for this feature alone (dual HDMI outs)? My biggest pet peeve since the launch of the new codecs, equipment, HDMI specs and software has been the fact that in order to send high resolution audio and high definition video (1080p) together from one source deck, it all had to go over one HDMI cable, which was then split inside the receiver or processor so video was routed to a display -- introducing a chance that something gets clipped in that link. With dual HDMI outs, we can now send bitstreamed high resolution codecs AND 1080p video to two separate devices for processing.

Does this work better, theoretically, than sending everything over one cable?

mytime · 06-13-2009, 11:36 PM

I thought one of the big selling points for HDMI was the convenience of audio and video being sent thru one cable.

Loves2Watch · 06-14-2009, 02:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Peter Marlowe

Read a review in the recent Sound & Vision on the new Pioneer $2200 (approx.) Blu-ray deck, and this thing has DUAL HDMI 1.3a outs -- so it can actually separate audio and video streams and you no longer need to send video through a receiver (when using one cable)...

Is this an up and coming trend in next gen players? Taking the player's price out of the equation for a second -- would something like this be worth the consideration just for this feature alone (dual HDMI outs)? My biggest pet peeve since the launch of the new codecs, equipment, HDMI specs and software has been the fact that in order to send high resolution audio and high definition video (1080p) together from one source deck, it all had to go over one HDMI cable, which was then split inside the receiver or processor so video was routed to a display -- introducing a chance that something gets clipped in that link. With dual HDMI outs, we can now send bitstreamed high resolution codecs AND 1080p video to two separate devices for processing.

Does this work better, theoretically, than sending everything over one cable?

In theory it's possible but remains to be seen.

Nikopol · 06-14-2009, 03:24 AM

HDMI 1:2 splitter would do the same thing. For every source.

bicker · 06-14-2009, 06:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mytime

I thought one of the big selling points for HDMI was the convenience of audio and video being sent thru one cable.

Well, yes, that is one selling point for HDMI. Another is that it is keeps a digital video signal digital all the way from source to display. The multiple outputs recognize the fact that few (if any) displays support true 5.1 audio, so for the full home theater experience you are going to have to send the audio and video to different devices, no matter what. With two HDMI outputs, you can connect the disc player to the sound system and display directly, instead of sending both signals to the sound system, and from there sending the video onto the display (and that's assuming that the sound system supports passing the video through via an HDMI output).

Nikopol · 06-14-2009, 07:15 AM

So instead of having two cables (first from source to receiver, second from receiver to display), you have .... two cables (frist from source to display, second from source to receiver). Wow, i can so see the advantage!

Question. Let's say you have more than one HDMI source. How do you set that up?

bicker · 06-14-2009, 07:48 AM

There are advantages to having two HDMI outputs from the disc player. For example, it may be easier to handle sound synchronization issues if both display and sound system are directly connected to the source. Also, many sound systems don't have HDMI outputs, so the approach that this device supports is essential.

pestilent · 06-14-2009, 08:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bicker

There are advantages to having two HDMI outputs from the disc player. For example, it may be easier to handle sound synchronization issues if both display and sound system are directly connected to the source. Also, many sound systems don't have HDMI outputs, so the approach that this device supports is essential.

For 2200 bucks a person could get a new Oppo, Panny, or Sony player and get a new reciever with HDMI out. A newer reciever would also have built in sync settings and would leave enough money left over to buy a lot of movies.

Nikopol · 06-14-2009, 08:29 AM

Well, the discussion is about the general benefits of having two HDMI outputs on one player. Not limited to the announced Pioneer.

I have two HDMI outputs on my receiver, one goes to the projector, the other to a smaller 1080p monitor. But like i already asked, what are you going to do if you have more than one source? (My receiver also acts like 4 to 2 HDMI switch with its 4 HDMI inputs).

Btw how any older receivers or HTiB systems have HDMI inputs for audio, but no HDMI outputs? Is that a common problem?

Btw anyone know, does have HDMI have a "bit" or "synch stream" to synch audio and video, just like e.g. a Transport Stream has?

BIslander · 06-14-2009, 08:35 AM

For some people with particular equipment combinations, separate HDMI outputs for audio and video offer advantages.

By the same token, using separate inputs on a display for each device may offer video finetuning advantages in some cases.

Dual HDMI outputs can also be used to feed two displays.

There's no simple answer to the OP's question about whether a dual output is better. For most people, no. For some, yes. Of course, most people aren't shopping for $2,000 players.

bicker · 06-14-2009, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pestilent

For 2200 bucks a person could get a new Oppo, Panny, or Sony player and get a new reciever with HDMI out. A newer reciever would also have built in sync settings and would leave enough money left over to buy a lot of movies.

Absolutely, and I think that would be my approach, if I were faced with the situation, but I understand a lot of folks are partial to the amps they have now.

bicker · 06-14-2009, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nikopol

Btw how any older receivers or HTiB systems have HDMI inputs for audio, but no HDMI outputs? Is that a common problem?

Absolutely. I have three HTiB units sitting in my Wish List on Amazon.com right now. One has 3 inputs and no outputs, and two have 3 inputs and one output, so based on my very very unscientific and non-normalized survey, one-third of all current systems have no HDMI outputs.

Peter Marlowe · 06-14-2009, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mytime

I thought one of the big selling points for HDMI was the convenience of audio and video being sent thru one cable.

It was -- that was its original intention and designation; but from all accounts, it has always been better to separate audio and video coming from the source deck; I (as many others) have fears that by sending EVERYTHING via HDMI, as I do, then using the receiver as a splitter so the video goes to a display MAY cause some signal degredation...

That's why I thought this new Pioneer may have been worth looking at; perhaps more manufacturers will come out with dual HDMI outs at more reasonable prices.

Peter Marlowe · 06-14-2009, 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Loves2Watch

In theory it's possible but remains to be seen.

You're telling me that with dual HDMI outs, this Pioneer still may not deliver what it promises?

Peter Marlowe · 06-14-2009, 08:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pestilent

For 2200 bucks a person could get a new Oppo, Panny, or Sony player and get a new reciever with HDMI out. A newer reciever would also have built in sync settings and would leave enough money left over to buy a lot of movies.

Well, I'm specifically referring to folks in my situation, who may in fact have a receiver with HDMI OUT (my Onkyo 605) which feeds a display, but separating audio from video out of the source deck because it may yield a cleaner picture than everything going into the receiver to then have the video SPLIT to the display...

06-13-2009, 11:21 PM	#1
Peter Marlowe Resident BD/DVD Reviewer Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 2,298	The New Pioneer with Dual HDMI Outs...Is This Worth a Look? Read a review in the recent Sound & Vision on the new Pioneer $2200 (approx.) Blu-ray deck, and this thing has DUAL HDMI 1.3a outs -- so it can actually separate audio and video streams and you no longer need to send video through a receiver (when using one cable)... Is this an up and coming trend in next gen players? Taking the player's price out of the equation for a second -- would something like this be worth the consideration just for this feature alone (dual HDMI outs)? My biggest pet peeve since the launch of the new codecs, equipment, HDMI specs and software has been the fact that in order to send high resolution audio and high definition video (1080p) together from one source deck, it all had to go over one HDMI cable, which was then split inside the receiver or processor so video was routed to a display -- introducing a chance that something gets clipped in that link. With dual HDMI outs, we can now send bitstreamed high resolution codecs AND 1080p video to two separate devices for processing. Does this work better, theoretically, than sending everything over one cable? __________________ THEATER: ONKYO TX-SR605B OPPO BDP-83 SONY 1080p KDS-50A2020 SXRD Mains: polkaudio RTi12 - *NEW!* Center: polkaudio CSi30 Surrounds: SpeakerCraft In-Ceiling Sub: polkaudio PSW350 APC SurgeArrest System INTERCONNECTS & SPEAKER CABLING BY MONSTER *2-CHANNEL (IN PROGRESS):* ONKYO A-9555 (coming soon) polkaudio R20 (possibly) Stands by Sanus Systems (possibly) marantz CC4001 TASCAM CD-RW900SL Professional Technics SL-1200 (coming soon) Numark CD MIX-1

06-13-2009, 11:36 PM	#2
mytime Nanerpuss Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Jackson, Missouri Posts: 5,424	I thought one of the big selling points for HDMI was the convenience of audio and video being sent thru one cable. __________________ Gargle hag gag gargle

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06-14-2009, 03:24 AM	#4
Nikopol Uwe Boll's my hero Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Maelstrom Blu-rays: 14 Age: 5 Posts: 6,374	HDMI 1:2 splitter would do the same thing. For every source.

06-14-2009, 07:15 AM	#6
Nikopol Uwe Boll's my hero Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Maelstrom Blu-rays: 14 Age: 5 Posts: 6,374	So instead of having two cables (first from source to receiver, second from receiver to display), you have .... two cables (frist from source to display, second from source to receiver). Wow, i can so see the advantage! Question. Let's say you have more than one HDMI source. How do you set that up?

06-14-2009, 07:48 AM	#7
bicker High Definition is the definition of life. Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Burlington, MA Posts: 1,535	There are advantages to having two HDMI outputs from the disc player. For example, it may be easier to handle sound synchronization issues if both display and sound system are directly connected to the source. Also, many sound systems don't have HDMI outputs, so the approach that this device supports is essential.

06-14-2009, 08:29 AM	#9
Nikopol Uwe Boll's my hero Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Maelstrom Blu-rays: 14 Age: 5 Posts: 6,374	Well, the discussion is about the general benefits of having two HDMI outputs on one player. Not limited to the announced Pioneer. I have two HDMI outputs on my receiver, one goes to the projector, the other to a smaller 1080p monitor. But like i already asked, what are you going to do if you have more than one source? (My receiver also acts like 4 to 2 HDMI switch with its 4 HDMI inputs). Btw how any older receivers or HTiB systems have HDMI inputs for audio, but no HDMI outputs? Is that a common problem? Btw anyone know, does have HDMI have a "bit" or "synch stream" to synch audio and video, just like e.g. a Transport Stream has?

06-14-2009, 08:35 AM	#10
BIslander Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Bainbridge Island, WA Posts: 731	For some people with particular equipment combinations, separate HDMI outputs for audio and video offer advantages. By the same token, using separate inputs on a display for each device may offer video finetuning advantages in some cases. Dual HDMI outputs can also be used to feed two displays. There's no simple answer to the OP's question about whether a dual output is better. For most people, no. For some, yes. Of course, most people aren't shopping for $2,000 players.