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Blu Ray Aspect Ratio problem

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Old 12-13-2009, 04:20 PM   #16
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Thanks everyone, very informative. I didn't realize that HBO was cutting off the sides! I don't like using the Wide Zoom for that very reason.

Feeling much better now. Now that I know it's correct, I don't think I'll even notice it anymore!!

Happy Holidays!
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Old 12-13-2009, 09:41 PM   #17
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Thanks everyone, very informative. I didn't realize that HBO was cutting off the sides! I don't like using the Wide Zoom for that very reason.

Feeling much better now. Now that I know it's correct, I don't think I'll even notice it anymore!!

Happy Holidays!
The original aspect ratio of any film/show should always be used. Once HBO, Spike, and several other channels get this the happier the masses will be. At least some channels get it right like AMC, TMC, MGM, and FX.
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Old 12-13-2009, 09:45 PM   #18
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You can research what aspect ratio a movie was presented in by going to this site, typing the name of the movie in the search space at the top and hit search.

EXAMPLE:

Here is Iron Man:

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0371746/

Look below the cast and you will see ASPECT RATIO.

Any film that was shot in a process with an AR greater than 1.85 whill have black bars above and below it.

The 1.66 AR was used in Europe primaily thouugh there have been movies shot in 1.66 - then presented in 1.85 then transfered in 1.66 like Disney's MULAN. It was and is not a very popular AR because there were never 1.66 AR movie screens in the USA.

All blurays are presented in the original aspect ratio that a film was shown in theaters..

The fact that many HD content providers zoom a 2.35/2.39 AR movie to 1.78 so there are no black bars - that changes the framing composition that the director and director of photography used to shoot the movie.

It changes The Magnificent Seven to The Magnificent Five.
Or in the case of the Star Wars films on Spike HD in turns Star Wars into Star Skirmish.
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Old 12-13-2009, 09:49 PM   #19
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The original aspect ratio of any film/show should always be used. Once HBO, Spike, and several other channels get this the happier the masses will be. At least some channels get it right like AMC, TMC, MGM, and FX.
LOL - both AMC HD and FX HD are hit and miss when it comes to OAR. MGM and TCM - always and I believe Universal HD is also OAR - it used to be, but they don't show that many movies anymore.

HBO has specifically said that they will not show 2.3X OAR movies on HBO HD.

Even History HD shows zoomed 2.3X movies.
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Old 12-13-2009, 10:26 PM   #20
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LOL - both AMC HD and FX HD are hit and miss when it comes to OAR. MGM and TCM - always and I believe Universal HD is also OAR - it used to be, but they don't show that many movies anymore.

HBO has specifically said that they will not show 2.3X OAR movies on HBO HD.

Even History HD shows zoomed 2.3X movies.
If it makes you feel any better I think Discovery HD and Science HD use OAR most of the time.
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Old 05-11-2010, 09:52 PM   #21
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What size screen do you need to fill it with a 2.39:1 ratio?

Thanks everyone.
All that everybody said was true about aspect ration and bars and stuff...

But to answer your question specifically, you need a

Philips 21:9 TV which can replicate the exact aspect ratio of film as the are shoot. (2.40:1) this is the one and only TV with 21:9 aspect ratio.

This is the future.

search for 21:9 Philips on google. I cannot post the url here...

it is not available to north america yet though...
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Old 05-11-2010, 10:56 PM   #22
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Philips 21:9 TV which can replicate the exact aspect ratio of film as the are shoot. (2.40:1) this is the one and only TV with 21:9 aspect ratio.
Nonsense.

21:9 = 2.33:1. A 2.40:1 movie will still have black bars at top and bottom on such a screen if there is no overscan. If the TV has enough overscan to eliminate the black bars, then the images will be cropped at the sides.

It is mathematically impossible to have a 2.40:1 movie fill an entire 21:9 screen without either cropping the image at the sides (as happens with overscan) or distorting the image by stretching it vertically, or by a combination of both cropping and distorting.

Also many films today are filmed with an aspect ratio of 1.85:1. They will have large side bars on a 21:9 screen. And a standard HDTV program with its 16:9 AR will have even wider side bars.

There is no magic aspect ratio for TV screens, period!.
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Old 05-11-2010, 11:04 PM   #23
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HBO has specifically said that they will not show 2.3X OAR movies on HBO HD.
That's sad, but I guess they know what their audience wants more that us OAR geeks.
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Old 05-12-2010, 08:29 AM   #24
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Nonsense.

21:9 = 2.33:1. A 2.40:1 movie will still have black bars at top and bottom on such a screen if there is no overscan. If the TV has enough overscan to eliminate the black bars, then the images will be cropped at the sides.

It is mathematically impossible to have a 2.40:1 movie fill an entire 21:9 screen without either cropping the image at the sides (as happens with overscan) or distorting the image by stretching it vertically, or by a combination of both cropping and distorting.

Also many films today are filmed with an aspect ratio of 1.85:1. They will have large side bars on a 21:9 screen. And a standard HDTV program with its 16:9 AR will have even wider side bars.

There is no magic aspect ratio for TV screens, period!.
Agreed. Unless the studios start using ONLY ONE aspect ration in the future, and all cable/sat show them in that aspect ratio AND all SD (4:3) material is eliminated black bars are here to stay because those things will not happen.
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Old 05-12-2010, 08:41 AM   #25
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Agreed. Unless the studios start using ONLY ONE aspect ration in the future, and all cable/sat show them in that aspect ratio AND all SD (4:3) material is eliminated black bars are here to stay because those things will not happen.
It still blows my mind that all three of my local news stations still broadcast in upconverted 4:3. It also blows my mind that shows like Dr. Phil and Oprah are still in 4:3. I guess that tells who their target demographic has always been: Stay at home moms watching their SDTV in their kitchen or some other room of the house.
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Old 05-24-2010, 04:59 PM   #26
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I think this is a major and common complaint for many people that have recently upgraded to HD and Blu-Ray. Watching a widescreen movie on an SD TV was always terrible. The thought is-

"Finally, I can watch a movie on my WHOLE screen... Wait, it's letterboxed on my new TV too? I thought I just bought a widescreen TV? You mean there's TWO widescreens now?"

Further galling is how deceptive the information on the Blu-Ray discs is. Most of the widerscreen discs indeed say they're at 2.35:1, but they also say 1080p. But is it really both? At 2.35:1, the width of my 1080x1920 TV limits the picture to 817x1920, or about 75% of the screen. So it's really 817p, isn't it? Unless they're counting the black space as picture content!? That's just abusive.

Or perhaps the resolution is there so I'd get 1080p if I zoom in? Is the native resolution of the film really 1080x2538 then? I doubt it but I can't find anyone that knows.

The bottom line I think for a lot of people, is that with our TVs, we're expecting its maximum resolution and size to be taken advantage of, and are disappointed in the smaller size and quality of a widescreen movie.

As much as people seem to be pompous in their steadfast worship of "the director's vision" and the 2.35:1 ratio, I think I'd rather not be squinting at the smaller picture the whole time, wishing I'd bought a bigger TV than my apparently inadequate 51 inch.
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Old 05-24-2010, 06:39 PM   #27
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Then limit yourself to movies that are 1.78:1 aspect ratio to use the full screen or 1.85:1 to get almost the full screen. There really is no alternative other than zooming which will reduce the PQ.

You have to remember that directors make films based on how they want them to look in the theater not on a TV.
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Old 05-24-2010, 08:06 PM   #28
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It still blows my mind that all three of my local news stations still broadcast in upconverted 4:3. It also blows my mind that shows like Dr. Phil and Oprah are still in 4:3. I guess that tells who their target demographic has always been: Stay at home moms watching their SDTV in their kitchen or some other room of the house.
Dr. Phil and Oprah are in HD. Sounds like a local issue.
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Old 05-24-2010, 08:16 PM   #29
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As much as people seem to be pompous in their steadfast worship of "the director's vision" and the 2.35:1 ratio, I think I'd rather not be squinting at the smaller picture the whole time, wishing I'd bought a bigger TV than my apparently inadequate 51 inch.
We all need Constant Image Height projection systems and curtains to mask the unused side portions of the screen when the content is not 2.40:1.
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Old 05-25-2010, 12:51 AM   #30
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Further galling is how deceptive the information on the Blu-Ray discs is. Most of the widerscreen discs indeed say they're at 2.35:1, but they also say 1080p. But is it really both? At 2.35:1, the width of my 1080x1920 TV limits the picture to 817x1920, or about 75% of the screen. So it's really 817p, isn't it? Unless they're counting the black space as picture content!? That's just abusive.

Or perhaps the resolution is there so I'd get 1080p if I zoom in? Is the native resolution of the film really 1080x2538 then? I doubt it but I can't find anyone that knows.
When you are talking about the number of scan lines it's just a reference. 525 you donít get to see all of the lines because there is between 40 and 42 lines of vertical blanking so the most you could see would be 485 lines. 625 has 50 lines of vertical blanking making the active video only 575 lines. But if those formats were letterboxed then the line count would go down even more but they are still called 525 and 625. Now with HD you have two formats 1125 and 750 but they are called 1080 and 720. That is because when HD started it was only 1035 not 1080 and for us to know what we were running we would say itís 1080 or itís 1035 not 1125 because that wouldnít help us. I guess it just stuck. Our original labels had 1125 on them because in those days there was only one HD system. Now when we run those tapes we have to check to see if they are 1035 or 1080. So yes the 262 lines of black are counted. Itís just like if the aspect ratio is 1.33 itís still called 1920 even though itís only 1440 pixels of active picture and 480 pixels of black. 1920:1080 is just the number of the potential number of pixels in the active picture area. HD running at 23.976 or 24 frames per second has a true pixel count of 2750:1125 and something running at 29.97 or 30 frames per second is 2200:1125. If you were in Europe it would be 25 frames per second and the pixel count is 2640:1125. So with all these numbers we go by the number of active scan lines, scan type and frame (or field) rate. So thatís why itís 1080i/59.94 or 1080PsF/23.98 or 1080P/25.

Welcome to the forum. If you have any questions about scan types, number of scan lines or anything about how HD works feel free to send me a PM.

BTW if film was made of pixels it would be a little over 4k wide for 35mm film.
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