Brady- out for season, Announcers weep

First- It's a given that no one wants to ever see a player injured. I admit that it looked pretty bad and I wasn't happy to see it happen.
Now there are reports that Brady is done for the year. What I don't get is that almost to a man, the announcers are crying about how this is bad for the NFL fans. Uh.... say what?
The fact that it pretty much removes the Pats from being a shoe-in for the playoffs, every AFC team and its fans are glad they don't have to play NE with Brady. You mean to tell me San Diego fans care about it? Colts fans?
Seriously?? I bet NE fans would cry for months if Manning were done for the year, right?

I think a monkey could play QB for that team and do nearly as well. Now if Moss got hurt... That would cost them 6 games.

You might be right. Moss still got his points today. Did I mention Brady was the #1 pick in our FFL?

This sucks but it will definitely make for a more interesting season.

I think a monkey could play QB for that team and do nearly as well. Now if Moss got hurt... That would cost them 6 games.

I think you are right. All the Pats need is someone to just step in and manage the offense without stupid mistakes. There is enough talent that they will be OK, but they will miss Brady in pressure situations.

First- It's a given that no one wants to ever see a player injured. I admit that it looked pretty bad and I wasn't happy to see it happen.
Now there are reports that Brady is done for the year. What I don't get is that almost to a man, the announcers are crying about how this is bad for the NFL fans. Uh.... say what?
The fact that it pretty much removes the Pats from being a shoe-in for the playoffs, every AFC team and its fans are glad they don't have to play NE with Brady. You mean to tell me San Diego fans care about it? Colts fans?
Seriously?? I bet NE fans would cry for months if Manning were done for the year, right?

I think they said that because it is exciting to watch Brady and the Patriots. If you love football in general, you are likely to watch more then just your team. The Patriots are a fun team to watch. I also watch other games besides the patriots - its the fun and exciting games I'll stick with - the boring ones I'll change the channel.

Exciting? Really? How many close games did the Pats have last year?

I think they said that because it is exciting to watch Brady and the Patriots. If you love football in general, you are likely to watch more then just your team. The Patriots are a fun team to watch. I also watch other games besides the patriots - its the fun and exciting games I'll stick with - the boring ones I'll change the channel.

Exciting? Really? How many close games did the Pats have last year?

Exciting for pats fans haha

Backup QB will finally get his chance after riding the pine for 3 years.

I am not buying that this isn't going to hurt the Patriots a great deal. I consider Brady the best player in the game, not just the best quarterback. His record has been amazing, the last Super Bowl being his major disappointment, but the guy finds ways to win tough games and he has done it for years. Randy Moss more important that Tom Brady? You have to got to be kidding. Randy Moss is really important now and we will see how the team does without their star and leader. As has been shown in the previous years, any player other than Brady was replaceable in that system, now the much bigger problem is a reality.

Chris

/Tin foil hat mode on/

Interesting turn of events...What about this, Brady doesnt play all pre season, comes in and is out in the 1st quarter on a fairly innocent and soft hit, he even walks off the field with only a bit of help and now it is a season ending injury????

What if the punishment for all of the years of Pats* cheating was that the QB is not allowed to play this year? Not the official punishment, but the punishment to keep all of the books and tapes hidden forever. Goodell and Pats* front office make this agreement behind closed doors.

/Tin foil hat mode off/

It HAS happened in motorsports, it could have happened in the NFL.

Exciting? Really? How many close games did the Pats have last year?

Are you a football fan or just a dolphin's fan?

I think many people found last years Patriots exciting and interesting to watch. I've watched the Colts play many times and enjoyed their games as Manning tossed the ball all over the place. I was always hoping they'd lose, but still enjoyed the games.

Aside from when they played the Dolphin's, how many Patriots games did you watch last year?

That would be about 2. One was the Monday Night game against the Ravens (F'n joke) and the other one was the Superbowl. I REALLY enjoyed that last one.
Hmmmm, let me think, am I a football fan......I get Direct Ticket, Superfan, catch a couple of Seahawks games a year, my son plays Freshman Football for Grossmont CC in California (6-4, 310, starting right guard), and I was the President of the Football Parents Association for the biggest High School in the state of Washington last year (South Kitsap). I don't know, you tell me.
Unless, of course, you are saying that unless I watch and admire the Patriots of last year, then I am not? IF that's what you are saying, I guess not.

That would be about 2. One was the Monday Night game against the Ravens (F'n joke) and the other one was the Superbowl. I REALLY enjoyed that last one.
Hmmmm, let me think, am I a football fan......I get Direct Ticket, Superfan, catch a couple of Seahawks games a year, my son plays Freshman Football for Grossmont CC in California (6-4, 310, starting right guard), and I was the President of the Football Parents Association for the biggest High School in the state of Washington last year (South Kitsap). I don't know, you tell me.
Unless, of course, you are saying that unless I watch and admire the Patriots of last year, then I am not? IF that's what you are saying, I guess not.

You simply could have said yes. :rolleyes:

I have nothing to back it up, but I wonder what the football fan who watches games all day Sunday (which you don't seem to do) watched last year and how many Pat's games they might have watched. I know if I want to just watch football, I want to watch an exciting game. I think with the way the Patriots played last year was exciting. I've felt the same watching Colts or other teams that throw the ball around alot. If there are others that do the same, they might watch the Pat's less.

On the flip side though, people might be interested in seeing how they do WITHOUT Brady.. Just like I'm curious to see how the Jet's do with Favre.

/Tin foil hat mode on/

Interesting turn of events...What about this, Brady doesnt play all pre season, comes in and is out in the 1st quarter on a fairly innocent and soft hit, he even walks off the field with only a bit of help and now it is a season ending injury????

What if the punishment for all of the years of Pats* cheating was that the QB is not allowed to play this year? Not the official punishment, but the punishment to keep all of the books and tapes hidden forever. Goodell and Pats* front office make this agreement behind closed doors.

/Tin foil hat mode off/

It HAS happened in motorsports, it could have happened in the NFL.

Ludicrous..................:eyecrazy

I think a monkey could play QB for that team and do nearly as well. Now if Moss got hurt... That would cost them 6 games.


That's absurd. How many Super Bowls did Brady win without Moss? How many Super Bowls has Brady won with Moss? Come to think of it, how many Super Bowls has Moss won period?

Exciting? Really? How many close games did the Pats have last year?

They had one on Feb. 3rd ;)

Brady works very well with Patriot system (he hardly try to create plays if they are not there his interceptions are very low), if backup QB do not try to win game by himself then patriots will manage the season and make playoff. to win Superbowl is not out of question but will be difficult. It makes season more interesting though.

I dont like the Pats at all, and I love to see them lose. But Brady is probably the best QB in the league. Man that hurts to say :(

Huh?
I don't consider it a real positive character aspect of mine, but I generally DO watch football all day Sunday.
Here's what you need to come to grips with- LOTS of people hate on the Pats. Do we really have to rehash all the reasons?

You simply could have said yes. :rolleyes:

I have nothing to back it up, but I wonder what the football fan who watches games all day Sunday (which you don't seem to do) watched last year and how many Pat's games they might have watched. I know if I want to just watch football, I want to watch an exciting game. I think with the way the Patriots played last year was exciting. I've felt the same watching Colts or other teams that throw the ball around alot. If there are others that do the same, they might watch the Pat's less.

On the flip side though, people might be interested in seeing how they do WITHOUT Brady.. Just like I'm curious to see how the Jet's do with Favre.

Huh?
I don't consider it a real positive character aspect of mine, but I generally DO watch football all day Sunday.
Here's what you need to come to grips with- LOTS of people hate on the Pats. Do we really have to rehash all the reasons?

I realize plenty of people hate them.

I was simply trying to come up with some reasons why the announcers may have though it was bad for football in general.

Perhaps part of their thinking is that some Pat's fans might give up on the season and not watch as much. Anytime a viewer is lost, regardless of the team, its bad for football in general.

OK, I see your point and You could be right.
In other news, A Steelers fans has been selling t-shirts praising the Chiefs Bernard Pollard. Wonder what THAT is all about?

OK, I see your point and You could be right.
In other news, A Steelers fans has been selling t-shirts praising the Chiefs Bernard Pollard. Wonder what THAT is all about?

It means Steelers fans are dumb seeing how we are not in the same division as them....

OK, I see your point and You could be right.
In other news, A Steelers fans has been selling t-shirts praising the Chiefs Bernard Pollard. Wonder what THAT is all about?

It means Steelers fans are dumb seeing how we are not in the same division as them....

IF there is a Steeler fan doing such a thing then he represents 1% of the Steeler fans, only his self.

I am a Steeler fan & hate to see anyone get hurt, especially somebody that makes the NFL a great game to watch like Tom Brady.

Running up scores to get personal records is not exciting football. If you want to see that kind of crap, watch college or high school.

I'd rather not watch football than watch the Pats* play, and I LOVE FOOTBALL.

BTW- The Steeler fan story was on Sportscenter last night.
I don't believe in making fun of players who get hurt, it's just bad karma. What's next, a ringtone of Brady screaming?!
DoctorCAD, you summed up my thoughts exactly. The Patriots "class" is demonstrated by their head coach.

IF there is a Steeler fan doing such a thing then he represents 1% of the Steeler fans, only his self.

I am a Steeler fan & hate to see anyone get hurt, especially somebody that makes the NFL a great game to watch like Tom Brady.

I agree. You definitely give a good name for Steelers fans.

Running up scores to get personal records is not exciting football. If you want to see that kind of crap, watch college or high school.

I'd rather not watch football than watch the Pats* play, and I LOVE FOOTBALL.

*Yeah d*ood I* totally* *agree wi*th you* man*.......* :rolleyes:

BTW- The Steeler fan story was on Sportscenter last night.
I don't believe in making fun of players who get hurt, it's just bad karma. What's next, a ringtone of Brady screaming?!
DoctorCAD, you summed up my thoughts exactly. The Patriots "class" is demonstrated by their head coach.

Wahhhh the Patriots aren't classy wahhhhhh. This isn't Pop Warner, this is the NFL, who cares about running up the score. If other teams don't like it, just do what the Giants did and actually win a god damn game against the Pats instead of crying about it.

Wahhhh the Patriots aren't classy wahhhhhh. This isn't Pop Warner, this is the NFL, who cares about running up the score. If other teams don't like it, just do what the Giants did and actually win a god damn game against the Pats instead of crying about it.



i agree -- sort of. Running up the score against youth, whether it be kids, high schoolers or college, is no good. Psychologically you could hurt them, and its no example to set. When you get to the pro level, i don't even know if there should even be a situation that can be called running up the score (unless you are calling t.o.'s during the closing min/sec of a game already in hand just to score more pts). I mean, at that level, you are all professional athletes. If teams at that level are sick of another team scoring, then stop them from doing it. These guys are all adults and payed to play. Getting destroyed isn't going to do any psychological damage to them at this point. Collect your pay and do better next time!

Wahhhh the Patriots aren't classy wahhhhhh. This isn't Pop Warner, this is the NFL, who cares about running up the score. If other teams don't like it, just do what the Giants did and actually win a god damn game against the Pats instead of crying about it.


I wouldn't have put it quite that way, but I agree with you. It's hard to sympathize with millionaires because they may have gotten their feelings hurt. It's their job to score. It's your job to stop them. Teams quit playing hard and then complain that someone's running up the score. :crying:

Running up scores to get personal records is not exciting football. If you want to see that kind of crap, watch college or high school.

I'd rather not watch football than watch the Pats* play, and I LOVE FOOTBALL.

Running up the score? If the Patriots are capable of "running up the score", isn't it likely that something could happen and all of a sudden the opponent could start to score just the same?

Do you just expect a team to hit a certain score and then stop playing?

If I'm out of the loop please let me know, i've been wondering where is bboncorr or however you spell it?

Nevermind, I found him on the "Blu-Ray" and "Gaming & Systems" forums.

The point you guys aren't getting is that personally, I don't enjoy watching a team run the score up at any level. That's just not entertaining to me.
Oh, Matt- I would respond to you IF I didn't have you on ignore. Hell, I don't see anything you blubber about unless some one quotes you and I just skim over that. Basically, It's like turning the channel on a game I have NO desire to see.

The point you guys aren't getting is that personally, I don't enjoy watching a team run the score up at any level. That's just not entertaining to me.
Oh, Matt- I would respond to you IF I didn't have you on ignore. Hell, I don't see anything you blubber about unless some one quotes you and I just skim over that. Basically, It's like turning the channel on a game I have NO desire to see.

What have I said that is so horrible?? Just because I think the whole running up the score/karma thing is silly? Seems like people just agreed with what I posted. Weird.... Didn't know that was ignore worthy :confused:

You didn't run up scores last year and didn't cheat either.

NE fans are in total denial.

The point you guys aren't getting is that personally, I don't enjoy watching a team run the score up at any level. That's just not entertaining to me.


If the outcome of the game has already been decided, which is obviously the case in these situations, you basically have two choices. The first is to see the dominant team run 3 straight dives off tackle and punt. Boring. The second is the winning team continues to run it's offense. Also boring. Either way the game is in hand and really can't be enjoyable at that point anyway. I'm not a Patriots fan, and really don't care what they do in that situation. I'm probably not going to be watching anyway.

You would think if teams felt the score was being run up on them, that instead of crying about it, they would use it for motivation. For what it's worth, that's my :2cents.

You didn't run up scores last year and didn't cheat either.

NE fans are in total denial.

I never said the Patriots did not run up the score... I just don't see the big deal. If a team doesn't like it why don't they beat the Patriots just like the Giants did. This is pro football. So please think things through before you post so you don't look so foolish.

Ive never said Spygate did not happen either. Patriots were punished for it though.

Que in karma and lots of this :crying: Isn't it getting old guys?

Nope!!!!!

Nope!!!!!

thats weak

I think we agree then. Regardless who is doing it, blowouts are boring and not everyone is a Patriots fan.

If the outcome of the game has already been decided, which is obviously the case in these situations, you basically have two choices. The first is to see the dominant team run 3 straight dives off tackle and punt. Boring. The second is the winning team continues to run it's offense. Also boring. Either way the game is in hand and really can't be enjoyable at that point anyway. I'm not a Patriots fan, and really don't care what they do in that situation. I'm probably not going to be watching anyway.

You would think if teams felt the score was being run up on them, that instead of crying about it, they would use it for motivation. For what it's worth, that's my :2cents.

What's weak about it?

How long did I have to put up with people saying that Pittsburgh "bought-off" the referees in SB XL? Just because Seattle couldn't manage a clock if it was 2 minutes to midnight and they were the govener pardoning a death row inmate?
There was NO truth to those allegations and I still hear it.

I will not ever be tired of pointing out that the Pats* ran up scores to set personal records or that they cheated in games, both proven facts.

Nope, never!

The point you guys aren't getting is that personally, I don't enjoy watching a team run the score up at any level. That's just not entertaining to me.
Oh, Matt- I would respond to you IF I didn't have you on ignore. Hell, I don't see anything you blubber about unless some one quotes you and I just skim over that. Basically, It's like turning the channel on a game I have NO desire to see.

Even as a Pat's fan, I agree if the score is very lopsided that its far less excited. It keeps my heart rate down though :)

But what can a team do? If you are that much better then the opponent, then its going to happen. I don't expect ANY team to just stop trying to score because they are up by a lot.

I will not ever be tired of pointing out that the Pats* ran up scores to set personal records or that they cheated in games, both proven facts.

Point it out all you want.

Some of us don't care if they run up the score. Like I said above, what else should they do? Any team given the opportunity will run it up. If they aren't, its because the defense is preventing them from doing it.

And the cheating is so old news and such a weak argument, that I don't even care if someone talks about it. If you want to bring up irrelevant points, by all means go ahead.

Que in karma and lots of this :crying: Isn't it getting old guys?

Yeah, it is. People just hate on teams when they are on top. You would think that sports fans would find some admiration in such a well tuned football team as the Pats have been for the last few years.

Especially when you are a Rams fan like me! :lol:

Yeah, it is. People just hate on teams when they are on top. You would think that sports fans would find some admiration in such a well tuned football team as the Pats have been for the last few years.

Especially when you are a Rams fan like me! :lol:


Very well said, Matt, and Sobay!

The 2nd Sunday of the season is almost here. Time to see what Cassel is made of.

The 2nd Sunday of the season is almost here. Time to see what Cassel is made of.

I think they'll do ok. Will they win? Hard to say. But I don't think they'll lose by much if they do.

Casell is a huge part of the game, but so is the defense and the rest of the offense.

Here's another thing you guys don't realize. I've hated the Pats since the Snowplow game and they certainly weren't on top back then. Champagne Tony Eason? Please! Hell, they were an embarrassment to the AFC when the Bears beat their asses. Shove that "You hate them cause they are on top" crap! How bad do people hate USC? I guarantee more people hate Notre Dame than any other college football team and they ain't won Jack in a decade! Also see : New York Yankees. You see, it isn't about you casual, Johnny come lately, think you are "hardcore", weak ass football "fans" who can't find a bandwagon to jump on quick enough. I've had enough of your banal "Running up the score is cool" BS. That is for dips***ts and casual fans. REAL football fans want to see a great game. That is, of course, unless it's USC beating down OSU. That's entertainment!:hithere:

Yeah, it is. People just hate on teams when they are on top. You would think that sports fans would find some admiration in such a well tuned football team as the Pats have been for the last few years.

Especially when you are a Rams fan like me! :lol:

Here's another thing you guys don't realize. I've hated the Pats since the Snowplow game and they certainly weren't on top back then

What made you hate them then?

Also see : New York Yankees.

I used to hate the Yankees because they would win all the time. I don't hate them anymore, I just don't like them as they are in the Red Sox division.

I've had enough of your banal "Running up the score is cool" BS. That is for dips***ts and casual fans. REAL football fans want to see a great game. That is, of course, unless it's USC beating down OSU. That's entertainment!:hithere:

Shouldn't some blame fall on the defense? Like I said, show me any team that will just lay down and stop scoring at some point.

Yeah, when you are up by quite a bit, you could start to run the ball, but if you don't normally do that, why change your game plan? If a team that runs as much as they pass was up by a lot and they simply continued to not run and only pass, then I'd say they are running up the score. When a team like the Pat's (last year anyway) pretty much passed a LOT more then they ran chooses to continue to Pass regardless of the score, that's just them playing football.

I agree it can make games boring at times, but I don't expect any team to just hit a certain point in a game and decide that's enough points.

Here's another thing you guys don't realize. I've hated the Pats since the Snowplow game and they certainly weren't on top back then. Champagne Tony Eason? Please! Hell, they were an embarrassment to the AFC when the Bears beat their asses. Shove that "You hate them cause they are on top" crap! How bad do people hate USC? I guarantee more people hate Notre Dame than any other college football team and they ain't won Jack in a decade! Also see : New York Yankees. You see, it isn't about you casual, Johnny come lately, think you are "hardcore", weak ass football "fans" who can't find a bandwagon to jump on quick enough. I've had enough of your banal "Running up the score is cool" BS. That is for dips***ts and casual fans. REAL football fans want to see a great game. That is, of course, unless it's USC beating down OSU. That's entertainment!:hithere:

Hate them all you want. Fine by me. I could care less as a Pats fan. Nobody is saying running up the score is cool but it happens and it is also not something to cry about. Other teams can stop that ala the Giants in the superbowl. I'm not going to feel bad for millionaire football players. Its not the hate of the team that gets me, its the silly crap like cheatriots, ****, karma and running up the score that makes me think if people actually know what football is. This is football, watch the WNBA if you want to cry about things all the time.

See- The snowplow game. Infamous for Dolphin fans and, aside from NE fans, no one else really cares or remembers. Be a fan. Do a google search. Join me in my hatred of all things Chowderhead.

See- The snowplow game. Infamous for Dolphin fans and, aside from NE fans, no one else really cares or remembers. Be a fan. Do a google search. Join me in my hatred of all things Chowderhead.

I did find it.

I don't see the big deal - it wasn't agains the rules and I'm sure other teams might have tried to do the same thing in the same position. I'd just call it a benefit of home field advantage.

I just don't understand hanging on to old grievances like this. If it just happened last year, maybe. But really, sports are all about the here and now. As fans, we get no benefit from last years wins, let alone wins from years prior, so who cares?

I know many are still upset at last years Superbowl loss. Why should anyone care? Yeah, it was a bummer. But the whole purpose of sports is to entertain - and I'll be damned if I wasn't entertained every minute of last season - even every minute of the superbowl. The only thing the loss did was saved me some money as I had no superbowl champion gear to buy.

You and I are just 2 different types of fans. I enjoy the history and tradition of the NFL. I understand that while it is entertainment, those guys give every ounce of strength and will, typically every game. Their body's are trashed, but they don't do it to entertain. They do it for the love of the game and the respect they have for each other( and some money). I respect that.
Grudges are part of the game. You think any Raiders fans will ever forgive the BS call that kept them out of the Superbowl? Did you know that at Stanford, the premiere West Coast Academic school, that the "official" record of that game with the Cal Bears when there were several laterals on the last play of the game? The one where Cal scores when the band is on the field? Stanford doesn't acknowledge Cal winning that game!! Thousands of Seahawk fans still claim that the Refs cost them the game and will never give the Steelers props.Grudges, as long as they aren't all consuming rage type deals, are fun!

That's absurd. How many Super Bowls did Brady win without Moss? How many Super Bowls has Brady won with Moss? Come to think of it, how many Super Bowls has Moss won period?

Yeah, and were the Patriots ever even NEARLY as dominant as they were last year? Nope, not even close. Brady is good, but he's never played with a non superbowl caliber team. He's nothing fantastic.

Raiders fans should get over themselves ;) Your talking about the tuck rule, right? Its a rule. Everything I saw back then indicated the rule was called correctly. What is there to be upset about? Perhaps their teams performance, but hardly a valid calling of a rule.

And as far as the history - I think that's all good and well too to a point. And for whatever reasons these guys play, the whole purpose behind it is entertainment. I think many (not necessarily yourself) forget that and take it far too seriously sometimes.

Yeah, and were the Patriots ever even NEARLY as dominant as they were last year? Nope, not even close. Brady is good, but he's never played with a non superbowl caliber team. He's nothing fantastic.

Then I assume you feel the same about Peyton Manning?

Brady is a good player. Its the little stuff that matters. We saw it last week when Cassell took over. In a 3rd down play, Cassell chose to take a sack rather then throw the ball away which pulled them out of field goal range. Brady would have thrown the ball away.

Just listen to what the experts say about him.

What "experts"? You mean the same guys that gave Brady the MVP of the Rams Superbowl when everyone who watched the game knew that it was Vinateri that was the MVP? You see, QB jerseys sell way more than kickers. The "entertainment" industry is all about marketing. BTW- The "tuck" rule was changed after that season, to fit the ruling they had on the field at the time, which nobody had ever heard of until then. But, hey, I ain't gonna argue about it. Find yourself some drunk Raider fans and tell them what time it is!!!

What "experts"? You mean the same guys that gave Brady the MVP of the Rams Superbowl when everyone who watched the game knew that it was Vinateri that was the MVP? You see, QB jerseys sell way more than kickers. The "entertainment" industry is all about marketing. BTW- The "tuck" rule was changed after that season, to fit the ruling they had on the field at the time, which nobody had ever heard of until then. But, hey, I ain't gonna argue about it. Find yourself some drunk Raider fans and tell them what time it is!!!

All the announcers..etc. Its not just the local guys I hear it from. Cassell seems to be doing fine, but I have a feeling the score would be a little different. How exactly do you classify a great QB?

I wasn't aware the tuck rule was changed, but I don't really care anyway. Even if it had been reversed, I certainly wouldn't care about it anymore anyway.

Raiders fans should get over themselves ;) Your talking about the tuck rule, right? Its a rule. Everything I saw back then indicated the rule was called correctly. What is there to be upset about? Perhaps their teams performance, but hardly a valid calling of a rule.

And as far as the history - I think that's all good and well too to a point. And for whatever reasons these guys play, the whole purpose behind it is entertainment. I think many (not necessarily yourself) forget that and take it far too seriously sometimes.


i'm not sure if that rule was ever called before that game, and not sure if its ever been called again...;)

Yeah, and were the Patriots ever even NEARLY as dominant as they were last year? Nope, not even close. Brady is good, but he's never played with a non superbowl caliber team. He's nothing fantastic.



Brady is nothing fantastic, hey? How do you figure that assessment? :what:

Dude, seriously. ALL of the Announcers are approved by the NFL. There are players you can't touch, like Brady, Manning, Tomlinson. You know , the guys that sell jerseys.
At this point, and I feel pretty confident about saying this: You seem to be a casual fan, hitching your wagon when they are good and "not caring" when they don't win. We are different.


All the announcers..etc. Its not just the local guys I hear it from. Cassell seems to be doing fine, but I have a feeling the score would be a little different. How exactly do you classify a great QB?

I wasn't aware the tuck rule was changed, but I don't really care anyway. Even if it had been reversed, I certainly wouldn't care about it anymore anyway.

There has been a theme through the years. The great QB's in the League always have a superb defense. Weird huh?
During every Dynasty run, Dallas, Pittsburgh, San Fran,NE, they all had great D's and a great ground game. The one exception would be Marino. Anyway, If you have a stud D , running back and wide receivers , just how good of a QB do you have to be? Bradys TEAM won those SB's, not Brady. Put Brady on the Raiders or Dolphins right now. Are they a playoff team then? Not a chance in hell. there is no more professional TEAM game than football.


Brady is nothing fantastic, hey? How do you figure that assessment? :what:

Dude, seriously. ALL of the Announcers are approved by the NFL. There are players you can't touch, like Brady, Manning, Tomlinson. You know , the guys that sell jerseys.
At this point, and I feel pretty confident about saying this: You seem to be a casual fan, hitching your wagon when they are good and "not caring" when they don't win. We are different.

Like I said, who do you see as great QB's?

And as far as my being a casual fan? I guess it depends on the definition. I really wasn't much of a football fan until a number of years ago. Just prior to their first superbowl win. I simply started going to more games through work and enjoying it and started watching. Since then, I try to watch every game I can and it has nothing to do with winning or losing. A loss just isn't going to upset me as much as it does others. I was more upset the year they lost to the Colts in the playoffs then their superbowl lost last year. The way I see it, if I get to watch them play in every possible game they can and they compete well, then I'll be happy. They did that last year.

Great QBs? Elway, Young, Farve. I see those guys as having the ability, in their prime, to go to a team and be able to carry that team.
I can't have Marino, Unitas and guys like them because of a lack of mobility. Being a mobile QB gives your team so many more options and such an added dimension, that mobile QB's are, to me, a step above the others. Granted that's just my opinion.

what about the years when brady had no wr's, you know when reche caldwell was his number 1? what about the running game? its been rb by committee for a long time there. maroney now -- when he's not hurt. Dillon before that, for what, one year? Brady still puts up numbers year in and year out. Last year was the first year you can consider the pat's team as loaded -- offensively. Their defense wasn't a top level defense.

Dillon was a friggin beast dude.

And to say that the D wasn't "top level"? Huh? That's like saying Al Davis hasn't lost it.

Watson @ tight end?

Did they win the SB when Caldwell was #1?

Deion Branch couldn't play? OK.....whatever.

Great QBs? Elway, Young, Farve. I see those guys as having the ability, in their prime, to go to a team and be able to carry that team.
I can't have Marino, Unitas and guys like them because of a lack of mobility. Being a mobile QB gives your team so many more options and such an added dimension, that mobile QB's are, to me, a step above the others. Granted that's just my opinion.

So if Brady is on the Patriots his whole career and they surround him with decent players, you wouldn't consider him a great QB because of it?

I guess Bill Belichick isn't a great coach either, he just gets great players?

I'm no Peyton Manning fan, but I think he's a great QB as well and could end his career in the same place as Brady which I think could be the same as those you consider great.

That's the thing. Your opinion, while different than mine, is just as valid, even without a vast amount of football knowledge to back it up. Fairly subjective. Truthfully a lot of this is just opinion and, while it was fun for a while, I'm getting bored with this. Never will be a big Manning fan and Brady, well, that's just silly. Later.

Edit- Lastly- Bellicheck is an ass. Great Coach when he was fired by the Browns right? I never said he wasn't a good coach. That was you. Don't try to put words in my mouth to support your own argument. Dude is a dick.

alright, man... were obviously going to continue to disagree no matter what. No they didn't win the SB with caldwell, but they were one of the top teams that year. No the def wasn't a top d last year. the same as this year. Branch could play? Hmm... where is he now? Seattle for the last two years and what has he done? Dillon was a beast -- for the bangles. Why wasn't he picked up after the pats released him? My point is, Brady has been a top QB in the league since he took over for bledsoe. The only Pats team that could be called offensively loaded was last year, when they brought in Welker, Moss, and Stallworth.

So with that, I will agree to disagree with you on this. BECAUSE NONE OF IT IS HELPING MY RAIDERS!!!!

Edit- Lastly- Bellicheck is an ass. Great Coach when he was fired by the Browns right? I never said he wasn't a good coach. That was you. Don't try to put words in my mouth to support your own argument. Dude is a dick.

It was more of a question then my putting words in your mouth. But it does go along the same lines with your thinking of Brady. Manning too I suppose.

alright, man... were obviously going to continue to disagree no matter what. No they didn't win the SB with caldwell, but they were one of the top teams that year. No the def wasn't a top d last year. the same as this year. Branch could play? Hmm... where is he now? Seattle for the last two years and what has he done? Dillon was a beast -- for the bangles. Why wasn't he picked up after the pats released him? My point is, Brady has been a top QB in the league since he took over for bledsoe. The only Pats team that could be called offensively loaded was last year, when they brought in Welker, Moss, and Stallworth.

So with that, I will agree to disagree with you on this. BECAUSE NONE OF IT IS HELPING MY RAIDERS!!!!

I'm with ya and I guess we'll both just agree to agree with each other and disagree with F91 :)

That's the thing. Your opinion, while different than mine, is just as valid, even without a vast amount of football knowledge to back it up. Fairly subjective. Truthfully a lot of this is just opinion and, while it was fun for a while, I'm getting bored with this. Never will be a big Manning fan and Brady, well, that's just silly. Later.

Edit- Lastly- Bellicheck is an ass. Great Coach when he was fired by the Browns right? I never said he wasn't a good coach. That was you. Don't try to put words in my mouth to support your own argument. Dude is a dick.

even without the vast amount of football knowledge hahahahahahaha :haha: did anyone else find this hilarious.

even without the vast amount of football knowledge hahahahahahaha :haha: did anyone else find this hilarious.

I did.

It really doesn't matter what knowledge you have.. just watch the guy play!

I did.

It really doesn't matter what knowledge you have.. just watch the guy play!

Exactly

Poor Brady is out on a year long vacation with his hot model of a wife. Life is rough:D

Seriously though, it'll be interesting to see how well the Pat's do without'em.

that is just flat out wrong. when the coits got knocked out the playoffs last year pats fans were missed because it wasn't the same without them. manning is the reson for that. if manning went down then we would be missed since it would robb us of a great game or two.

also since brady went down the ratings have not been the same. it really did hurt the nfl & that is why the media was pushing the cassell story so much. the pats are simply the nfl's biggest draw so how could brady going down not hurt them.

First- It's a given that no one wants to ever see a player injured. I admit that it looked pretty bad and I wasn't happy to see it happen.
Now there are reports that Brady is done for the year. What I don't get is that almost to a man, the announcers are crying about how this is bad for the NFL fans. Uh.... say what?
The fact that it pretty much removes the Pats from being a shoe-in for the playoffs, every AFC team and its fans are glad they don't have to play NE with Brady. You mean to tell me San Diego fans care about it? Colts fans?
Seriously?? I bet NE fans would cry for months if Manning were done for the year, right?

the pats are simply the nfl's biggest draw so how could brady going down not hurt them.

Perhaps but since you posted this I have tried doing some research to see how accurate this statement is. I haven't found anything conclusive but the MNF game between the Cowboys and Eagles was the highest rated cable show ever.

http://community.tvguide.com/blog-entry/TVGuide-News-Blog/Tv-Guide-Sports/Mnf-Sets-Cable/800046835

It mentions #2 involved last December's Pats v. Ravens game but what the article doesn't mention is #3 was also a Cowboys game. Oct. 23rd 2006 Giants at the Cowboys(source FW star-telegram, couldn't find online link). So it would appear that when the Cowboys have a good team, which the last couple of seasons has the been the case, they can be counted on to draw the biggest ratings. No doubt about the Patriots being a HUGE draw. Their numbers are out of this world on TV ratings as well. I just don't know if it's totally accurate to say they are the NFL's biggest draw. Love 'em or hate 'em, the Cowboys have fans throughout the country. So do the Pats but not to the extent of the Cowboys. They are like the Yankees in this regard, half the people want to see them win, the other half want to see them lose - either way they are tuning in to watch. just my opinion :2cents

Brady is nothing fantastic, hey? How do you figure that assessment? :what:

I figure it because the 2007 Patriots offense was the best offense in NFL history IMO, and I think that with a O-line and WR core like that, any battle hardened smart QB like Brady could have a season like he did. I remember Brady being interviewed last season after a game, and he said "its easy to play QB when you have receivers that are always open and an O-line that never lets anyone touch you." Yes, it is easy to play QB under those circumstances. I don't think that Tom Brady was the biggest factor on that team, I think they could have done just as good with a lot of QB's.

My second point; Do you know who the two highest scoring teams in NFL history are?

#1) 2007 New England Patriots
#2) 1998 Minnesota Vikings

Do you know what they have in common? RANDY MOSS! This player has the most profound impact on the playing field. When you have a player like this on a powerhouse offense like the Pats, it makes your offense unstoppable. Football is all about drawing the double teams. Randy Moss is a player that must be doubled basically the entire game. Coupled with other excellent receivers and a strong running threat, all Brady has to do is not screw up and he'll gain 300 yds per game and throw 4 TD's per game.

I figure it because the 2007 Patriots offense was the best offense in NFL history IMO, and I think that with a O-line and WR core like that, any battle hardened smart QB like Brady could have a season like he did. I remember Brady being interviewed last season after a game, and he said "its easy to play QB when you have receivers that are always open and an O-line that never lets anyone touch you." Yes, it is easy to play QB under those circumstances. I don't think that Tom Brady was the biggest factor on that team, I think they could have done just as good with a lot of QB's.

My second point; Do you know who the two highest scoring teams in NFL history are?

#1) 2007 New England Patriots
#2) 1998 Minnesota Vikings

Do you know what they have in common? RANDY MOSS! This player has the most profound impact on the playing field. When you have a player like this on a powerhouse offense like the Pats, it makes your offense unstoppable. Football is all about drawing the double teams. Randy Moss is a player that must be doubled basically the entire game. Coupled with other excellent receivers and a strong running threat, all Brady has to do is not screw up and he'll gain 300 yds per game and throw 4 TD's per game.

Do you know a current quarterback with a better won-loss record than Tom Brady? Do you know a player in the league with fewer Super Bowl wins than Randy Moss? One thing in common with the three Patriot Super Bowl winning teams of the 00's is the starting quarterback. Do you know of a current quarterback that has won three Super Bowls besides Tom Brady? Any analogy trying to claim Tom Brady is anything other than amazing is just silly in my opinion. The guy just wins games, period. When he took over for Drew Bledsoe I don't think anybody knew the Patriots were great, with Tom Brady, it was clear the team was great.

Tom Brady is a certain Hall of Fame quarterback and if he comes back healthy and has more years like his first 8, he is a likely top two or three all time quarterback. His first 8 years were incredible if leading a team to a victory is the basis for evaluation. If having teams do little with you as a star player is the basis for evaluation, not many players have a record as dismal as Randy Moss. Moss did little to help his team during the game when the Patriots lost their Super Bowl game in the Tom Brady era. I thought Moss was a nice pick up for the Patriots, but he was going nowhere with any other team and his last couple of years made a lot of people think New England was making a mistake to add him to the roster.

Chris

Do you know a current quarterback with a better won-loss record than Tom Brady? Do you know a player in the league with fewer Super Bowl wins than Randy Moss? One thing in common with the three Patriot Super Bowl winning teams of the 00's is the starting quarterback. Do you know of a current quarterback that has won three Super Bowls besides Tom Brady? Any analogy trying to claim Tom Brady is anything other than amazing is just silly in my opinion. The guy just wins games, period. When he took over for Drew Bledsoe I don't think anybody knew the Patriots were great, with Tom Brady, it was clear the team was great.

Tom Brady is a certain Hall of Fame quarterback and if he comes back healthy and has more years like his first 8, he is a likely top two or three all time quarterback. His first 8 years were incredible if leading a team to a victory is the basis for evaluation. If having teams do little with you as a star player is the basis for evaluation, not many players have a record as dismal as Randy Moss. Moss did little to help his team during the game when the Patriots lost their Super Bowl game in the Tom Brady era. I thought Moss was a nice pick up for the Patriots, but he was going nowhere with any other team and his last couple of years made a lot of people think New England was making a mistake to add him to the roster.

Chris

Chris, we all know you've already made up your mind about everything in life and there's no point trying to convince you otherwise. I know these words will bounce right off your robot brain, but you see only what you want to see. Clearly you're convinced that Brady is one of the greatest QB's ever, and there's no changing that.

If Brady is so amazing, and it has nothing to do with his offense or players like Moss, then why is 2007 the only year that he had such great stats?

Oh, and by the way, I can think of a recent QB that won more than 3 superbowls. Troy Aikman. I suppose Aikman is the best QB ever by your logic, right? I'm sure you'll find an excuse why that doesn't count, seeing as though you'll never admit that your logic breaks down when you examine it.

Chris, we all know you've already made up your mind about everything in life and there's no point trying to convince you otherwise. I know these words will bounce right off your robot brain, but you see only what you want to see. Clearly you're convinced that Brady is one of the greatest QB's ever, and there's no changing that.

If Brady is so amazing, and it has nothing to do with his offense or players like Moss, then why is 2007 the only year that he had such great stats?

Oh, and by the way, I can think of a recent QB that won more than 3 superbowls. Troy Aikman. I suppose Aikman is the best QB ever by your logic, right? I'm sure you'll find an excuse why that doesn't count, seeing as though you'll never admit that your logic breaks down when you examine it.

Who do you think is better. Brett Farve or Tom Brady??

Chris, we all know you've already made up your mind about everything in life and there's no point trying to convince you otherwise. I know these words will bounce right off your robot brain, but you see only what you want to see. Clearly you're convinced that Brady is one of the greatest QB's ever, and there's no changing that.

If Brady is so amazing, and it has nothing to do with his offense or players like Moss, then why is 2007 the only year that he had such great stats?

Oh, and by the way, I can think of a recent QB that won more than 3 superbowls. Troy Aikman. I suppose Aikman is the best QB ever by your logic, right? I'm sure you'll find an excuse why that doesn't count, seeing as though you'll never admit that your logic breaks down when you examine it.

Of course you are even wrong about your so called facts. Aikman didn't win more than 3 Super Bowls. Tom Brady's statistics were the best ever last year for any quarterback in the history of the NFL and his statistics every year prior to that were exceptional, especially in the most important area, wins and losses. I didn't care anything about Tom Brady nor the New England Patriots before Brady started his amazing run, I had to actually observe what he was doing, not concernet about personal statistics, but he was concerned about winning and did whatever was necessary.

Your observation about me personally is about as far off as your observations about Tom Brady.

Chris

Who do you think is better. Brett Farve or Tom Brady??

In my opinion at this stage of Tom Brady's career, he is better than Brett Favre at the same stage. Brett has been incredible and incredibly durable, whether or not Brady can do well enough the remainder of his career to end up with a career I consider better than Favre's isn't clear now, but I sure wouldn't be surprised if that happened. Both are amazing to my way of thinking, with Brady obviously having greater success where it counts the most. Favre couldn't match that success, but different teams, different systems and different coaches could have more to do with that than the players themselves.

Chris

Very good discussion about brady. Ntrudr makes a good point that before moss, brady did not really have great individual offensive numbers, esp not from a fantasy standpoint...now pats fans, that does not mean he is not a future hall of fame QB. Pats have a strong system, brady is just very efficient and effective at what he does. Having a strong offensive line certainly helps as well. They used to have a pretty potent running game as well

One could also argue that brady has had better system, better receivers, better offensive line, better coaching, etc than favre. Thus more SB wins.

In my opinion at this stage of Tom Brady's career, he is better than Brett Favre at the same stage. Brett has been incredible and incredibly durable, whether or not Brady can do well enough the remainder of his career to end up with a career I consider better than Favre's isn't clear now, but I sure wouldn't be surprised if that happened. Both are amazing to my way of thinking, with Brady obviously having greater success where it counts the most. Favre couldn't match that success, but different teams, different systems and different coaches could have more to do with that than the players themselves.

Chris

Of course you are even wrong about your so called facts. Aikman didn't win more than 3 Super Bowls.

Aikman won 3, same as Brady. My point stands, I simply mis-quoted you. Typical Chris: avoid the facts by arguing small details. Your logic doesn't add up, unless you admit that Aikman is tied for the best QB ever.



Tom Brady's statistics were the best ever last year for any quarterback in the history of the NFL and his statistics every year prior to that were exceptional, especially in the most important area, wins and losses.

Yes, and I already demonstrated how and why I believe that Tom Brady's single season feat doesn't make him a once in a lifetime QB. Tom Brady agrees with me. He said it himself: "Its easy to play QB when your receivers are always open and you have an O-line that doesn't let anyone touch you."


Your observation about me personally is about as far off as your observations about Tom Brady.

Chris

My observation of you is that you're a robot tool who's incapable of questioning his original programming. You lack critical thinking abilities. All you can do is defend your already determined positions.

Who do you think is better. Brett Farve or Tom Brady??

Gosh I swear there's a 50 page thread of us "debating" that exact question on HDF somewhere... :lol:

Very good discussion about brady. Ntrudr makes a good point that before moss, brady did not really have great individual offensive numbers, esp not from a fantasy standpoint...now pats fans, that does not mean he is not a future hall of fame QB. Pats have a strong system, brady is just very efficient and effective at what he does. Having a strong offensive line certainly helps as well. They used to have a pretty potent running game as well

He's good, he's consistent, he's reliable, he's smart, and he'll probably be a future hall of fame QB. But he's also only played on Superbowl caliber teams, and they've been cheating the whole time.

Aikman won 3, same as Brady. My point stands, I simply mis-quoted you. Typical Chris: avoid the facts by arguing small details. Your logic doesn't add up, unless you admit that Aikman is tied for the best QB ever.




Yes, and I already demonstrated how and why I believe that Tom Brady's single season feat doesn't make him a once in a lifetime QB. Tom Brady agrees with me. He said it himself: "Its easy to play QB when your receivers are always open and you have an O-line that doesn't let anyone touch you."




My observation of you is that you're a robot tool who's incapable of questioning his original programming. You lack critical thinking abilities. All you can do is defend your already determined positions.

You misquoted me? Your statement was just wrong period. I don't think Super Bowl wins are the only statistic that matters, far from it. Aikman was a great QB, I think Brady is better, clearly better and I do think that Aikman was surrounded by great players, Emmit Smith and Michael Irvin for starters and Brady could have several years left to add to his Super Bowl total.

Your opinion about me is as worthless as your other opinions, I won't bother with you further.

Chris

If Brady is so amazing, and it has nothing to do with his offense or players like Moss, then why is 2007 the only year that he had such great stats?

So to be considered great, you have to set records every year?

Brady has shown he is great because regardless of who is out there with him, he wins. Yes, give him an awesome offense and he'll do even better and set single season records.

Brady was great before last year. He's really been great since he took over as QB. He simply knows how to get his team in a position to win - that is what matters and that is what makes him great.

Gosh I swear there's a 50 page thread of us "debating" that exact question on HDF somewhere... :lol:

haha you are probably right

I will say this. Tom Brady took the Patriots to the AFC championship with Reche Caldwell as there number 1 WR. That counts for something. Also I believe Brady lead the league in 2002 with 28TDs and his WRs were not all that great then either.

Brady has never come close to leading the league in INTs either. This is huge. Brady has been pretty mistake free.

Just my :2cents

I will say this. Tom Brady took the Patriots to the AFC championship with Reche Caldwell as there number 1 WR. That counts for something. Also I believe Brady lead the league in 2002 with 28TDs and his WRs were not all that great then either.

Does that really matter though?

Just look at his W/L record. Doesn't he have the best W/L record of any active QB right now?

Does that really matter though?

Just look at his W/L record. Doesn't he have the best W/L record of any active QB right now?

Yes, at least any that have played in more than just a few games and it is among the best all-time, his record is absolutely amazing. I hope he can recover and come back and play just like he did in 2007, such greatness in any sport is rare.

Chris

I tried to piece together Tom Brady's career won-loss record as starting QB, I couldn't find it accumulated anywhere but I came up with 125 starts and 99 wins but that might be wrong, although I am pretty sure it is very close. I also believe that is the best for any starting QB in the history of the NFL with over 20 starts. That is an average year of about 12.5 wins and 3.5 losses projected to a 16 game season average, how difficult would that be to top?

Chris

Anytime a QB does well there are going to be naysayers. Montana has them , Elway and the list goes on.

Does that really matter though?

Just look at his W/L record. Doesn't he have the best W/L record of any active QB right now?

It does matter. Just like his W/L record. It just goes to show that Brady can perform extremely well with basically nothing and he can break records when he has a legit target to throw to.

Nobody came up with anything different for Tom Brady than my math in my head totals? He was 18-1 last year, his winning percentage overall including playoffs has to be best ever, I just don't think second place is even close.

Chris

I tried to piece together Tom Brady's career won-loss record as starting QB, I couldn't find it accumulated anywhere but I came up with 125 starts and 99 wins but that might be wrong, although I am pretty sure it is very close. I also believe that is the best for any starting QB in the history of the NFL with over 20 starts. That is an average year of about 12.5 wins and 3.5 losses projected to a 16 game season average, how difficult would that be to top?

Chris

This site is unbeatable for NFL statistics:
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/

This site is unbeatable for NFL statistics:
http://www.pro-football-reference.com/

Thanks, that shows Tom Brady with 100 wins in 127 starts, a winning percentage of 78.74%. I knew I was close. Joe Montana's career was 135 wins 54 losses for a percentage of 71.43% and nobody else I checked was even close to Tom Brady in terms of winning percentage. Tom would have to go 35 and 27 to drop down to Joe's percentage over the remainder of his career.

Chris

Heh..prepare for the wrath from the pats fans ;)

He's good, he's consistent, he's reliable, he's smart, and he'll probably be a future hall of fame QB. But he's also only played on Superbowl caliber teams, and they've been cheating the whole time.

now your saying any QB could have.......sorry but NO QB has ever had a season like that. think about it, Aikman had easily the best offensive line and NFL history plus two legit HOF weapons and he didn't ever have a season like that. Montana and Young had Rice and a load of offensive weapons and neither had a season like that. Kurt Warner had 2 HOF wideouts and a HOF running back plus a very stacked offensive line which is lead by future HOFer Pace and he still didn't have 50 td's. in essense all those HOF's and battle tested QB's had better weapons and all succeeded.

Brady lead the NFL in TD's with troy Brown and david pattern at this starting wideouts and you still think he has done nothing to show he's maybe the best of all time. now that's just pure haterade talking. you can't even count on 1 hand how many former player sitting in the booth that have stated Brady isn't one of the best of all time but you still think your opinion is worth more.

sometimes it's better to stay quiet and be thought of as a fool then to speak up and disprove all doubt.

that's a great saying. i'm not saying your a fool about everything, just with this topic.


hey remember that whole "the packers are lost without farve" comments you were throwing around. remember i kept saying the packers would be fine and i bet Rodgers would end up being great. then that exact week farve went down and Rodgers ended up playing great. also remember you kept saying any QB including Cassell could lead that team. look Brady is out and Farve has moved on and we are getting to see just how right i was and how wrong you were, 1 more time. Rodgers is playing great while Cassell can't get his team in the endzone and keeps over and under throwing Moss.


I figure it because the 2007 Patriots offense was the best offense in NFL history IMO, and I think that with a O-line and WR core like that, any battle hardened smart QB like Brady could have a season like he did. I remember Brady being interviewed last season after a game, and he said "its easy to play QB when you have receivers that are always open and an O-line that never lets anyone touch you." Yes, it is easy to play QB under those circumstances. I don't think that Tom Brady was the biggest factor on that team, I think they could have done just as good with a lot of QB's.

My second point; Do you know who the two highest scoring teams in NFL history are?

#1) 2007 New England Patriots
#2) 1998 Minnesota Vikings

Do you know what they have in common? RANDY MOSS! This player has the most profound impact on the playing field. When you have a player like this on a powerhouse offense like the Pats, it makes your offense unstoppable. Football is all about drawing the double teams. Randy Moss is a player that must be doubled basically the entire game. Coupled with other excellent receivers and a strong running threat, all Brady has to do is not screw up and he'll gain 300 yds per game and throw 4 TD's per game.

Heh..prepare for the wrath from the pats fans ;)

what's funny is Ntruder always makes football comments and they backfire. he is becoming the jimmy smith of the football section.

what's also funny about that comment is he seems to forget Brady took over one of the worst teams in NFL history and they had a losing record when he took them over that season.

yup it has nothing to do with brady. we look horriable without him now, we looked horriable before him, troy Brown was a HOF wideout that carried Brady all those years, all the commentators and current players that call Brady the best are fools and Ntruder is the smartest ever, afterall his whole debate on farve not having a good backup QB sure didn't blow up in his face, and man that offensive line all those years we won super bowls were amazing. yup all those offensive linemen that left and couldn't find jobs anywhere in the NFL and even a few got cut from that stacked offensive line over there in Texas, no not the Boys the Texans cut 2 of our starting offensive linemen on our superbowl team the following season. yup that shows you just how stacked those offensive linemen were.

he's just mad that Farve has never passed for 50td's or won more then 1 chip.

it's ok us football fans will have respect for Ntruder like we all had for Jimmy Smith in the gaming section.

He's good, he's consistent, he's reliable, he's smart, and he'll probably be a future hall of fame QB. But he's also only played on Superbowl caliber teams, and they've been cheating the whole time.


Brady has played on good teams. but it is he that makes them superbowl caliber...

Brady has played on good teams. but it is he that makes them superbowl caliber...

Well put.

So to be considered great, you have to set records every year?

Brady has shown he is great because regardless of who is out there with him, he wins. Yes, give him an awesome offense and he'll do even better and set single season records.

Brady was great before last year. He's really been great since he took over as QB. He simply knows how to get his team in a position to win - that is what matters and that is what makes him great.

Check my previous posts, I'm not saying Brady sucks. I think I even called him a "great" QB. But when people act like he's the greatest QB to grace the sport, I have to laugh in their face.

now your saying any QB could have.......sorry but NO QB has ever had a season like that. think about it, Aikman had easily the best offensive line and NFL history plus two legit HOF weapons and he didn't ever have a season like that. Montana and Young had Rice and a load of offensive weapons and neither had a season like that. Kurt Warner had 2 HOF wideouts and a HOF running back plus a very stacked offensive line which is lead by future HOFer Pace and he still didn't have 50 td's. in essense all those HOF's and battle tested QB's had better weapons and all succeeded.

Brady lead the NFL in TD's with troy Brown and david pattern at this starting wideouts and you still think he has done nothing to show he's maybe the best of all time. now that's just pure haterade talking. you can't even count on 1 hand how many former player sitting in the booth that have stated Brady isn't one of the best of all time but you still think your opinion is worth more.

sometimes it's better to stay quiet and be thought of as a fool then to speak up and disprove all doubt.

that's a great saying. i'm not saying your a fool about everything, just with this topic.


hey remember that whole "the packers are lost without farve" comments you were throwing around. remember i kept saying the packers would be fine and i bet Rodgers would end up being great. then that exact week farve went down and Rodgers ended up playing great. also remember you kept saying any QB including Cassell could lead that team. look Brady is out and Farve has moved on and we are getting to see just how right i was and how wrong you were, 1 more time. Rodgers is playing great while Cassell can't get his team in the endzone and keeps over and under throwing Moss.

#1: I'm saying that Brady's 2007 record was mostly the result of a stellar 11 man offense, NOT mostly the result of a once in a lifetime QB carrying his team on his shoulders. Nothing more.

I'll repeat Brady's quote yet again:
"Its easy to play QB when your receivers are always open and you have an O-line that doesn't let anyone touch you"

That, and that alone, is my point. Its easy to play QB under those conditions, and I'd bet that a handful of QB's in recent years could have/would have matched those numbers. To pretend that Brady is some God in human form and that it was all him is laughable.

#2: Aaron Rodgers is a damn good quarterback. He studied for 3 years under the greatest QB to have ever lived. Rodgers has a rocket arm, excellent vision, knows how to manipulate defensive backs with his eyes, and can move out of the pocket. And he's surrounded by talented players. Thats why the Packers are afloat.

Cassel is a garbage QB who hasn't started a game since what, high school? Cassel is for the most part, squandering the talent around him, and thats why the Patriots aren't going 16-0.

To compare the Packers situation to the Patriots situation is comparing apples to oranges. Rodgers was a 1st round pick destined to replace Favre, and was trained to do so, and he had the entire 2008 offseason to prepare for the starting roll. Cassel is a nobody who they keep in the roster in case the unthinkable happens. And in 1 minute's notice, he's thrown into the starting roll of the former AFC champions. These two situations couldn't be more different, and the team's success shouldn't be compared in that way

what's funny is Ntruder always makes football comments and they backfire. he is becoming the jimmy smith of the football section.

what's also funny about that comment is he seems to forget Brady took over one of the worst teams in NFL history and they had a losing record when he took them over that season.

yup it has nothing to do with brady. we look horriable without him now, we looked horriable before him, troy Brown was a HOF wideout that carried Brady all those years, all the commentators and current players that call Brady the best are fools and Ntruder is the smartest ever, afterall his whole debate on farve not having a good backup QB sure didn't blow up in his face, and man that offensive line all those years we won super bowls were amazing. yup all those offensive linemen that left and couldn't find jobs anywhere in the NFL and even a few got cut from that stacked offensive line over there in Texas, no not the Boys the Texans cut 2 of our starting offensive linemen on our superbowl team the following season. yup that shows you just how stacked those offensive linemen were.

he's just mad that Farve has never passed for 50td's or won more then 1 chip.

it's ok us football fans will have respect for Ntruder like we all had for Jimmy Smith in the gaming section.

They don't backfire. They are just read by Northeastern American Patriots sack riders who defend Bellicheat tooth and nail, and think that Brady is a god, and when I say something that upsets their vision of the world, they (including you) get their panties into a big bundle because they don't want to hear it.

The funny thing is, when I'm saying that Brady isn't the greatest QB in the world; his team, the 2007 Patriots was the greatest team in the world, you Patriot sweating douche bags still get pissed. Even though I've given your team the highest possible compliment, you all still get your panties into a bundle, because you want everything. You want the greatest team in the world, AND the greatest QB in the world. You even need the god damn NBA championship. And the damn World Series. Your sports trophies have all gone to your heads

You dorks won't even think about what I'm saying. Brady's record season was the result of a once per generation football team. If I'm wrong, and Brady is just this god, then why hasn't he thrown 50 TD's every season? They have won Superbowls before. Why wasn't Brady matching his 07 stats?

Brady has played on good teams. but it is he that makes them superbowl caliber...

Sheer coincidence that Randy Moss was on the two highest scoring teams in the history of the NFL? I suppose Brady made Moss the best receiver in the league, not the other way around? :lol:

#1: I'm saying that Brady's 2007 record was mostly the result of a stellar 11 man offense, NOT mostly the result of a once in a lifetime QB carrying his team on his shoulders. Nothing more.

I'll repeat Brady's quote yet again:
"Its easy to play QB when your receivers are always open and you have an O-line that doesn't let anyone touch you"


#2: Aaron Rodgers is a damn good quarterback. He studied for 3 years under the greatest QB to have ever lived.



The "greatest QB to have ever lived" threw multiple 20+ INT seasons and only won 1 superbowl. I am not saying Brady is the greatest QB ever but look at the stats, neither is Farve. The longest lasting QB ever. Now thats Farve.

Wow

Sheer coincidence that Randy Moss was on the two highest scoring teams in the history of the NFL? I suppose Brady made Moss the best receiver in the league, not the other way around? :lol:


and remind me of how moss was when culpepper had down years in minny... pretty much quit and threw his qb under a bus. he really brought my raiders passing offense to an elite level, right? think he quit on them his last year there, and then refused to even talk to kiffin until he was traded last year. And we will see how things go in NE this year with a qb other than brady throwing him the ball. So yes, i think brady did have a big part in moss having an elite year last year, just as i think culpepper had a big part in the years in minny. if not, moss would continue to have elite years no matter who is throwing the ball to him.