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Blu-Ray Group Touts Euro Growth

HighDefRealist
02-14-2008, 04:46 AM
Blu-ray group touts Euro growth[b]
By Sam Andrews

Feb 14, 2008

LONDON -- Just two months after reaching the 1 million-unit mark, Blu-ray disc movie sales across Europe have smashed through the [b]2 million-barrier, the Blu-ray Disc Association European Promotions Committee said Wednesday.

The latest figures from Media Control Gfk International show Blu-ray movie sales totaling 2.4 million, or 79% of the high-definition movie discs bought by consumers in the year-to-date across Europe.

Sales leading up Christmas were strong, with more than half a million Blu-ray movie discs sold in December, outselling HD-DVD by 3-to-1 margin and capturing a 75% market share.

The biggest Christmas release was "Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End," with sales of nearly 100,000 units. This was joined by impressive sales for "The Simpsons Movie" and "Casino Royale."

The BDA claimed that the data showed "a rapidly accelerating rate in the growth of Blu-ray Disc sales across Europe" and that it was now becoming firmly established as the next generation format.


Quoting Screen Digest data, it also compared Blu-ray's rate of growth with that of standard DVD.

"DVD-Video was first introduced into Western Europe in 1997, and the following year some 230,000 DVD players were installed and 2 million discs were sold through," the group said. "In comparison, Blu-ray Disc made its first tentative launch in Western Europe in 2006, and the following year some 3.2 million PlayStation 3 (PS3) consoles and 34,000 standalone players were installed, while 2.3 million Blu-ray discs sold through."

BDA European Promotions Committee chairman Frank Simonis said the sales data proved that Blu-ray had reached a "tipping point."

"News from Warner Bros. at CES last month caught the headlines, but what this news proves is that the tipping point in the format war in Europe happened several months prior to CES and the tide has been running strongly in favor of Blu-ray Disc for many months," he said. "Our challenge now is to move Blu-ray Disc into the mainstream."

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/hr/content_display/international/news/e3if908f8e7990b7157065a14eacddd44ae

Great news for HDM. The real highlight of this article is that it shows how BD is actually ahead of the curve set by DVD last time around by selling 2.3million discs instead of the 2million that DVD had sold at this point.

MikeRox
02-14-2008, 06:17 AM
The difference is how many of those Blu-ray discs have been given away though. Pretty much every PS3 includes 2 Blu-ray movies that add to the sales now, and there have been 1 million PS3s sold in the UK. Even if 1 fifth of them included the 2 free Blu-rays that'd be about 20% of the disc sales just in the UK alone (they pass through PoS so count as "sold".)

When I've spoken to retailers, actual sales of HDM have apparently been dire and the PS3 has been a complete blessing for HDM full stop so far in at least just getting some sales.

HighDefRealist
02-14-2008, 06:35 AM
The difference is how many of those Blu-ray discs have been given away though. Pretty much every PS3 includes 2 Blu-ray movies that add to the sales now, and there have been 1 million PS3s sold in the UK. Even if 1 fifth of them included the 2 free Blu-rays that'd be about 20% of the disc sales just in the UK alone (they pass through PoS so count as "sold".)

When I've spoken to retailers, actual sales of HDM have apparently been dire and the PS3 has been a complete blessing for HDM full stop so far in at least just getting some sales.
I think when you take in to account the fact that people need a new TV to watch Blu-ray whereas they didn't for DVD, then it's amazing that Blu-ray would even be in the same ball park, let alone leading, though I take you're point that some titles have been bundled with the PS3 to help launch.

ssjLancer
02-14-2008, 08:48 AM
The difference is how many of those Blu-ray discs have been given away though. Pretty much every PS3 includes 2 Blu-ray movies that add to the sales now, and there have been 1 million PS3s sold in the UK. Even if 1 fifth of them included the 2 free Blu-rays that'd be about 20% of the disc sales just in the UK alone (they pass through PoS so count as "sold".)

When I've spoken to retailers, actual sales of HDM have apparently been dire and the PS3 has been a complete blessing for HDM full stop so far in at least just getting some sales.You mean Casino Royale and Spiderman 3? Those arent included in sales numbers.

8ch-DeeorDie
02-14-2008, 09:05 AM
I am not impressed at all about the fact that Blu-ray has sold more discs in its first year compared to DVD.

Lets look at the differences, in 1997 230,000 dvd players sold 2 million discs.

For Blu-ray to sell 2.3 million discs, it takes 3.2 million PS3s.

Sony was smart to make Blu-ray a part of the PS3 system, but it definately does not mean Blu-ray is more popular than dvd was at the begining.

HighDefRealist
02-14-2008, 09:57 AM
I am not impressed at all about the fact that Blu-ray has sold more discs in its first year compared to DVD.

Lets look at the differences, in 1997 230,000 dvd players sold 2 million discs.

For Blu-ray to sell 2.3 million discs, it takes 3.2 million PS3s.

Sony was smart to make Blu-ray a part of the PS3 system, but it definately does not mean Blu-ray is more popular than dvd was at the begining.

I'd agree that BD is probably on a par with the DVD curve which is very encouraging!

apocolypse
02-14-2008, 10:14 AM
I'd agree that BD is probably on a par with the DVD curve which is very encouraging!

I think you kinda missed his point though. ;)

HighDefRealist
02-14-2008, 10:15 AM
I think you kinda missed his point though. ;)
I guess I must be. Feel free to enlighten me :confused:

apocolypse
02-14-2008, 10:23 AM
I guess I must be. Feel free to enlighten me :confused:

"Lets look at the differences, in 1997 230,000 dvd players sold 2 million discs.

For Blu-ray to sell 2.3 million discs, it takes 3.2 million PS3s."


Yes, disk sales are actually better for BD in comparison, but there's also over 10 times the BD capable hardware available than there was DVD hardware that it's being compared to. I believe that's the point that 8ch is making.

MikeRox
02-14-2008, 10:25 AM
You mean Casino Royale and Spiderman 3? Those arent included in sales numbers.

No I mean the choice 2 titles from a list of 8 such as Fantastic Four, Xmen, Black Hawk down etc that places like HMV have on with the purchase of every PlayStation 3 console.

HighDefRealist
02-14-2008, 11:07 AM
"Lets look at the differences, in 1997 230,000 dvd players sold 2 million discs.

For Blu-ray to sell 2.3 million discs, it takes 3.2 million PS3s."


Yes, disk sales are actually better for BD in comparison, but there's also over 10 times the BD capable hardware available than there was DVD hardware that it's being compared to. I believe that's the point that 8ch is making.
Sure, but that's only half the story. There are only a fraction of the people around today that TV's capable of displaying in High Def, compared to the number of people in 1997 that were able to watch DVD on compatible TV's.

8ch-DeeorDie
02-14-2008, 12:25 PM
Sure, but that's only half the story. There are only a fraction of the people around today that TV's capable of displaying in High Def, compared to the number of people in 1997 that were able to watch DVD on compatible TV's.

Obviously, the overwhelming majority of people buying Blu-ray discs are PS3 owners (who probably already have an HDTV).

The difference in 1997 though, was that the consumer had to actually made a CHOICE for the dvd format. Today, if someone is a Playstation fan, and they pick up the new PS3, they are not necessarily CHOOSING Blu-ray. It just comes with the game system and so a portion of them try it out and they probably like it.

If Blu-ray was actually at the same demand level that dvd was in 1997, then with the 3.2 million PS3s, there should be around 30 million Blu-ray discs sold.

apocolypse
02-14-2008, 12:31 PM
Sure, but that's only half the story. There are only a fraction of the people around today that TV's capable of displaying in High Def, compared to the number of people in 1997 that were able to watch DVD on compatible TV's.

I don't think so. Last I heard, something like 70% or so of the PS3s sold are being hooked up to a HDTV.

Although I'm not sure if that represented NA stats, or worldwide stats.

HighDefRealist
02-14-2008, 12:38 PM
Obviously, the overwhelming majority of people buying Blu-ray discs are PS3 owners (who probably already have an HDTV).
Some will and some won't. But the point is that these PS3 owners don't HAVE to buy BDs. If they choose to because of they own a PS3 then that is a victory for clever marketing by Sony for sure, but it is still a choice that the consumer is making and a very encouraging one for Blu-ray and hdm.

The difference in 1997 though, was that the consumer had to actually made a CHOICE for the dvd format. Today, if someone is a Playstation fan, and they pick up the new PS3, they are not necessarily CHOOSING Blu-ray. It just comes with the game system and so a portion of them try it out and they probably like it.
But like I've just said, the consumer doesn't have to buy blu-ray discs. Indeed you only have to listen to the hd-dvd propaganda machine to realise that many have not. Also, as I mentioned before, the people in 1997 didn't have to purchase a new TV!


If Blu-ray was actually at the same demand level that dvd was in 1997, then with the 3.2 million PS3s, there should be around 30 million Blu-ray discs sold.
Sorry, but that is nuts! :eek:

Harry Seldon
02-14-2008, 12:40 PM
Is Euro growth some kind of French fungus?

kdj2004
02-14-2008, 01:34 PM
Obviously, the overwhelming majority of people buying Blu-ray discs are PS3 owners (who probably already have an HDTV).

The difference in 1997 though, was that the consumer had to actually made a CHOICE for the dvd format. Today, if someone is a Playstation fan, and they pick up the new PS3, they are not necessarily CHOOSING Blu-ray. It just comes with the game system and so a portion of them try it out and they probably like it.

If Blu-ray was actually at the same demand level that dvd was in 1997, then with the 3.2 million PS3s, there should be around 30 million Blu-ray discs sold.

I think it is wrong to only link PS3 to BDs sold and think that it is the only progress being made. The fact that there are also games sold for the console, that should also been seen as what the PS3 is doing. That is why in December Sony boasted of moving 1,000,000 BDs and almost 20,000,000 game discs. Those PS3s that are not buying movies are buying games all to the benefit of Sony. So to say that 3.2 million PS3s = 2.3 million discs is completely wrong

apocolypse
02-14-2008, 02:28 PM
I think it is wrong to only link PS3 to BDs sold and think that it is the only progress being made. The fact that there are also games sold for the console, that should also been seen as what the PS3 is doing. That is why in December Sony boasted of moving 1,000,000 BDs and almost 20,000,000 game discs. Those PS3s that are not buying movies are buying games all to the benefit of Sony. So to say that 3.2 million PS3s = 2.3 million discs is completely wrong

Huh? Every PS3 is a Blu Ray capable player, as has been pointed out time and time again. So if you want to throw SALs into the mix, the numbers begin looking even more lopsided, not less. We aren't looking at game discs sold, since this is concerning "Blu Ray" and "HD-DVD".

DarkCode
02-14-2008, 05:37 PM
Shocking how they spread this blasphemous egocentric mantra that they've won the European people over with blessings in the form of Blu-ray disk. However, the reality, even using their own statistics shows very much so otherwise.

How can one put their full support into something, not necessarily a format, but anything being marketed, when the sales are undermined by asterisks. Asterisks that highlight the lies that lay the shaky foundation of the BDA's optimism. Think about it for a second, if their attempting to proclaim victory and being on par with the original DVD format, how is it that the numbers given show otherwise?

Back in 1997, the DVD format was not pushing risky marketing practices with more product being given to the consumer than is sold. If DVD was able to sell 230,000 stand alone players, and 2 million discs, how is that Blu-ray's only able to sell 34,000 stand alone players and falsely proclaim a gaming console as the majority backer of their initiative to bring Blu-ray to the world market as an unopposed successor to DVD. Any person with half the ability to understand the numbers can put the argument together and realize why its valid to say that Blu-ray has proven nothing with these numbers.

All they have proven is that despite their BOGO offers, their free movies included with the portion of the 3.2 million PS3 consoles sold, and furthermore the minimal 34,000 stand alone players sold, that they are only able to surpass the number of disks "sold" that DVD was able to do in 1997. How can one say that one format is in a similar, if not, better position than the current standard when the numbers face opposition in the form of common sense.

You can't say something is doing better than something else by giving a reasoning such as what has been proposed: more theoretical players out there, minimally larger number of total discs "sold". There are over 14x the number of "theoretical" Blu-ray players out there in Europe if you include the PS3, but there is only a 15% greater number of discs out there? If Blu-ray was on par with DVD in discs per player proportions, then there should be around 8.7 discs per player, as was in 1997 for DVD, not the current 0.7 discs per player.

Simply put, these numbers have yet again supported a long held belief of mine, numbers lie, and so does the BDA. If you want to see optimism, look somewhere other than Europe if your name just happens to rhyme with "phony".