Xbox 360 owners "Defecting" to PS3 For Sequels?

Gamasutra have posted an article on the apparent shift from the 360 to the PS3 as the platform of choice for multi format titles.

http://www.gamasutra.com/php-bin/news_index.php?story=25927

Would love to hear Cygnus' take on this ;) I know he was really into 2:1 marketshares etc.

Some suggestions for reasons are the increase in PS3 userbase since the slim and also not having to pay for a Gold Subscription to play the title online. I'm sure the latter could make a difference to a few people.

If this shift materialised however, where would that leave peopel who automatically go 360 for the bigger online community?

I read about this last night. It kind of makes sense... after all with the PS3 price cut many 360 owners are now owners of both. If you just got a new system wouldn't you want to buy a new game for it over your old system? That's kind of what happened to me when I first got my PS3 a couple years ago (at just $23 more than they are selling for today too! :D).

I'd expect to see an uptick.

It's clear from Batman: AA sales that more and more 360 users are buying on PS3.

Personally I bought a PS3 because it went slim and had a nice price drop, not to mention adding a 2nd BD player. The Gold subscription fees mean nothing to me, it's only $5 a month and I feel it's worth it. The Xbox was the system of choice for the games I prefered. If I would have liked what was on the PS more, I would of went that direction. No doubt there are games I really like on the PS3 such as GOW3 that made my purchase alot quicker. IMO I think gamers already made their choice by either going Xbox or PS. Price cuts etc, just made it more justifiable to have both systems.

Well take a look at NPD numbers… Besides most ppl go where their friends are. And we know which console has the largest and most competitive online audience ;)

It's clear from Batman: AA sales that more and more 360 users are buying on PS3.

Ummm no...

Sorry GLOW but Batman was another thing entirely. Sony had exclusive Joker levels. When a game is coming off one of the highest grossing movies all time which featured a Joker so unbelievably good your bound to get traction for that sort of thing.

The 360 still outsells many more multiplatforms than the PS3 and, regardless if the percentages show some 360 owners grabbing a PS3 version over the 360 version I can still guarentee you that both the 360 versions of MW2 and AC2 will outsell the PS3 version.

Well take a look at NPD numbers… Besides most ppl go where their friends are. And we know which console has the largest and most competitive online audience ;)

Let's take a look at numbers. A 54% failure rate. People have had enough of what M$ has been shoveling! :lol:

Let the SDF keep dreaming. Last month's NPD showed that 360 had twice as many games listed in top 10 than PS3... But who cares about reality...rite? :what: ;)

Ummm no...

Sorry GLOW but Batman was another thing entirely. Sony had exclusive Joker levels. When a game is coming off one of the highest grossing movies all time which featured a Joker so unbelievably good your bound to get traction for that sort of thing.

The 360 still outsells many more multiplatforms than the PS3 and, regardless if the percentages show some 360 owners grabbing a PS3 version over the 360 version I can still guarentee you that both the 360 versions of MW2 and AC2 will outsell the PS3 version.

Let the SDF keep dreaming. Last month's NPD showed that 360 had twice as many games listed in top 10 than PS3... But who cares about reality...rite? :what: ;)

You are obviously :confused:

Let's take a look at numbers. A 54% failure rate. People have had enough of what M$ has been shoveling! :lol: the only failure this Generation is SONY :hithere:

the only failure this Generation is SONY :hithere:

Um......OK! :rolleyes:

Ummm no...

Sorry GLOW but Batman was another thing entirely. Sony had exclusive Joker levels. When a game is coming off one of the highest grossing movies all time which featured a Joker so unbelievably good your bound to get traction for that sort of thing.

The 360 still outsells many more multiplatforms than the PS3 and, regardless if the percentages show some 360 owners grabbing a PS3 version over the 360 version I can still guarentee you that both the 360 versions of MW2 and AC2 will outsell the PS3 version.

Typical 360 fanboy spin saying the Joker levels made the PS3 version sell more than the 360 version. Welcome back to HDF, KEEBS. :rolleyes:

Typical 360 fanboy spin saying the Joker levels made the PS3 version sell more than the 360 version. Welcome back to HDF, KEEBS. :rolleyes:

In all fairness, he wasn't here when everyone was saying that the Joker levels wouldn't do anything sell more copies for the PS3 version. Especially since they were just challenge rooms. Not actual story elements.

Typical 360 fanboy spin saying the Joker levels made the PS3 version sell more than the 360 version. Welcome back to HDF, KEEBS. :rolleyes:

Yeah I'm a 360 fanboy for explaining the obvious. :rolleyes:

I may lean 360, but I'm actually fairly objective towards all consoles. I'm certainly not one to come out insisting that despite still being 7 million units behind the 360 that the PS3 is going to start outselling the 360. It doesn't add up and it won't add up when the numbers are released. Argue all you want, but nothing short of a miracle could make that happen at this point in time. If/when the PS3 catches up then you'll see multiplatforms more consistently outsell the 360.

And yes, those were very real reasons to pick up the PS3 copy over the 360 copy of Batman. Why wouldn't you buy the PS3 version if you owned both consoles?

After Alan Wake and GT5 come out(gt5 so I won't miss forza 3), I think I might sell off all my 360 kit and rebuy a few games for PS3.

I don't see anything exclusive coming that I'm really interested in. Would rather have a fleet of slims than my fleet of jaspers. They only do everything.

And yes, those were very real reasons to pick up the PS3 copy over the 360 copy of Batman. Why wouldn't you buy the PS3 version if you owned both consoles?

1. controller (360 is just superior, just because)
2. achievements (better than trophies)
3. Netflix

1. controller (360 is just superior, just because)
2. achievements (better than trophies)
3. Netflix

If you owned both systems why would you pick up the 360 version of Batman because of Netflix? :confused:

The other two are objectionable based on preference. I prefer the 360 controller, but I know other who are diehard for the PS3's. The same can probably be said for the achievements/trophies... I care for neither, personally.

I bought Batman on 360 instead of PS3 because there is artifacting when you zoom in on glass surfaces on the PS3 version. No way I could handle that (even though there would be a total of 2 minutes worth of glass zooming in the whole game. and that's if you are really a big zoom guy)

Yes, I'm a whore.:o

Let the SDF keep dreaming. Last month's NPD showed that 360 had twice as many games listed in top 10 than PS3... But who cares about reality...rite? :what: ;)

Completely ignoring the current 2:1 ratio of hardware ;) If the PS3 was selling an equal amount of software, the Xbox 360 would be in serious trouble.

After Alan Wake and GT5 come out(gt5 so I won't miss forza 3), I think I might sell off all my 360 kit and rebuy a few games for PS3.

I don't see anything exclusive coming that I'm really interested in. Would rather have a fleet of slims than my fleet of jaspers. They only do everything.

Is Alan Wake coming to PC? I'm in a similar position to you. With Microsoft's focus being on making former PS exclusive franchises multiplatform, with the exception of a few XBLA releases, the 360 has actually very little I've been interested in, that I can't get elsewhere.

I was contemplating selling up, but I don't want to lose all my XBLA content. I do also prefer the 360 online/achievements/controller which make me reluctant to sell.

Alan Wake was born as a detective style DX10 tech demo into a 360 exclusive TPS.

The early screens looked like Silent Hill, the last stuff I saw looked like Gears in the great northwest.

Alan Wake was born as a detective style DX10 tech demo into a 360 exclusive TPS.

The early screens looked like Silent Hill, the last stuff I saw looked like Gears in the great northwest.

That game is gonna be beautiful. :)

Alan Wake is coming to PC and is rumored to be now DX11 optimized (as Kam said it was one of the original DX10 demos.)

How long has this one been in development I swear I remember the first trailers in 2005 or 2006.

Definitely a day 1 for me! PC all the way, time to make use of DX11 (hopefully I'll have my 5870 by then.)

Where did you get this news Rail?

Last I heard it was looking like a PC no-go.

Where did you get this news Rail?

Last I heard it was looking like a PC no-go.

Rummaging through forums a while back. It was rumored to still be in the pipelines for PC.

Microsoft is the publisher, they have no reason to keep it Xbox exclusive. Its a win on both platform for them.

The PC rumor is 3-6 months after the 360 release.

Plus, Remedy is a PC dev, they want a PC version. The DX11 optimization is also rumored, since MS needs stuff to pimp it out. Like, now!

MS could give two shits less about DX11 on the PC.

I see it going the route of Halo, Fable and Gears.

MS could give two shits less about DX11 on the PC.

I see it going the route of Halo, Fable and Gears.

I don't.

Not with Intel on the horizon.

Microsoft needs to get DX11 going. They can't afford the same crap with DX10.

This is how important DX11 is to Microsoft right - they are patching it into Windows Vista! What they refused to do to DX10 to XP (in hopes of forcing people to upgrade.)

DX11 might be their last chance at gaming API dominance! OpenCL (or whatever name the Open project goes by now) is already running on Larrabee!

HI ALL, OK my fifth 360 died :banghead::banghead::banghead::crying::crying::cry ing: with that new E-74 ERROR MESSAGE. And I AM DONE for now or MAYBE longer; with that 360. I wrote to all my friends, dressed my avatar in funeral clothes and said goodbye. Then I looked at my first generation 80g; boosted to 250g playstation 2 game playing PS3. And :yippee: not a problem ever sense. :yippee: I HAVE A BANANA THAT LIKES TO BOUNCE........:banana:

I don't.

Not with Intel on the horizon.

Microsoft needs to get DX11 going. They can't afford the same crap with DX10.

This is how important DX11 is to Microsoft right - they are patching it into Windows Vista! What they refused to do to DX10 to XP (in hopes of forcing people to upgrade.)

DX11 might be their last chance at gaming API dominance! OpenCL (or whatever name the Open project goes by now) is already running on Larrabee!

Have you seen OpenCL tools? Every game looks like Doom 3:p

Naw, MS cares about the DirextXBox. They've been dying to get that living room presence, and with some of the crap they added to Live they're moving ever toward it. As long as Xbox runs on DirectX libraries, that's all MS cares about.

How many "Microsoft Game Studios" games are on PC Rail?

Alan Wake is coming to PC and is rumored to be now DX11 optimized (as Kam said it was one of the original DX10 demos.)

How long has this one been in development I swear I remember the first trailers in 2005 or 2006.

Definitely a day 1 for me! PC all the way, time to make use of DX11 (hopefully I'll have my 5870 by then.)

Yeah it's gonna have been 5+ years in the making before it's released. That 360 must be a bitch to develop for ;) :p

Yeah it's gonna have been 5+ years in the making before it's released. That 360 must be a bitch to develop for ;) :p

It'll probably fare like TooHuman on the 360... 5 year development time, many millions spent on development, and completely flop at retail ;)

Seriously though, Alan Wake really had my attention about a year ago. I loved the idea of the game but now that I've seen some gameplay I'm not completely sold on it.

It'll probably fare like TooHuman on the 360... 5 year development time, many millions spent on development, and completely flop at retail ;)

Seriously though, Alan Wake really had my attention about a year ago. I loved the idea of the game but now that I've seen some gameplay I'm not completely sold on it.

What did they do to the gameplay? I love the graphics engine, at least what they've demoed so far.

What did they do to the gameplay? I love the graphics engine, at least what they've demoed so far.

Turned it from Silent Hill 2 to Gears of War 2.

Dammit kam, I'm trying to not sell my 360 (I'll only want one back in 6 months time) but Alan Wake is the only exclusive I'm really fussed about atm... and I'm planning picking up a gaming PC next year anyway which might make the 360 completely redundant given that that's all it seems to be these days.

No Kameo 2 or anything MS? :(

Dammit kam, I'm trying to not sell my 360 (I'll only want one back in 6 months time) but Alan Wake is the only exclusive I'm really fussed about atm... and I'm planning picking up a gaming PC next year anyway which might make the 360 completely redundant given that that's all it seems to be these days.

No Kameo 2 or anything MS? :(

Kameo 2 has been tossed in the can: http://www.computerandvideogames.com/article.php?id=

Right, serious question... what IS coming for the 360 next year? Off the top of my head, Halo Reach, Alan Wake and Fable 3 is the entire 360 lineup. Even Nintendo are doing more than that. I don't know about anyone else, but the PS3 has become my prime console purely because of Sony's stellar 1st party lineup atm.

Even if the 360 and the PS3 had the same games, XboxLive would be the breaker. :p ;)

As usual, wait for E3. MS normally does not hype games for years ;)

Right, serious question... what IS coming for the 360 next year? Off the top of my head, Halo Reach, Alan Wake and Fable 3 is the entire 360 lineup. Even Nintendo are doing more than that. I don't know about anyone else, but the PS3 has become my prime console purely because of Sony's stellar 1st party lineup atm.

As usual, wait for E3. MS normally does not hype games for years ;)

E3 isn't until near enough Summer... what's out before then? Thats still 8 months away ;)

Also, they don't hype games for years? They announced 2 Halo games while another was still in development :lol: Also Natal will have been unveiled 2 years before release (heck Sony are beating them to market with a seemingly more viable option)

Right, serious question... what IS coming for the 360 next year? Off the top of my head, Halo Reach, Alan Wake and Fable 3 is the entire 360 lineup. Even Nintendo are doing more than that. I don't know about anyone else, but the PS3 has become my prime console purely because of Sony's stellar 1st party lineup atm.

Mass Effect 2 ;)

you'll have to pry my 360 out of my cold dead hands =)

the Gears of War, Halo and Mass Effect franchises are more than enough to keep me with the 360

there just aren't enough 'Uncharteds' to make me dump $300 on a PS3

Mass Effect 2 ;)

Good call! Shame it's comin out on PC making it moot for me.

Good call! Shame it's comin out on PC making it moot for me.

I can't remember the last computer game I played...I think it was Legacy of Kain, Soul Reaver!!! ahhhhh, yesteryear =D

regardless, it's gonna be a smoking game for sure..RPG with gears of war type duck and cover gunplay...first one rocked..and they seem to have polished the second one alot!

Indeed, I loved the first Mass Effect. I was quite surprised by MS's choice not to buy out Bioware themselves (instead letting EA get to the punch).

Indeed, I loved the first Mass Effect. I was quite surprised by MS's choice not to buy out Bioware themselves (instead letting EA get to the punch).

EA is an evil conglomerate....LOL
but you're right..bioware just seems to be putting out acclaimed title after acclaimed title...Dragon Age is a hit as well...

so many games, so little time....I still have to revisit fallout 3! ugh

Right, serious question... what IS coming for the 360 next year? Off the top of my head, Halo Reach, Alan Wake and Fable 3 is the entire 360 lineup. Even Nintendo are doing more than that. I don't know about anyone else, but the PS3 has become my prime console purely because of Sony's stellar 1st party lineup atm.

:confused: What exactly is Nintendo bringing this and next year for their hardcore audience aside from Galaxy 2 and Metroid Other M? I hate to rag on Nintendo but come on... they've all but abandoned the audience that helped them get to where they are today. Replaced by moms and ganpas witha desire for WiiFits, WiiSports, WiiPlays, and... of course... WiiVitality Sensors!

As for Microsoft, I agree this holiday season is light on exclusives from them and they will pay for it. I believe Microsoft may have been too devoted to Windows 7 and the Zune relaunch to really pour alot into Xbox this year with Halo ODST and Left 4 Dead 2 being the only real exclusives.

Next year will be better though with:

Halo Reach
Fable 3
Alan Wake
Mass Effect 2
Crackdown 2
Splinter Cell: Conviction
Project Natal

And, of course, whatever they announce at E3. So unless none of these things interest you in the slightest I'd recommend not selling your 360. :o

:confused: What exactly is Nintendo bringing this and next year for their hardcore audience aside from Galaxy 2 and Metroid Other M? I hate to rag on Nintendo but come on... they've all but abandoned the audience that helped them get to where they are today. Replaced by moms and ganpas witha desire for WiiFits, WiiSports, WiiPlays, and... of course... WiiVitality Sensors!


They didn't abandon the hardcore audience, the hardcore audience abandoned them. With the loss of that audience, and the lack of viability in gambling the entire company one one piece of hardware, which has paid off for neither MS or Sony this generation as both are unlikely to ever break even on the 360 or PS3, the Wii was their only real option.

I wasn't counting Nintendo in the "so what's coming for 360" thing as I see the PS3 and 360 as practically the same console, a lack of any reason to play on one allows the other to completely replace it.

Of the reasons you listed to keep a 360 Fable 3, Alan Wake, Mass Effect 2 and Crackdown 2 would be the ones I'm interested in. Natal sounds flawed as it's just a camera. ME2 and Alan Wake are coming to PC (Fable 3 as well?) and Crackdown 2 is an unknown quantity as it's not being developed by Real Time Worlds, if they nail it though, that will be reason enough to keep the 360 :thumbsup:

I have no idea what Nintendo are bringing to the table, but Mario Galaxy 2 alone is reason enough to stick with the Wii, nothing on Microsoft's list even compares. Other M again, worth alone of keeping the system for.

This year there is A Boy and his Blob, New Super Mario Bros Wii and EAs Need for Speed: Nitro all looking well worth playing. Though I'm not even going to defend Nintendo's release slate for 2009, it has been shambolic just like Microsoft's. However the Wii has had far more exclusive's worth playing than the 360 this year IMO.

one thing's for sure
Sony lost more money per console sold on the PS3 than MS did on the 360. That's pretty much a fact. Between the expensive cell processor (which hardly lived up to Sony's hype) and packaged blu ray, it cost alot more to manufacture than the 360.

But usually, most companies lose money on consoles and make it up in software sales...something MS has been doing much much better on than the PS3...

the Wii bucks that trend though..because, well..it's a game cube with a different controller, hardware wise...so they've actually made money on the actual console itself..

just as a peronal preference, I have no interest in the Wii..I understand why people dig it for sure...just not my bag..and there wasn't a good enough reason for me to get a PS3 when I saw a) the price and b) the launch titles...

I got my 360 and never looked back...lots of hours of great games and great gaming, but online and off, that I've gotten on that thing and I look forward to even more with games like borderlands and MW2

one thing's for sure
Sony lost more money per console sold on the PS3 than MS did on the 360. That's pretty much a fact. Between the expensive cell processor (which hardly lived up to Sony's hype) and packaged blu ray, it cost alot more to manufacture than the 360.

But usually, most companies lose money on consoles and make it up in software sales...something MS has been doing much much better on than the PS3...

the Wii bucks that trend though..because, well..it's a game cube with a different controller, hardware wise...so they've actually made money on the actual console itself..

just as a peronal preference, I have no interest in the Wii..I understand why people dig it for sure...just not my bag..and there wasn't a good enough reason for me to get a PS3 when I saw a) the price and b) the launch titles...

I got my 360 and never looked back...lots of hours of great games and great gaming, but online and off, that I've gotten on that thing and I look forward to even more with games like borderlands and MW2

The Wii doesn't buck any trends, it follows the Console gaming business plan that has been in place since the 80s (if not the 70s) it's these non gaming centric corporations that introduced the loss making model.

Sony were the first to use it with the PS1, it was how they managed to get their hardware to market for less than the competition despite being superior (and a big factor in their getting a foothold). It is a fantastic business model that revolutionised the way video gaming is approached. However it banked on being market leader/the system selling extremely well in the long run to be able to recover the costs.

This works great, until you chuck in another company ready to throw just as much money at something to work. Factor in that the actual market for such a system isn't as big as initially planned due to not actually offering anything new other than bolstered visuals, and it's led to the lose lose scenario MS and Sony are currently clawing their way out of.

There is no doubt Sony initially took a bigger hit per console than Microsoft, but factor in the $1bn repair bill from releasing faulty products and overall the losses probably aren't all that far apart.

"most companies lose money" I'd love for you to point me in the direction of another company that used the main business model of selling hardware at a loss. The only other possibility was Sega with the Dreamcast, but I believe it was only sold for a loss after price cuts, not from day 1.

:confused: What exactly is Nintendo bringing this and next year for their hardcore audience

Nintendo has dissed their core audience. As usual 3rd parties wii games are not doing so great...

Halo ODST and Left 4 Dead 2 being the only real exclusives.

Lets not forget about forza 3 and GTA4 episodes. 360 should do well this year. Besides there is a plethora of multiplatform games this year.

Next year will be better though with:

Halo Reach
Fable 3
Alan Wake
Mass Effect 2
Crackdown 2
Splinter Cell: Conviction
Project Natal

And, of course, whatever they announce at E3. So unless none of these things interest you in the slightest I'd recommend not selling your 360. :o

Of course mikey will ignore this. If he sells his 360, thats cool; one less annoying kid on XBL :cool: So we have RPG, adventure, FPS, TPS..not too bad. And as you mentioned, this is the line up before E3 announcements and 360/PC console exclusives...

Nintendo has dissed their core audience. As usual 3rd parties wii games are not doing so great...

Lets not forget about forza 3 and GTA4 episodes. 360 should do well this year. Besides there is a plethora of multiplatform games this year.

Of course mikey will ignore this. If he sells his 360, thats cool; one less annoying kid on XBL :cool: So we have RPG, adventure, FPS, TPS..not too bad. And as you mentioned, this is the line up before E3 announcements and 360/PC console exclusives...

As I said, Nintendo's "Core" audience vanished before they stopped making so many fantastic "hardcore" games. However Nintendo are catering to their core audience better than Sony and MS are catering to theirs, that's why the Wii has most of the top selling titles of this generation.

DLC on a disc is not a significant release (as reflected in the poor showing of the game being outsold by Mario Kart a game which has sold nearly 2x as much as Halo 3 at 18m units to 10m units)

If you think that lineup is diverse, you really have extremely limited tastes in gaming. It's Shooters, RPGs and hybrids. Thats catering to 2 audiences in the next 12 months. If that satisfies your gaming tastes fine, but I want more. I look at what I was excited about 10 years ago on the Dreamcast, and there were genre breaking titles coming out, etc. It's so sad to see so many people feeling that 1 or 2 genres cover all the bases needed for a mainstream console.

God dammit you're so pro 360 cyg, that you make me look anti 360 and I'm not. I'm just far more objective than you and also able to see that the 360 caters perfectly for the audience it has, but is increasingly failing to offer anything to prospective users outside of that audience.

No, I am fair and balanced. What games would you like, mikey? What would it take to make you stop pouting? Perhaps you should get in the game biz and make the "perfect" game, "mikey kart".. :what: ;) BTW I never said the line up was extraordinarily diverse. I said that it is “not too bad” so far. There probably will be more games announced at E3. And we still don't know what to expect from natal... Thus I prefer to take the more rational approach…that’s all. :angel For the record, from prior posts, I have mentioned that devs this gen have often lacked the creative imagination of past gens. What more can I say? :what:

If you think that lineup is diverse, you really have extremely limited tastes in gaming. It's Shooters, RPGs and hybrids. Thats catering to 2 audiences in the next 12 months. If that satisfies your gaming tastes fine, but I want more. I look at what I was excited about 10 years ago on the Dreamcast, and there were genre breaking titles coming out, etc. It's so sad to see so many people feeling that 1 or 2 genres cover all the bases needed for a mainstream console.

God dammit you're so pro 360 cyg, that you make me look anti 360 and I'm not. I'm just far more objective than you and also able to see that the 360 caters perfectly for the audience it has, but is increasingly failing to offer anything to prospective users outside of that audience.

I'd like some stuff like Jak n Daxter, Sly Cooper, Mario, that sorta thing or Okami/Zelda action adventure games :p I like bright colourful games with bleepy music and places with jaw dropping memorable scenery.

Don't get me wrong, nowt wrong with a bit of blood bath killing every now and then, just not as every single game.

A decent successor to Burnout for this gen would be nice too (Blur and the Disney Interactive rival look like good potential replacements).

I'd like some stuff like Jak n Daxter, Sly Cooper, Mario, that sorta thing or Okami/Zelda action adventure games :p I like bright colourful games with bleepy music and places with jaw dropping memorable scenery.

Don't get me wrong, nowt wrong with a bit of blood bath killing every now and then, just not as every single game.

A decent successor to Burnout for this gen would be nice too (Blur and the Disney Interactive rival look like good potential replacements).

Honestly Mike, I don't think your giving Microsoft nearly enough credit. Yes the games I listed are Microsoft's obvious heavy hitters for the next year and they do fall roughly into those genres you mentioned.

However, your also forgetting that Microsoft has put out those kinds of games before and definitely have plans to reach out to that audience in the future. Games like Banjo Kazooie, Viva Pinata, and Kameo all came from Microsoft, remember? Now, greanted, we haven't heard about anything from Microsoft regarding these games (except that there won't be a Kameo 2) but we also don't know what Rare is working on. Nothing's been announced from them. Hell, I think they've been silent all year...

2009 was a funk, I admit it. Microsoft was dealing with three game changing things this year: Zune HD, Windows 7, Project Natal. Because of this I believe the games suffered a bit and MS relied more heavily on third parties. But there's nothing big next year except for WinMo 7 which means Microsoft's entertainment division will be turned back onto games. And yes... there are most definitely unannounced games...

Also, I know your not digging Project Natal. But I say, don't knock it till you try it. Yeah camera technology kind of sucks from what we've seen now. I mean, Sony's EyeToy is kind of a joke... but everything is evolutionary. You keep making something and it's bound to get better incrementally. Natal might be that device that pushes it over from gimmicky to usable. And if it is usable, then why not be stoked about it? Are you honestly saying that you'd rather hold two wands (ala' Wii, PS3) as your points of interface than use your entire body? Where anything can be a point of interface... Granted the wands may help in games like FPSs, but beyond that it's all so limiting.

Honestly Mike, I don't think your giving Microsoft nearly enough credit. Yes the games I listed are Microsoft's obvious heavy hitters for the next year and they do fall roughly into those genres you mentioned.

However, your also forgetting that Microsoft has put out those kinds of games before and definitely have plans to reach out to that audience in the future. Games like Banjo Kazooie, Viva Pinata, and Kameo all came from Microsoft, remember? Now, greanted, we haven't heard about anything from Microsoft regarding these games (except that there won't be a Kameo 2) but we also don't know what Rare is working on. Nothing's been announced from them. Hell, I think they've been silent all year...

2009 was a funk, I admit it. Microsoft was dealing with three game changing things this year: Zune HD, Windows 7, Project Natal. Because of this I believe the games suffered a bit and MS relied more heavily on third parties. But there's nothing big next year except for WinMo 7 which means Microsoft's entertainment division will be turned back onto games. And yes... there are most definitely unannounced games...

Also, I know your not digging Project Natal. But I say, don't knock it till you try it. Yeah camera technology kind of sucks from what we've seen now. I mean, Sony's EyeToy is kind of a joke... but everything is evolutionary. You keep making something and it's bound to get better incrementally. Natal might be that device that pushes it over from gimmicky to usable. And if it is usable, then why not be stoked about it? Are you honestly saying that you'd rather hold two wands (ala' Wii, PS3) as your points of interface than use your entire body? Where anything can be a point of interface... Granted the wands may help in games like FPSs, but beyond that it's all so limiting.

Just to chime in here, the OS part of MS is housed and operated by a different branch than the EDD. From all the articles I've read, they aren't integrated and rarely see eye to eye (one of the reasons believed "Games for Windows" isn't fledging out, the OS department isn't putting focus on it.) To say MS was too busy working on Win7 is like arguing Toshiba didn't put all its effort into HD DVD because they were to busy selling nuclear reactors (haha great analogy no? :D :thumbsup:)

But let's look at the games you did mention.
Kameo 1 - solid, good gameplay, lucious graphics for a launch title. Is it the only in house platformer from MS or any of its 2nd party titles? I think so, until the next...

Viva Pinata - solid, fun, great gameplay, and a good chance at making MS "kid friendly" I mean with the running cartoon show, the McDonald's toys and what not, but then the sequal felt like a rushed bastard mini-game project. They promised to fix it, but...I don't even know if they've announced the next title. And, back to it the guys at Rare went on record stating MS shoved them under the table, through all their love, R&D and marketing money for Gears. That decision will mold the 360 into the "frat boy" console we all know.

And the the next one, Banjo Nuts and Bolts - did you enjoy it? I thought it was okay. Was definitely not a successor to Banjo-Tooie, and in the end it felt...poor. Not Rare quality. Some kind of slap-together job designed to attract an audience that isn't there.

That's just my impression on those games. I'd love a Kameo 2. I doubt I'll get it. As mike would say, no guns and space marines. :(

Just to chime in here, the OS part of MS is housed and operated by a different branch than the EDD. From all the articles I've read, they aren't integrated and rarely see eye to eye (one of the reasons believed "Games for Windows" isn't fledging out, the OS department isn't putting focus on it.) To say MS was too busy working on Win7 is like arguing Toshiba didn't put all its effort into HD DVD because they were to busy selling nuclear reactors (haha great analogy no? :D :thumbsup:)

But let's look at the games you did mention.
Kameo 1 - solid, good gameplay, lucious graphics for a launch title. Is it the only in house platformer from MS or any of its 2nd party titles? I think so, until the next...

Viva Pinata - solid, fun, great gameplay, and a good chance at making MS "kid friendly" I mean with the running cartoon show, the McDonald's toys and what not, but then the sequal felt like a rushed bastard mini-game project. They promised to fix it, but...I don't even know if they've announced the next title. And, back to it the guys at Rare went on record stating MS shoved them under the table, through all their love, R&D and marketing money for Gears. That decision will mold the 360 into the "frat boy" console we all know.

And the the next one, Banjo Nuts and Bolts - did you enjoy it? I thought it was okay. Was definitely not a successor to Banjo-Tooie, and in the end it felt...poor. Not Rare quality. Some kind of slap-together job designed to attract an audience that isn't there.

That's just my impression on those games. I'd love a Kameo 2. I doubt I'll get it. As mike would say, no guns and space marines. :(

I'm not saying Win 7 was integrated with Microsof't EDD. However, when you have something that major, which is the one fundamental part of Microsoft's business, it's bound to detract from everything else in the company. There will be less money, less, time, and less lip service from the executives. Combine that with the fact that EDD was working on Zune HD for most of the year and is still working on Natal and you've got a perfect storm of game neglect.

Also the games are subjective. Truth be told I didn't like either Kameo, or Viva Pinata (I bought them both however). Nuts and Bolts however was brilliant to me, however. It wasnt traditional platforming, but it gave you the tools to build some wickedly fun vehicles. And all for 39.99? It was probably one of the better purchases I've ever made.

Finally, this little nugget just dropped onto the interwebs:

http://kotaku.com/5402009/rumor-project-natal-launches-november-2010-14-games-might-be-cheap

I guarentee you that these 14 games are exactly the type of games Mike is saying MS is neglecting.

I have to agree with keebz that MS has tried to reach a wider demographic. But most gamers do not seem to be interested in those types of games. They say that most gamers are older, thus not too interested in the cartoony platform games. Thus MS seems to be more focussed on the core market and let 3rd parties release casual games. Today’s casual games are rock band, GH, DJH, etc. Platform seems to be an almost lost genre with some TPS adopting its elements. Maybe natal will introduce more casual games? Rare supposedly is working on natal games. We’ll see if rare delivers compelling games, because so far they have been a disappointment. Rare may not have been the best investment because some say that the talent left the company years ago. If MS dumped kameo 2, that was a mistake because many liked the game.

However, your also forgetting that Microsoft has put out those kinds of games before and definitely have plans to reach out to that audience in the future. Games like Banjo Kazooie, Viva Pinata, and Kameo all came from Microsoft, remember? Now, greanted, we haven't heard about anything from Microsoft regarding these games (except that there won't be a Kameo 2) but we also don't know what Rare is working on. Nothing's been announced from them. Hell, I think they've been silent all year...

2009 was a funk, I admit it. Microsoft was dealing with three game changing things this year: Zune HD, Windows 7, Project Natal. Because of this I believe the games suffered a bit and MS relied more heavily on third parties. But there's nothing big next year except for WinMo 7 which means Microsoft's entertainment division will be turned back onto games. And yes... there are most definitely unannounced games...

Also, I know your not digging Project Natal. But I say, don't knock it till you try it. Yeah camera technology kind of sucks from what we've seen now. I mean, Sony's EyeToy is kind of a joke... but everything is evolutionary. You keep making something and it's bound to get better incrementally. Natal might be that device that pushes it over from gimmicky to usable. And if it is usable, then why not be stoked about it? Are you honestly saying that you'd rather hold two wands (ala' Wii, PS3) as your points of interface than use your entire body? Where anything can be a point of interface... Granted the wands may help in games like FPSs, but beyond that it's all so limiting.

And yes, I would rather use two hands as my inputs. I use 2 hands on a pad :lol: if the rumours I posted about Natal being £30-50 are true, I'm in from day 1, but that is a long way off. Eyetoy was great fun for parties etc, but not for deeper games. I don't want to stand up punching and kicking for games or pretending I'm holding a gun and running (I want the tactile feedback but not running on the spot as was shown for Natal) paint me skeptical not against it.

We do know what Rare are working on, Perfect Dark for XBLA and Natal games which is the stated reason for Kameo 2 being pulled. (I lapped up Viva Pinata and Kameo, Banjo Kazooie was dull as it gets though for me) so that's also November 2010.

Nintendo supposedly have lots of unannounced games for 2010 too but I'm taking the same approach with them as I am MS. What is coming?! Cyg E3 is 6 months away for those of us not planning to play Modern Warfare 2 multiplayer until then, what are MS offering that I can't get on the PS3 or PC? Not that much is the answer, I don't get why you can't just go "yeah. it's slim pickings atm just like 2009 was" and be done with it.

I KNOW the Wii has been slim pickings from Nintendo from the fact that I haven't bought a first party Nintendo game in the best part of a year.