lossless sound

can one really hear a difference in sound from a receiver that has all the decoding options vs pass thru sound from a receiver that doesnt have the decoding.

That depends on your equipment, the environment and speaker placement but in most cases, yes.

can one really hear a difference in sound from a receiver that has all the decoding options vs pass thru sound from a receiver that doesnt have the decoding.I'm not sure what you mean by "pass thru sound from a receiver that doesn't have the decoding". If you mean a player that decodes and sends PCM to a processor, there is no difference whatsoever. If the decoders work properly, and I've never seen anything to indicate that any devices have bad decoders, then the PCM produced by a player or receiver will be identical.

Except for rare cases with high end players like the Denon 3800BDCI, all processing is done by the receiver regardless of where the decoding is done. By processing, I mean bass management, distance adjustments, EQ, and the digital-to-analog conversion. In other words, the player doesn't do anything that would produce differences in the sound.

If you use the player's analog outputs, then there may well be differences because the player handles the processing with analog.

BIslander, I have a receiver that has pass thru "an older onkyo", and a older panny blu ray dmp bd30 which I think doesnt have tru hd and all the newer decoding , so I can not get true hd but it sounds good,if I was to upgrade to a newer receiver that has all the new decoding would i notice a big difference in sound?

BIslander, I have a receiver that has pass thru "an older onkyo", and a older panny blu ray dmp bd30 which I think doesnt have tru hd and all the newer decoding , so I can not get true hd but it sounds good,if I was to upgrade to a newer receiver that has all the new decoding would i notice a big difference in sound?I don't think so. You may not notice much difference at all. The lossy DD 5.1 and DTS tracks on BD are encoded at higher bitrates than on DVD and they sound great, rivalling lossless. You will get different opinions from others, of course.

I have a receiver that has pass thru "an older onkyo", and a older panny blu ray dmp bd30 which I think doesnt have tru hd and all the newer decoding , so I can not get true hd but it sounds good,if I was to upgrade to a newer receiver that has all the new decoding would i notice a big difference in sound?

See my first post...

If you want substantive information, try this article in Home Entertainment Magazine:

http://www.hemagazine.com/node/Dolby_TrueHD_DTS-MA_versus_Uncompressed_PCM

Unfortunately, I'm not aware of any rigorous, controlled studies comparing lossless with the max bitrate lossy encodes on Blu-ray.

So I wonder why everyone is upgrading their receivers for better sound quality when the older receivers sound just as good as the newer ones with tru hd and dts? so basically my onkyo 506 and panny blu ray dmp bd30 would sound just as good as a newer models with all the decoding , does everyone agree?

I hear improved sound with the HD audio (i.e. DD+, DTS-HD, DtHD & DTS-HD MA), but I have about 4K into my sound system. The difference is not huge but there is some improvement. If you do not spend a good amount of money for the speakers used, it is mostly a waste IMO to buy a new receiver just for the HD audio decoding.

I have less than $700 invested in my audio system and I can hear a distinct difference in DD and DTS versus the lossless codecs. However, I find it very hard to hear a difference in DD+ and the lossless codecs.

Personal testimonials don't mean much. Self administered, sighted tests are inherently unreliable. And who knows how any of these systems are set up.

With that disclaimer, I will say I have about 5K in my sound system and I rarely hear much difference. But, sometimes lossless is clearly better - the PCM track on Black Hawk Down, for example. Once again, this is not a comparison of lossless and DVD. It's a comparison of lossless and the max bitrate legacy codecs on Blu-ray.

I use analog since my AVR lacks HDMI. You might consider getting a player with lossless decoders and analog outputs instead of a new receiver.

Your speakers will be the limiting factor for sound quality, most people I know spend more money for their AV receiver than they spend on the speakers. The smart way is spend as much as you can for the speakers then start looking for an AV receiver that will drive them. If you were to buy a 5.1 speaker system and a new AV receiver, then upgrade later to a much more expensive receiver, the sound quality wouldn't be that much better by just getting a new receiver. If the only reason you want a new receiver is to be able to have Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD Master Audio, then it's not worth it.