Need help choosing preamp for new install

I just installed a Clear Stream 4 on my roof, running 60 feet to grounding block and then another 45 feet to a 3-way splitter. I plan to move to a 5 way splitter at some point. The longest run is another 50 feet or so from the splitter. I live in 21244 (baltimore suburbs) and have the antenna pointed to washington DC to pick up those stations. I currently pick up Baltimore and DC stations, but the signal strength is only around 65% average or so for most of the stations. The 3-way is a cheaper splitter I bought at Best Buy, all the coax is RG6-QS. I have been experiencing occasional pixelation on some stations and break up on some others.

I am thinking due to the relatively low gain of my antenna combined with the long cable run and splitter that I would benefit from a preamp. Does this seem correct?

What model would you recommend? I do have a few stations that are close and giving strong signals, so I don't want to overload the signal. I am thinking the Channel Master 7778 may be a good choice.

Also, is there a benefit to buying a more expensive splitter like a Monster-Cable?

Any advice is most appreciated.

I just installed a Clear Stream 4 on my roof, running 60 feet to grounding block and then another 45 feet to a 3-way splitter. I plan to move to a 5 way splitter at some point. The longest run is another 50 feet or so from the splitter. I live in 21244 (baltimore suburbs) and have the antenna pointed to washington DC to pick up those stations. I currently pick up Baltimore and DC stations, but the signal strength is only around 65% average or so for most of the stations. The 3-way is a cheaper splitter I bought at Best Buy, all the coax is RG6-QS. I have been experiencing occasional pixelation on some stations and break up on some others.

I am thinking due to the relatively low gain of my antenna combined with the long cable run and splitter that I would benefit from a preamp. Does this seem correct?

What model would you recommend? I do have a few stations that are close and giving strong signals, so I don't want to overload the signal. I am thinking the Channel Master 7778 may be a good choice.

Also, is there a benefit to buying a more expensive splitter like a Monster-Cable?

Any advice is most appreciated.

If you took a garden hose and you put a Y connector at the shut off valve and you hooked two garden hoses to the one valve, you would have equal amounts of pressure to the two hoses.

When you start to split it 3 and 4 and 5 and 10 ways, each time you split it you loose signal until the drag on the signal becomes more than the signal present at the antenna.

For some reason, the rules of the forum is being ignored and people wanting advice forgets two things. One to give your address so we can look at your reception and the second is to say thank you - after people gives their advice.

The best I can tell you is that a 2 way splitter would do a better job for you than a 3 way splitter and you would benefit by using several 2 way splitters in series than one 5 way splitter.

For a 5 way - you would need some type of distribution amplifier.

Your lack of signal is probably from using the wrong antenna.

With your DC stations being 29 to 40 miles away, my other guess would be that you are not using a antenna rotor.

The Clear Steam 4 antenna is a UHF only antenna.

Not good for WBAL, WJLA, WUSA, WMDO or WGAL

Use a proper antenna, with the proper amount of height above your roof, use good wire and some sort of distribution amplifier and you should be fine, as long as there is no trees, buildings or hills blocking your signal.

A Winegard 7698 P would be a good antenna for your location.

Well, thank you, I guess. the address is 2908 mayfield ave, 21244. I thought my zip code would give you close enough info. You are correct that I am not using a rotor. The spread on the CS-4 is 70 degrees. I have it pointed towards the DC stations (by looking at the maps on tvfool-com). I realize that the baltimore stations are outside this spread and thus won't be received as well, but I figured considering the proximity, that I would probably be fine, and I have been.

That didn't really answer my question. My understanding is that the CS-4 does just fine for high-vhf, although maybe not quite as good as some other antennas. I have it on a 10 foot mast on my roof, am using proper cable- as stated. I receive some of the high-vhf stations (with excellent strength for WBAL and WJLA), but not WGAL or WUSA. If it becomes a big deal in the future, I will add a VHF antenna.

I understand the basic premise of higher signal strength with 2 way splits, but I fail to see where it would help here. It would improve signal strangth for 1 connection and actually lower the gain slightly for the other 2 which would be off of 2 splits.

I do have trees somewhat obscuring the view and they are way too tall for me to consider going higher than them (many over 100 years old).

I am receiving good-great signal from 7 stations, ok signal from 9 stations(totally watchable), and weak signal from another 7.

So, thank you for writing back and giving advice. I am not interested in another antenna at this time. In fact, my signal strength is generally ok, I just was looking for a little better on those 9 that are not as good and figured a small db boost at the antenna might give me what I need. I also thought this was better than a distribution amp mostly because I have a 100 foot cable run before I get to the splitter and it is better to amplify at the source. I understand that a preamp is only going to amplify the signal my antenna gives it and will not help to bring in stations my antenna is not able to receive on it's own.

So, my primary question was if a preamp would improve my situation or not.

Thanks again.

Hello James,

Welcome to the forums! :) Here is the tvfool report for your location: http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wrapper&Itemid=29&q=id%3d8ecdde35afaa2b

Based on this report, you have 6 very strong stations within 7 miles of your place. A pre-amp is very likely to overload in your situation and will ultimately reduce your reception. In your situation, a distribution amp makes much more sense. The CM 3414 would meet your current needs. See: http://www.solidsignal.com/pview.asp?mc=03&p=CM3414&d=Channel-Master-CM-3414-Distribution-Amplifier-%28CM3414%29&c=Amplifiers&sku=

Simply add a terminator to the unused output port. There are larger distribution amps to handle more outputs. Tiger Bangs is the pro at distribution systems, he may have some suggestions for a five way or six way amplifier.

HTH,

Rick

The CS-4 is a non-starter on VHF: if you look at the plots on HDTVprimer.com, you'll see that the CS-4, while a decent medium-range UHF antenna, has signal loss on EVERY VHF channel, so it is NOT a choice for receiving VHF stations, especially off-access. Adding a preamplifier is unlikely to provide you with any real improvement becasue there is no VHF signal to amplify.

Tiger, I agree that the C-4 is poor based on the primer. However, the OP is so close to the towers, he can probably acquire the VHF channels with a paper clip. My sole high VHF channel has a 56 dB NM and will give me a 50% signal reading with only a transformer balun connected to my cable! :)

With the issue of the C-4 aside, his signal strengths are too high for a pre-amp. Do you have a good recommendation for a 5 or 6 way distribution amp?

Thanks,

Rick

Thank you so much for the responses. It looks like I should have looked a longer before buying the C-4. Thankfully, there is really only 1 channel I may not receive as a result and not a very important one. I see they sell a separate VHF antenna now - probably to make up for it.

Ok, so it looks like I need a distribution amp instead. Thank you for all of your help!

I have been experiencing occasional pixelation on some stations and break up on some others.


You have 5 VHF stations and the stations are spread out by 116 degrees.

A preamp or distribution amp may help, but it can't fix the multipath that is enevitable with a misaimed directive antenna.

I say return the C4.

In your case you'd be best off with two 7-69 (HBU-22 or HD7694P)antennas added together with a backwards splitter.

Channel Master makes a good line of low-noise distribution amplifier-splitters in 2-way, 4-way or 8 way models: look for the Cm 341x models. I have had good luck with them.

Well, thank you, I guess. the address is 2908 mayfield ave, 21244. I thought my zip code would give you close enough info. You are correct that I am not using a rotor. The spread on the CS-4 is 70 degrees. I have it pointed towards the DC stations (by looking at the maps on tvfool-com). I realize that the baltimore stations are outside this spread and thus won't be received as well, but I figured considering the proximity, that I would probably be fine, and I have been.

So the answer to the first question has been answered by me. Buy a rotor and point the antenna in the proper direction! How hard is that to understand?

That didn't really answer my question. My understanding is that the CS-4 does just fine for high-vhf, although maybe not quite as good as some other antennas. I have it on a 10 foot mast on my roof, am using proper cable- as stated. I receive some of the high-vhf stations (with excellent strength for WBAL and WJLA), but not WGAL or WUSA. If it becomes a big deal in the future, I will add a VHF antenna.

A VHF antenna would really help your cause.

I understand the basic premise of higher signal strength with 2 way splits, but I fail to see where it would help here. It would improve signal strangth for 1 connection and actually lower the gain slightly for the other 2 which would be off of 2 splits.

By using a 2 way splitter, the amount of split would be unilateral, all ports would have a equal amount of signal. With a 4 way splitter, you might have one port that has as little as 3.7 db of loss and the other 3 might have 7 db or more of loss. When you are in a situation where you are trying to receive a fringe station with the wrong antenna, pointed in the wrong direction, you need all the signal you can get.

I do have trees somewhat obscuring the view and they are way too tall for me to consider going higher than them (many over 100 years old).

I am receiving good-great signal from 7 stations, ok signal from 9 stations(totally watchable), and weak signal from another 7.

So, thank you for writing back and giving advice. I am not interested in another antenna at this time. In fact, my signal strength is generally ok, I just was looking for a little better on those 9 that are not as good and figured a small db boost at the antenna might give me what I need. I also thought this was better than a distribution amp mostly because I have a 100 foot cable run before I get to the splitter and it is better to amplify at the source. I understand that a preamp is only going to amplify the signal my antenna gives it and will not help to bring in stations my antenna is not able to receive on it's own.

So, my primary question was if a preamp would improve my situation or not.

Thanks again.

A pre amp would not help your situation, due to the fact that a pre amp only compensates for line loss after the amp and not before.

A amplifier can only amplify the signal that is present. It doesn't really amplify it as much as it compensates for long runs of wire / loss in the wire.

I appreciate everyones help. I really didn't mean to give the impression that I was unhappy with my reception overall. It looks like my best bet would have been a different antenna and a rotor, but the signal I have now is fine. In the future, it looks like I would benefit from a dedicated VHF antenna and a rotor if I really want great signal into all the fringe stations. I had already spent a lot in accomplishing this task, with all new RG6-QS wiring, ground wire, ground rod, splitters, tools, etc. I also had put in a network based HD tuner and wired gigabit networking through the house. I bought the C4 because I got a great deal on it and it is relatively small.

Maybe when I have some more money to sink into the project I'll add the above mentioned rotor and vhf antenna. I am very happy overall with my results in the meantime. I get all of the Baltimore stations(in spite of my antenna being pointed towards DC), and almost all of the DC stations now(Not WUSA).

I appreciate everyones help. I really didn't mean to give the impression that I was unhappy with my reception overall. It looks like my best bet would have been a different antenna and a rotor, but the signal I have now is fine. In the future, it looks like I would benefit from a dedicated VHF antenna and a rotor if I really want great signal into all the fringe stations. I had already spent a lot in accomplishing this task, with all new RG6-QS wiring, ground wire, ground rod, splitters, tools, etc. I also had put in a network based HD tuner and wired gigabit networking through the house. I bought the C4 because I got a great deal on it and it is relatively small.

Maybe when I have some more money to sink into the project I'll add the above mentioned rotor and vhf antenna. I am very happy overall with my results in the meantime. I get all of the Baltimore stations(in spite of my antenna being pointed towards DC), and almost all of the DC stations now(Not WUSA).

You may need to get the winegard 1713 a VHF only antenna to pick up WUSA!! I use the 1713 to pick up channel 2, 11, 13 I live about 45 miles from Baltimore!! Chanel 9 WUSA broadcasts at a VERY LOW 12.5kws!! After channel 11 boosted there siganl I have NO drop outs on channel 11!

I can't get WJLA, no matter what I do: I wonder if it's because I am 350 miles from them, and have hills in the way? LOL!

Geez, tiger.... It's so obvious. Ya gotta have a Winegard 8200U with a CM7777 pre-amp and a rotor. It digs deeper into the VHF, doncha ya know... LOL! ;)