The Denon 2010CI...The Marantz BD7004...or the Oppo?

According to the latest issue of Crutchfield, Denon now offers a DBP-2010CI player and Marantz has the BD7004 (of course from the same mother company) both of which carry the Anchor Bay VRS chip -- do these make a substantial argument against considering the Oppo, or is the Oppo still the deck of choice for most, do you think?

The Denon retails for $699 and the Marantz for $799.

According to the latest issue of Crutchfield, Denon now offers a DBP-2010CI player and Marantz has the BD7004 (of course from the same mother company) both of which carry the Anchor Bay VRS chip -- do these make a substantial argument against considering the Oppo, or is the Oppo still the deck of choice for most, do you think?

The Denon retails for $699 and the Marantz for $799.

Oppo is still the winner based on the other components both audio and video, in which the Oppo is clearly superior. The audio and video tests/comparisons confirm this...

I'm outta here :cool:

Oppo is still the winner based on the other components both audio and video, in which the Oppo is clearly superior. The audio and video tests/comparisons confirm this...

I'm outta here :cool:

Even using the same Anchor Bay implementation for upscaling? Did all these players come out differently in comparison even on SD DVD?

Even if the Oppo shares the same Anchor Bay VRS chip as the Denon and Marantz, the Oppo's load times and finely tuned analog section is without a doubt the second best to the $4,500 Denon unit even though you may not need it. When I think about my Oppo player it reminds me of a finely tuned piano, Oppo took their time designing the Oppo BDP-83 and it shows. I'm a Denon fanboy, but not when it comes to a Blu-ray player! Pure build quality at 11 pounds, when I opened the box I couldn't believe how much it weighed! :eek:

Even using the same Anchor Bay implementation for upscaling? Did all these players come out differently in comparison even on SD DVD?

It is not the exact same implementation of the Anchor Bay chipset and the Marantz and Denon players are made by Funai. More expensive but less of a player...especially in the audio section.

It is not the exact same implementation of the Anchor Bay chipset and the Marantz and Denon players are made by Funai. More expensive but less of a player...especially in the audio section.

Funai is implementing an Anchor Bay VRS chip into a BD player that's already sub par performance, Onkyo, Denon, Marantz are all using Funai BD players and calling it their own! If I was CEO of Denon and Marantz I would have contracted Oppo to deliver a BD player and then implement additional technology to improve on the design! Funai made BD players are at best your average low end player.

It is not the exact same implementation of the Anchor Bay chipset and the Marantz and Denon players are made by Funai. More expensive but less of a player...especially in the audio section.

How so? In terms of that they're not the same implementation of the ABT chip -- is noise reduction not available on BD algorithms and such, on the Denon/Marantz?

I have not seen any confirmation that these new D&M players are made by Funai. If they are, that isn't a negative, Funai is probably still the world's largest when it comes to making DVD players. I still own Funai made DVD/SACD/DVD-A/CD Denon players and have gotten great service from them. I expect that eventually Funai will become the largest for Blu-ray as well.

I believe both of these players use the ABT1030, not the same chip as Oppo, ABT2010.

http://www.anchorbaytech.com/products/semiconductors/abt1030.php

http://www.anchorbaytech.com/products/semiconductors/abt2010.php

I also don't think the video decoders are the same as the Oppo BDP-83 but I haven't really seen much information on these players yet. There is a single review for both at Amazon.com. Advantage clearly with Oppo based on what I have seen so far. I don't think either player is a universal player, Blu-ray/SACD/DVD-A/DVD-V, either if that is of importance.

If somebody that is actually going to make a decision to purchase a player wants me to look at a comparison of these three, I will do so.

Chris

If somebody that is actually going to make a decision to purchase a player wants me to look at a comparison of these three, I will do so.

This is utterly and ridiculously uncalled for, but I suppose predictable coming from the source -- at any rate, if you have any information regarding the performance of the noted Denon and Marantz players and how they stack up against the Oppo's, I would be interested to read it.

If I further understand this reply, the two players mentioned may not be necessarily made by Funai, as the lower priced Denons have been. To that effect, the Anchor Bay chipset inside the Oppo may be of a higher tier design than the players mentioned...and this is what I essentially wanted to know being that it caught my eye that D&M was now boasting the ABT was inside these machines. I was under the impression the Oppo was the primary manufacturer utilizing this chipset in a successful, performance-oriented algorithm.

Some Denon receivers have the ABT chip for upscaling purposes via HDMI. I guess we will not know for sure until a review of either Denon or Marantz players is done. I seriously doubt it will out perform the Oppo though! That's my guess, if anything it will equal the Oppo at the very least.

This is utterly and ridiculously uncalled for, but I suppose predictable coming from the source -- at any rate, if you have any information regarding the performance of the noted Denon and Marantz players and how they stack up against the Oppo's, I would be interested to read it.

If I further understand this reply, the two players mentioned may not be necessarily made by Funai, as the lower priced Denons have been. To that effect, the Anchor Bay chipset inside the Oppo may be of a higher tier design than the players mentioned...and this is what I essentially wanted to know being that it caught my eye that D&M was now boasting the ABT was inside these machines. I was under the impression the Oppo was the primary manufacturer utilizing this chipset in a successful, performance-oriented algorithm.

In general, D&M doesn't announce which OEM makes which players. That comes from someone figuring that out by a comparison and I haven't seen a definitive answer as to which company makes these two D&M players. I don't believe D&M owns a manufacturing facility that makes Blu-ray players so I believe the players are made by one or two of the usual suspects. The lineup I am standing behind the glass and looking at certainly includes Funai.

With good reliable Blu-ray players from Sony, LG and Panasonic at about $250, I don't think these two D&M players are generating much interest here. The Oppo player is a forum favorite for the members that are willing to spend more for exceptional DVD-V performance or SACD or DVD-A or a combination of the three. The Oppo BDP-83 has been reviewed online and there is a lot of information available.

I am not sure what you mean by claiming my comment "is utterly and ridiculously uncalled for". You have requested information and opinions on just about every player made over the last two years with I am sure over a thousand posts in hundreds of threads on the subject of your search for a Blu-ray player to replace your Panasonic DMP-BD10A. You are like the boy that cried wolf too many times. I would say my comment is right on the money. I won't bother to research further than I just did for your benefit, it is a waste of time. All I managed to do was offer questions worthy of research. I do think these two players are very good but pale in comparison to the Oppo BDP-83 in terms of value and formats handled. The Oppo BDP-83 beats either across the board is the quick conclusion I came to.

Chris

I am not sure what you mean by claiming my comment "is utterly and ridiculously uncalled for". You have requested information and opinions on just about every player made over the last two years with I am sure over a thousand posts in hundreds of threads on the subject of your search for a Blu-ray player to replace your Panasonic DMP-BD10A. You are like the boy that cried wolf too many times. I would say my comment is right on the money. I won't bother to research further than I just did for your benefit, it is a waste of time. All I managed to do was offer questions worthy of research. I do think these two players are very good but pale in comparison to the Oppo BDP-83 in terms of value and formats handled. The Oppo BDP-83 beats either across the board is the quick conclusion I came to.
Chris

Good for you, Chris! :yippee:

When I started reseaching BD players I wanted exceptional DVD-V performance, SACD, DVD-A and exceptional Blu-ray performance on par with the high-end units. I also wanted to be able to bitstream Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD Master Audio along with easy menu navigation and set-up procedures, the Oppo BDP-83 fit the bill! You have to ask yourself Peter whether the Oppo BDP-83 fulfills your requirements, it either does or it does not. Seems simple enough don't you think?

If I remember correctly PFC5 mentioned that instead of going through the process of elimination you seem to be doing the exact opposite, instead you continue to ADD instead of eliminate. You know what, he was right! "Proofs in the pudding". :D

In general, D&M doesn't announce which OEM makes which players. That comes from someone figuring that out by a comparison and I haven't seen a definitive answer as to which company makes these two D&M players. I don't believe D&M owns a manufacturing facility that makes Blu-ray players so I believe the players are made by one or two of the usual suspects. The lineup I am standing behind the glass and looking at certainly includes Funai.

With good reliable Blu-ray players from Sony, LG and Panasonic at about $250, I don't think these two D&M players are generating much interest here. The Oppo player is a forum favorite for the members that are willing to spend more for exceptional DVD-V performance or SACD or DVD-A or a combination of the three. The Oppo BDP-83 has been reviewed online and there is a lot of information available.

I am not sure what you mean by claiming my comment "is utterly and ridiculously uncalled for". You have requested information and opinions on just about every player made over the last two years with I am sure over a thousand posts in hundreds of threads on the subject of your search for a Blu-ray player to replace your Panasonic DMP-BD10A. You are like the boy that cried wolf too many times. I would say my comment is right on the money. I won't bother to research further than I just did for your benefit, it is a waste of time. All I managed to do was offer questions worthy of research. I do think these two players are very good but pale in comparison to the Oppo BDP-83 in terms of value and formats handled. The Oppo BDP-83 beats either across the board is the quick conclusion I came to.

Chris

I am like the boy who cried wolf too many times? Wow. Utterly amazing. All because I want to be absolutely sure I get what I exactly need and want in the next player I choose -- and for that, I am constantly criticized and "made fun of" by comments like yours.

Your ignorance-induced response of "it would be a waste of time" regarding researching the players tells me everything I need to know about your character and intentions -- you claim I am the one crying wolf, yet your "help" and assistance seems to come with conditions...calling the kettle black, perhaps? For your information, disclosing this comparative information would NOT be wasting your time because I was the one who began the post interested in these three models sharing the ABT chip, and I would be extremely curious how they all stacked up against one another. You don't want to supply me the comparative information, fine; we can simply seek it out via discussions with others on the three.

Good for you, Chris! :yippee:

Of course. Good for Chris. And then someone in another couple of threads will simply bring up the "Chris is up on that soapbox again..." rhetoric and around and around we go...utterly fascinating that you can fan the flames of this debate without even knowing the true, utter background of it all.

Mr. G. has officially landed on my "ignore" list, so it doesn't really matter at this point.

When I started reseaching BD players I wanted exceptional DVD-V performance, SACD, DVD-A and exceptional Blu-ray performance on par with the high-end units. I also wanted to be able to bitstream Dolby TrueHD and DTS HD Master Audio along with easy menu navigation and set-up procedures, the Oppo BDP-83 fit the bill! You have to ask yourself Peter whether the Oppo BDP-83 fulfills your requirements, it either does or it does not. Seems simple enough don't you think?

If I remember correctly PFC5 mentioned that instead of going through the process of elimination you seem to be doing the exact opposite, instead you continue to ADD instead of eliminate. You know what, he was right! "Proofs in the pudding". :D

Why do you need to aggrevate an already hot, blistered issue? THIS is what I would supply to you as an answer to your private message question to me -- remember? The one about "harassment"? Take a big, deep whiff...

How so, you ask? Well, first of all, it's unnecessary to put things in THESE terms:

"Seems simple enough don't you think?

If I remember correctly PFC5 mentioned that instead of going through the process of elimination you seem to be doing the exact opposite, instead you continue to ADD instead of eliminate. You know what, he was right! "Proofs in the pudding"."

That was simply hurtful and unwarranted; I am not ADDING for the SAKE of adding players to the list, but I brought up this topic because it intrigued me that other players seem to be using the ABT chip and I assumed Oppo was the only player currently doing so. So, why is it so "abnormal" or "hurtful" to ask what the differences would be between these players being that they all carry this well regarded processing solution/scaler? I'm not trying to add these into my consideration mix just for the sake of doing so -- I TRULY want to know if the Denon and Marantz should be considered alongside the Oppo in terms of player choices if DVD upscaling is a premium desired feature, now that I have learned these two carry the ABT solution, even though they may be implemented in a different fashion.

Can't we just stick to that as a discussion blueprint -- just that instead of taking detours about "pudding proof" and "doesn't that make sense?" Let's talk about those two decks versus the Oppo.

Isn't that logical and acceptable?

Peter the problem people are having is that you have been asking this question for well over 1 year here alone and at other forums even before here. How many models by these companies have they changed since you started? I know Panasonic alone has gone from the BD30/BD50 when you started asking to the BD35/BD55, and now the BD60/80 models while you have still not bought. The same is true for other mfg models changing models multiple times as well during this time. I can understand if money is tight and you had to put off buying it, but you at one point were talking about spending $2,000.00+ for the top Denon model at the start.

I also know financial situations can change as well, but you have been on this quest for so long that none of the models originally researched and compared are even available anymore, and neither are the replacement models to those. So you should be able to understand WHY some are getting tired of going through this exercise for a third round of BD models I hope.

Things are changing fast (every 3-6 months with models) so there isn't much point in doing more research until you can financially afford to buy a new BD player AND are ready to buy it. THEN it would be time to start current research, but if you are going to wait another 3-12 months to actually buy a new BD player then the current models will likely ALL be discontinued models, so the research will just have to be done again then.

Now some of what you are asking and asked before was a benefit to others who have read those other (which BD player to buy) threads, so some good did come from it for them, but the models you did the research on last year are not even available anymore.

I want to remind others that when you give help to the poster asking the questions, you are also probably helping 100+ other people with similar questions who just read and never post so please feel free to provide info regardless of who is asking the question. ;)

The firmware update was very simple, I used a USB device as it's faster. The setup is very easy on the Oppo and everything is in plain english. The manual is just as easy to read, you really can't go wrong with the Oppo, it's proven itself since it's release!

Peter.. a while back you asked about setting up the oppo player.. here is a 10 minute video about setting it up. you might find this very helpful. a visual guide. it seems pretty simple really.

Jacob

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrEwkBwtP1k&feature=player_embedded

Peter, the simple answer is this - There is no current Blu-ray player that performs as well as the BDP-83 anywhere near it's price point. I even remember reading a professional review of a $5k player where the reviewer said he would/could not see the cost/benefit over the Oppo. Just because other brands may use ABT chips that doesn't mean it is the same chipset or implementation of such. And that is only the video side.

Add to that, Oppo has excellent customer support, where others may not and are slower in their response as well as having firmware updates readily available as soon as they are made aware of an issue.

Whether you believe it or not, it is a "no brainer" choice.

Peter, the simple answer is this - There is no current Blu-ray player that performs as well as the BDP-83 anywhere near it's price point. I even remember reading a professional review of a $5k player where the reviewer said he would/could not see the cost/benefit over the Oppo. Just because other brands may use ABT chips that doesn't mean it is the same chipset or implementation of such. And that is only the video side.

Add to that, Oppo has excellent customer support, where others may not and are slower in their response as well as having firmware updates readily available as soon as they are made aware of an issue.

Whether you believe it or not, it is a "no brainer" choice.

I guess if you buy either the Denon and/or the Marantz players you will be paying for the name and slow load times, there's only two manufacturers that have fast load times.

That's an excellent YouTube video of the Oppo in action navigating the menus and setup options!

Peter the problem people are having is that you have been asking this question for well over 1 year here alone and at other forums even before here.

I even went out of my way for you on Buy-ray.com trying to really help you finely make a decision 81 Replies later, here you are starting all over again. How can you not understand how frustrating it is for most of us? History will repeat itself just as it has for over 1 year. I'm not trying to hurt your feelings, I guess I just don't understand where we are going with this...

Blu-ray.com Page 2 > Given These Criteria, Can You Recommend a Player?

I think when it comes to the Oppo, things are pretty much set in stone, at the price-point, I guess until King Arthur comes along and pulls out the sword.

This comes from reviews and evaluations well beyond the scope and expertise of just this forum since the introduction of BDP-83.

Of course, no one player can necessarily be everything to everyone, but I believe this one comes damn close compared with anything else out there.

at this rate.. I probably will get the oppo bluray player before peter does.

Jacob

I think when it comes to the Oppo, things are pretty much set in stone, at the price-point, I guess until King Arthur comes along and pulls out the sword.

This comes from reviews and evaluations well beyond the scope and expertise of just this forum since the introduction of BDP-83.

Of course, no one player can necessarily be everything to everyone, but I believe this one comes damn close compared with anything else out there.

"I would bet my bottom dollar on the fact that the D&M players will not be a better performer than the Oppo BDP-83."

"I would bet my bottom dollar on the fact that the D&M players will not be a better performer than the Oppo BDP-83."

They are absolutely not...

They are absolutely not...

Even the expensive Denon player couldn't outperform the Oppo in DVD-V and Blu-ray performance, even with Denon being one of the top manufacuturers of AV gear! Denon figured if their video performance would be equaled to another manufacturer, Denon had to give people another reason to buy their player. The analog audio section had to rival any and all that's out there to give them the edge. The analog audio performance is it's biggest selling point!

Sometimes attempts at improvements are met with diminishing returns, no matter how much money you expect people to pay for them.
I am not surprised this happened, it was a matter of time. Imagine having the reputation of offering 'premium' products for a long time, then have something come along for half the price perform equally or even better. And a solid design, not a copy or re-branded.

Even the expensive Denon player couldn't outperform the Oppo in DVD-V and Blu-ray performance, even with Denon being one of the top manufacuturers of AV gear! Denon figured if their video performance would be equaled to another manufacturer, Denon had to give people another reason to buy their player. The analog audio section had to rival any and all that's out there to give them the edge. The analog audio performance is it's biggest selling point!

And the Oppo stands right next to it in the audio section as well...