High Def Forum - Your High Definition Community & High Definition Resource - View Single Post - tigerbangs prescription for deep fringe reception

zenbig42 · 02-01-2007, 01:28 PM

Greetings, new here. After reading many recommendation...thanks tigerbangs, rick, many others for relating your experience and advice!

I live in area where problems are like deep-fringe, but I think mountains are problem, not distance.

My question is what antenna (UHF) do you think is best for dealing with multi-path in weak signal area?

Here's my situation:
Zip 05674, (Latitude = 44.1064, Longitude = -72.8914) in the mountains, elev 1600'. 29 miles from transmitters. All digital channels I want are co-located on Mt. Mansfield (at ~3800' elev). System: samsung 4092 tv, dish vip622 receiver, antenna radio shack vu90-xr, 10' mast on roof ridge ~40 feet above ground, channel master 7778 pre-amp (using combined UHF/VHF input, yes I tried checking/switching the internal switch), rg6 (~80', properly grounded, direct to tv tuner). We have DishNetwork, which carries locals, but not in HD. (and they are the worst of any of the SD channels!). Four local channels are now broadcasting OTA HD in digital (at Mt. Mansfield).

Antenna_web says I should only get one analog channel (wcax ch3). this one comes in fine, with some minimal ghosting, but of course I'm looking for the digital signals. I've tried a number of different antennas with varying results. I can reliably get one channel (wvny-dt on ch13-vhf), though I can most often lock on the 3 other digital channels (all on UHF 14, 32, 53), but the signal strength (using on-screen samsung meter) fluctuates (usually 3-4 bars out of 10) and I get frequent pixelation and dropouts so the channels are unwatchable for 75% of the time, I get the rare moments or hours when I can direct the antenna (very slight aiming adjustment) and get to watch the channel I want for a bit. Again, the exception is the my sole VHF digital channel 13 wvny which is solid (but still only 3-4 strength). I have the antenna hooked directly to the TV ant input, as the samsung tuner deals with the weak signals I have much better. the dish vip622 doesn't recognize (with a scan) any of the other channels other than the ch13 wvny.

I've also tried these antennas: CM 4228, the AntennasDirect 43XG, and the larger Radio Shack vu-190. But none have been able to improve my results. I have used lots of patience and plenty of experimentation (with and with out pre-amp for each; careful aiming, adjusting both the height of the antenna and the physical location on the roof). I was really surpised that I actually get better reception (on uhf channels) with the radio shack vu90xr than with the CM 4228, b/c the 4228 is recommended in so many places online, in discussion forums, and hdtvprimer.com as the solution for both fringe and multipath problems.

Even though my antenna is high, the hill I am on slopes gently up in the direction of the towers (adding yet another obstruction) and the trees are higher (nearest at 50' and they are spruce with needles all year). There are numerous mountains that block line-of-sight to towers. I thought the nearby trees might be the problem, but then I tried the CM 4228 near the top of one of these spruce trees up about 60' off ground - nothing in front of the antenna (yeah, my wife that experiment...LOL!) in calm clear weather and did not get any improvement with this installation over the same antenna on the roof. In the tree, I had a clear view (no trees) of the nearest horizon, the top of my local hill, about 1000' feet away, my rg6 run was about 200' total to tv in this set-up.

This has me thinking that in addition to having weak signal (blocked by mountains), and that the other analog channels I get have moderate to severe ghosting that multipath is the other problem, not the trees near my house.

The most frustrating part is that I KNOW we have some signal here, but its either just too weak, too much multipath, or not the right antenna (or all the above!) I am thinking about trying next the XG91 or CM 3023 (same as CM 4248) antenna. I am also considering the 16-bay CM 4228 solution (on hdtvprimer.com), but am sketptical of this since the 4228 hasn't really performed for me, and there are lots of caveats with this custom solution. I realize nothing may work any better and that I'm SOL in my area (or have to live with just one OTA HD channel), but any advice or recommendations about this situation would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time.

02-01-2007, 01:28 PM	#146
zenbig42 My plasma is High Def. Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 5	Antenna recommendation Greetings, new here. After reading many recommendation...thanks tigerbangs, rick, many others for relating your experience and advice! I live in area where problems are like deep-fringe, but I think mountains are problem, not distance. My question is what antenna (UHF) do you think is best for dealing with multi-path in weak signal area? Here's my situation: Zip 05674, (Latitude = 44.1064, Longitude = -72.8914) in the mountains, elev 1600'. 29 miles from transmitters. All digital channels I want are co-located on Mt. Mansfield (at ~3800' elev). System: samsung 4092 tv, dish vip622 receiver, antenna radio shack vu90-xr, 10' mast on roof ridge ~40 feet above ground, channel master 7778 pre-amp (using combined UHF/VHF input, yes I tried checking/switching the internal switch), rg6 (~80', properly grounded, direct to tv tuner). We have DishNetwork, which carries locals, but not in HD. (and they are the worst of any of the SD channels!). Four local channels are now broadcasting OTA HD in digital (at Mt. Mansfield). Antenna_web says I should only get one analog channel (wcax ch3). this one comes in fine, with some minimal ghosting, but of course I'm looking for the digital signals. I've tried a number of different antennas with varying results. I can reliably get one channel (wvny-dt on ch13-vhf), though I can most often lock on the 3 other digital channels (all on UHF 14, 32, 53), but the signal strength (using on-screen samsung meter) fluctuates (usually 3-4 bars out of 10) and I get frequent pixelation and dropouts so the channels are unwatchable for 75% of the time, I get the rare moments or hours when I can direct the antenna (very slight aiming adjustment) and get to watch the channel I want for a bit. Again, the exception is the my sole VHF digital channel 13 wvny which is solid (but still only 3-4 strength). I have the antenna hooked directly to the TV ant input, as the samsung tuner deals with the weak signals I have much better. the dish vip622 doesn't recognize (with a scan) any of the other channels other than the ch13 wvny. I've also tried these antennas: CM 4228, the AntennasDirect 43XG, and the larger Radio Shack vu-190. But none have been able to improve my results. I have used lots of patience and plenty of experimentation (with and with out pre-amp for each; careful aiming, adjusting both the height of the antenna and the physical location on the roof). I was really surpised that I actually get better reception (on uhf channels) with the radio shack vu90xr than with the CM 4228, b/c the 4228 is recommended in so many places online, in discussion forums, and hdtvprimer.com as the solution for both fringe and multipath problems. Even though my antenna is high, the hill I am on slopes gently up in the direction of the towers (adding yet another obstruction) and the trees are higher (nearest at 50' and they are spruce with needles all year). There are numerous mountains that block line-of-sight to towers. I thought the nearby trees might be the problem, but then I tried the CM 4228 near the top of one of these spruce trees up about 60' off ground - nothing in front of the antenna (yeah, my wife that experiment...LOL!) in calm clear weather and did not get any improvement with this installation over the same antenna on the roof. In the tree, I had a clear view (no trees) of the nearest horizon, the top of my local hill, about 1000' feet away, my rg6 run was about 200' total to tv in this set-up. This has me thinking that in addition to having weak signal (blocked by mountains), and that the other analog channels I get have moderate to severe ghosting that multipath is the other problem, not the trees near my house. The most frustrating part is that I KNOW we have some signal here, but its either just too weak, too much multipath, or not the right antenna (or all the above!) I am thinking about trying next the XG91 or CM 3023 (same as CM 4248) antenna. I am also considering the 16-bay CM 4228 solution (on hdtvprimer.com), but am sketptical of this since the 4228 hasn't really performed for me, and there are lots of caveats with this custom solution. I realize nothing may work any better and that I'm SOL in my area (or have to live with just one OTA HD channel), but any advice or recommendations about this situation would be greatly appreciated. Thanks for your time.